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I believe it might been even older, Ken. Looks koshi zori to me. That's why I advised Steve to keep it until better can be said. If it can be saved, it looks very promising.

I’m really interested. Tell us if there’s any frosting or if it can still be removed easily.

Steve, I really don’t know how many people have asked to buy it. But since in another thread we’re speaking about selling and honesty, I wouldn’t accept offers now if I were you. As Has been said, it may just be too far gone and a piece of junk. I think it’s worth much better than that if salvaged. The shape is really good but yes, the pittings and active rust are worrisome. If you don’t have the money for a full polish, have at least a window opened. Then better knowledgeable people will tell you if it’s worth it or not. Even opening a window will cost a little money, but that is a bet that may pay off in the end. If it doesn’t, well, you’ll have to suck it up, but at least you’ll know. ... and if it’s worth it and you don’t have the money for a full polish, at least preserve it. Oil it regularly to stop the rust and deterioration from spreading more. And save little by little for that polish. Never mind if it takes years, anyway this sword has been waiting untended until now. A few more years won’t change that much.

George, We all experienced what happened the other time. It’s left bruises, more than What shows on the board, and I was one of the targets for a moment. But why not say this is water under the bridge and start over as if nothing had happened, this is an entertaining subject, it shows the diversity of ideas on this board and all of them feel legit to me. And it’s really interesting to see how we all have a different approach to the subject, the money, the knowledge, the way of learning, all this tempered by opportunities we create or experience. Let’s be positive! 🍻

Now, I would buy it for that price!

Personally, I think that sugata looks extremely promising. If I were you, I’d do as Brian says. Take it to a member near you for expertise and if he thinks it is salvageable (I believe it is), then you may have something of value here.

Well, best of luck with your sale, then! That’s one hell of a sword here!

You are both correct. But I don’t think I’m the same kind of collector as you are. You obviously are art collectors. I am not. I’m a history collector. For me, what the sword has been through is as important, even more important than its quality. I see a lot of Juyo swords on the web. They are beautiful, but are they really that more beautiful? What makes the difference is who made the,, who possessed it, etc... and let’s face it, you never see a Juyo that belonged to Samurai X, it’s always a great warrior, a Daimyo, from a great name... To me, it doesn’t matter that much. When I teach history at school, I always like to try and establish a relationship between my students and History . I show Them objects, tell them everyday life stories of that time. I try and make History alive by mixing it with Storytelling. I think that when a link is established, things get more personal and relatable. For me, swords are the same. I’m a dreamer. I far prefer a simple koshirae with iron fittings to a gilded, adorned Tsuba and saya. Those speak more of everyday's life, of Everyman. But don’t you think that this is the beauty of a hobby? We are all here, sharing the same love for swords, but for different reasons. You get to meet people with an incredible knowledge in art, or steel properties, or the knowledge of stamps for the WW2 collector. This is just like being a kid in a candy store here. Everyone can get his helping of his favorite sweet and compare. This is also why we need to respect everyone's view or opinion here. No one is right or wrong, we all see different perspectives of a same passion.

I can go with that, Ray, I was just thinking investment in a monetary way when it’s also investment in learning, in a passion. That is absolutely correct. And you are right. So far, my meager collection is more and more a case of selection. But I think that one of the most important incentive is in fact something that isn’t related to knowledge or money (though both are necessary to achieve it): purpose. I started collecting haphazardly, buying, as you said, "what I liked". Until I saw what Jean and you had achieved, which gave a purpose to my collection. I will never be able to afford Juyo material, nor do I really care. Jean wanted to have an example of each tradition, you have a collection that covers the whole sword history spectrum. Now, what I’m striving to do modestly is something like that, a sword from roughly every period or typical of an era. I’m almost there. It won’t be THE collection, just mine, but the purpose has given it a way to follow. I enjoy it for what it is. I’m missing the earliest parts (I will never be able to afford Heian , Kamakura and Nanbokucho, but I’d be satisfied with an ō-suriage transitional Bizen Kamakura/Nanbokucho) but I’ll save it as the last because I don’t know how I will ever afford it.

See, Jean, that’s why we should always check after auto correct. mon was unknown and the damn machine corrected it to mom. 🤣 Well, that was funny, so I’ll keep it as is!

Ray, That was a very interesting post and I’m eager to read more. However, we have a main point of disagreement about investment. You make it clear in your book and I know a lot of people agree on that point . I collect other stuff than swords, much less expensive and see also many collectors with "investment" in mind. That is really something I don’t share. For me, a collection is first and foremost a hobby and a pleasure. In my other collecting area, sculpting is important. Although my family situation prevents me from sculpting anymore, I was rather good at it. Some people were as or more talented than me and did sculpts they sold for $100. Now, these weren’t the original sculpts but casts from the original. I always thought they were thieves. I was doing the same, selling casts, at cost for $25, shipping included worldwide and was still making 5 to 10 dollars. The reason for this example? For me, this was a hobby, not a run for money. I consider that when a hobby becomes a business, you change. You don’t do it anymore for pleasure but in your head, even if the pleasure is still there, it also becomes a financial issue. I'm not an advanced, knowledgeable collector as you know. I won’t ever have the money you have spent in swords. I would probably lose some if I sold my swords or just come out even, but that’s not important. I did get them because of love, and frankly, selling even my first mistake would feel like parting with a side of myself. We learn from our mistakes. That first mistake is here, with me, as a constant reminder, and never mind if that sword was just a run down Showato. I still love it because when I hold it, it reminds me what I felt that day when I got it. I was Indiana Jones with the Grail in his hands. Memories don’t have a price. Money has to be secondary to a passion.

Phewwww! Deal of the year. For that price, I’ll take two! ... except it’s just one of a kind... I'd cry "BANZAIIIIIIIIII !" But it’s more likely: "BONSAIIIIIII !" 🤣

Oooooh, Jean, selling your last jewel? I thought that was the only one you meant to keep.

I only have a Kai Gunto koshirae with tsunagi and it happens to be one with a mom on the Menuki, so maybe not that rare after all...

I believe it is Shinshinto.

Knowing the particulars of the case, I’m on John's side here. Once a seller has agreed to a deal, it should be respected, and trying to keep the deposit is just shady. I guess sellers are great until, for a reason, something goes wrong and then they show the worst part of their nature. I’m sure Aoi is a great site, and has made and will make people happy for years to come, but beware the day something goes wrong. That said, it could be true of any transaction I guess...

Happy for you and the buyer, Julien👍

I like that one, thank you Brian! EDIT: just one little detail but perhaps it’s something I’m doing wrong. In the Dark Theme, the PMs letters become a very light grey, very hard to read (at least for my aging eagle eyes:) ). Any way to correct this?

...and the missing one, posted from the USA April 24 arrived yesterday!

Josh, more pictures should include a whole view of the naked blade (step on a chair and try to capture it completely without the image being skewed), close ups of the Hamon if there is one and, like Jean, I’m curious to see if the machi and ha notch do align. It’s a red flag as it generally indicates a Chinese copy when they don’t.

that is a great idea. I’ll see if Amazon.fr has one. Thank you. maybe you’re right Dave, but I don’t know if if did it differently from the ones you showed but my glue was rather thick and there’s no way it could have dripped as the ones in your examples. I applied it very thin with a very small paintbrush (01), smoothed the areas with my wet finger to remover potential lumps and joined the two halves that I pressed with the paper bands method. After half an hour, out of curiosity, I tried prying them open to no avail. Also, before working, I used a piece of wood to stir the glue (and add a few drops of clove oil), and left a big lump of glue on it afterward to check the drying process. It been 4 hours+ now and it is hard as hell, thoroughly dry. I've tried to put the sword in. No residue and good fit. Yet, you are right, there may still be moisture in and better safe than sorry, so I’ll wait one or two more days. Thanks. Yet y

Operation glue carried out! Worked perfectly well. Dried in about half an hour but I plan to leave the blade out until tomorrow.

Excellent idea, Barry, thank you! you're probably right, Dave. Still they really applied too much and it was very liquid. Bah! Who looks into saya anyway! 🤣

Hey Adam, here’s the recipe: Now, I’ve found an old thread saying that moistening the old glue with hot water and pressing the two halves together worked by reactivating the old glue. I’ll try that first if there is enough left. Otherwise, I’ll use my glue. one thing I’ll add to the video is don’t hesitate to add a little more water to thin the glue because it is really thick and you don’t want chunks in it.

I think Adam is right. The mountings, at least are fake. The blade, I need to see more but if one is fake, the other probably is too.