Increasing Gold Membership numbers?

[Guest When Necessary]

How about a 'Lock Thread' button so all goldmembers can play God equally?

[PNSSHOGUN]

Samurai related titles or cosmetic options could be good, something fun and low effort. 

[Brian]

I have made some changes to those titles, especially the higher tiers. I may adjust them as I learn what the caste system involved. Just a bit of fun.\

Unfortunately Gold member takeup is still very slow and although I am looking at other things, I have to give more incentive to upgrade.
Private message storage limit for regular members is now down from 150 to 100 conversations. Gold members are allowed 500.
I think 100 conversations is more than enough for most people, and if people clean up their inbox they should be fine. But if anyone needs more, Gold membership is a vast increase.
I am going to fine tune a few other things. Upload limit/size is already much higher for Gold members. So the 3 meg per post limit is easily increased if people need it by taking Gold.

[Rivkin]

In the old times some forums would offer a physical "forum pin" for premier members to wear at sword shows etc..

[Guest When Necessary]

8 minutes ago, Rivkin said:

In the old times some forums would offer a physical "forum pin" for premier members to wear at sword shows etc..

This is the pin the NBTHK used to give members. I always thought it looked extremely cheesy and never wore it, even at kantei-kai. 

[kissakai]

Not sure if this has been mentioned earlier but only gold members can offer items for sale but anyone can buy

 

[Brian]

That would be a bot mean to those who only want to sell an item or 2...and probably reduce the number of people selling, which is a bit drawcard here. It would be an obvious move to increase numbers, but I don't think I want to go that far. May have to limit the number of listings though. But need to figure out how to manage that in the software. Can't monitor it manually.
Need to do something though, as it is verrrry slow currently and we've gone backwards in terms of funds. But still ok.
Still considering options. No take ups on the month-to month option, so we have to look elsewhere.

No serious requests for increased upload sizes or resolution yet. Pm limits, we'll see if that has any effect.
A private mei/oshigata database is set up, but would take a looong time for people to populate it with mei that are shoshin, so it would be a long term thing. But probably worth doing. 
How to select the main smiths to start with is difficult, and then we can branch off to the other smiths.
Maybe separate military guys from the pre-WW2 smiths?

[Charliebrown]

Hi all!

 

Hope everyone is well! 

I thought it would be great if paid members can get together as a community.

 

[For Example]

 

Private Groups: 

Create exclusive discussion areas for paying members to interact with each other and the forum's experts in a more intimate setting. 

Courses and Live Streams: 

Develop and host courses or offer live-streamed events to provide high-value educational content to your paid subscribers. 

 

Also, there are many experts in this community and forums that might want to share their ideas and studies.

(Plus people like me might want to know more and learn more) 

 

Have a good one!!

 

[Brian]

I wonder if there are any video recorded lectures or presentations given anywhere by any of the societies or members that they would be willing to share?
I don't know how freely they would want to share them, but if there are any, can someone pm me maybe? Would be nice to have an area, maybe for certain members, where these can be downloaded or viewed.

[Hoshi]

Hi, 

 

A blessing for the forum would be to ruthlessly filter out the low-effort "I found this on EBAY is it good should I buy it?"

 

 

These posts are polluting general and nihonto section. 

 

Some visitors just throw crap at the wall to see what sticks and abuse the kindness of people here. And these people don't contribute anything of value, not even a gold badge. 

 

I would in fact make a section called "identification" and limit posts to 1 sword per visitor, and after that it's a 200$/year. That will keep the noise the down. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Scogg]

Those “Is this eBay sword good?” posts belong in the ‘Auctions and Online Sales’ section so the rest of the forum stays focused. We usually move them when we see them, but some members repeatedly post in the wrong place despite being reminded and redirected over and over. 

 

The real concern, in my opinion, is when the forum is repeatedly treated as a free consultation service for someone’s resale efforts, with no contribution or appreciation in return. I thinks that’s what’s really going on in some cases. 

 

If someone is genuinely interested in Japanese swords or wanting to buy something, those identification posts are welcome and help keep the community active. But when the post is in the wrong section and solely for profit rather than learning, it starts to feel like the forum is being taken advantage of.

 

That all being said, is it against the rules? Not necessarily, I don’t think, but that’s for Brian to decide. It’s just unethical and it always feels bad to be used.

 

Just my personal view.

Sincerely,

-Sam 

 

ps. I’ll try to be more vigilant about relocating the eBay type posts to the auction section 

[PNSSHOGUN]

Well put Sam, the serial offender(s) should honestly be ashamed at this point. If common decency is completely lacking, many would welcome moderator action.

[Brian]

I am always hesitant to make changes that affect others that aren't so..."oblivious"
But seems something may need to be done in this case. Hmmm.
A membership would at least have been appropriate a while ago. Especially considering the hosts just advised me now we are almost up to our 125 GIG allocation, and I'm going to have to buy more server space.
Sigh.
Still....125 Gigs of images here is quite something. Try publish THAT as a book 

[George KN]

8 hours ago, Hoshi said:

A blessing for the forum would be to ruthlessly filter out the low-effort "I found this on EBAY is it good should I buy it?"

Just being the devils advocate, as I suspect this may have been prompted by a few specific posts I haven't read yet, but imposing restrictions on new members specifically would likely limit the first time buyer > enthusiastic novice > actually learning about nihonto > later being able to contribute in return pipeline.

Speaking from my own experience, if I hadn't been able to post pre-auction questions when I was starting out, I'd not only have a tonne of rubbish swords, but I probably wouldn't have been compelled to get membership later.

I don't understand why people don't say please or thank you though

[Bruce Pennington]

Yes, and it's how I get a ton of stuff for my charts, too!  Ha!  But I understand what you guys are getting at.

 

I don't mind the posts, as my hobby has morphed into just being here to help new guys with their questions.  If we don't allow that, we just become an insular bubble of old farts incestuously wallowing in our own stuff.  It's like having a "City name" Japanese Sword Club that only allows people to show up if they join first.  

 

But I totally get Brian's problem with growing data needs and less than matching memberships/donations.  Tough problem, for sure.  NMB is like a public library where people can go to look up stuff and learn, yet needing the financial support to keep it open.  It is a struggle all non-profits and not-for-profits constantly deal with.

[Hokke]

1 hour ago, George KN said:

....... imposing restrictions on new members specifically would likely limit the first time buyer > enthusiastic novice > actually learning about nihonto > later being able to contribute in return pipeline.

I have given this some thought and I think I have to disagree, at least with regard to a fee for mei translation, which I regard as a potential primary revenue source for the forum.  First, let's address the very basic types of nihonto owner/purchaser. 

 

First we have the one who found or was gifted granddad's sword, who is looking to sell it, period. No interest other than revenue. A fee for the identification of the mei is appropriate and would be nominal, say $5. They pay, they sell and then they never dip their toe in our pool again, easy peasy. They win and the forum wins by gaining operational revenue. If you believe providing this information for free will somehow "convert" someone into an enthusiast.......I dont see it. But if you add up all the accounts that have been created and only have one post or many posts but ONLY for mei identification and multiply that by a factor of five.........

 

Then we have those like most here. They caught the bug for whatever reason and are actively looking to enter in to the world as a hobby. They come to the forum, ask questions and show an interest by attempting to contribute where possible. The more time they spend here the more information that are exposed to, accessing years and years of collected discussions.....for free, like a library, which is how I regard this place and why I have participated in heated discussions with those who sought to turn it into a ego club. 

 

The key here, as I see it, is how to determine when someone has participated enough to demonstrate a genuine interest this hobby. This would be a badge that would exempt them from the mei translation fee. The easiest way to achieve this as I see it, other than adding it to the perk list of a gold membership, is to use the system already in place. This forum uses the reputation system and new mods have recently been assigned to sections. While I may not agree with all mod actions, I have not seen any overstep or blatant bias. All mods that I have seen are long time contributors and relatively knowledgable. So, I would suggest that in addition to the emojis everyone has access to, that there be a specific emoji or other marker only available to mods and admin. This marker is only given to new members when they contribute productively in the eyes of the mods and admin. Perhaps all new members are given a "prospective member" status until they reach a predetermined marker number showing they have contributed enough to achieve "full member" status. The consequence of this status is the forum has now added a contributing member and that member is now exempt from the mei identification fee. 

 

With regards to the mei identification fee, the only hiccup I see is that a fee can only really be charged if the identification is absolute. This is regarding actual physical mei and of course has nothing to do with determination of gimei. If there is question as to accuracy based on the mei condition or picture quality, a full fee should not be imposed. Perhaps there should be a two tier translation fee. One price for a full translation and one price for a "probable" translation. 

[kissakai]

I'll re-raise my earlier point

Only gold members can post items for sale

 

 

[Scogg]

Facebook and Reddit will always be free. So if the NMB were to charge for services like translating or listing items, people would simply have no reason to do those things here.
I hate to go there… but what then happens when AI figures out mei to a reliable degree? 

 

Additionally, I would hate to see the NMB be flooded with complicated little transactions for this or that; when it’s supposed to be an accessible resource for like minded people. 
 

The finances are one thing. Otherwise the translations and sales are very rarely a problem, with the exception of a select few repeat offenders who abuse the service.

 

I don’t have the answers; but funding for the board just needs careful consideration, IMO

[Alex A]

11 hours ago, Hoshi said:

Hi, 

 

A blessing for the forum would be to ruthlessly filter out the low-effort "I found this on EBAY is it good should I buy it?"

 

 

These posts are polluting general and nihonto section. 

 

Some visitors just throw crap at the wall to see what sticks and abuse the kindness of people here. And these people don't contribute anything of value, not even a gold badge. 

 

I would in fact make a section called "identification" and limit posts to 1 sword per visitor, and after that it's a 200$/year. That will keep the noise the down. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Coming from someone in October placed an advertisement in the wanted section for crappy swords.

 

Jeez, the hypocrisy here is off the scale. 

[ROKUJURO]

I understand the problem and will apply for gold.

But as mentioned above, what to do with these: 

 

[Scogg]

Poor forum manners are to be expected from time to time, and situations like that are usually best handled collectively, either by choosing not to engage or by reminding the poster that a little courtesy goes a long way.

 

I also try to give new members some grace, since navigating these forums can take a bit of getting used to.

 

What concerns me more are the repeat offenders who continue the same behavior despite guidance. 

[John C]

I'm sure there is a good reason for not using advertising as a revenue source. But I have seen several sites where membership (gold in this case) is ad free, while visiting is not. Is that an option?

 

John C.

[Brian]

I have looked at advertising, and have been playing with placement and it is ready to go anytime. The problem is twofold. Would dealers be willing to pay for it? And #2...the logical thing is to say that Gold membership exempts people from having to see ads. That is easy to do. But if many of the Gold members are serious collectors and the target market, would advertisers not be against a system where paid membership exempts the very market they are trying to reach? It's a problem in my mind.

As far as charging a small fee for some translations, my issue with that is that I am indebted to the members here who do those translations. We have many skilled, helpful members here who give of their time and effort to do these translations. The problem is that if we were using this as a revenue stream, from my own morals, I'd want to give back to those guys. They do this largely without any reward at all. But if the forum is making something from it...however small, I would feel obligated to try and give back to those guys. And how do we do that? How do we judge who puts in more effort or who is more accurate or who spends more time on them?
It's a morality issue for me, and I already battle with feeling like I don't give back enough to the guys who assist here with info constantly.

 

[robinalexander]

3 hours ago, Brian said:

They do this largely without any reward at all. But if the forum is making something from it...however small, I would feel obligated to try and give back to those guys. And how do we do that? How do we judge who puts in more effort or who is more accurate or who spends more time on them?
It's a morality issue for me, and I already battle with feeling like I don't give back enough to the guys who assist here with info constantly.

I recall paying a third party for the translation of my first surrender tag.  It was a small amount, from memory around $4 USD but I was so happy to pay and receive.

 

Then I 'discovered' NMB and we all know how easy it is to get a bona-fide translation (or honest opinion) on almost anything  for no direct cost.

 

 I agree, It's gets tricky when you involve (valued/giving) members in an NMB financial arrangement but it is to the benefit of all members.

 

Soo ... maybe identify those translators, we know who they are, and consult with them privately.

 

If you do go down the 'fee for translation path', there is nothing to stop you simply reviewing the arrangement 12 months down the track or earlier if necessary.

 

If things go awry in the mean time, review it at that time.

 

Imo a good idea.

 

Rob

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Lewis B]

Why not offer the contributing members who provide translation assistance (its not difficult to figure out who they are) complimentary Gold level status. This acknowledges their invaluable contribution without a lot of fanfare. 

[vajo]

15 hours ago, kissakai said:

I'll re-raise my earlier point

Only gold members can post items for sale

 

 

 

Make it even more valuable. Only Gold members can buy and sell.
(Revelation of John 13:17)

Edited 18 hours ago by vajo

[kissakai]

I think any NMB member can buy, this way the (gold) seller will have a larger pool to sell there items

 

[vajo]

1 hour ago, kissakai said:

I think any NMB member can buy, this way the (gold) seller will have a larger pool to sell there items

 

 

And why shouldn't "regular" members be allowed to offer anything anymore? They usually support the board with sales or donate proceeds.

[Brian]

Guys, before we get carried away, I have no plans on charging for listing or buying. It's tempting, but that is one of our strengths and I think it generally works well.
Maybe I can look at a system where a person gets a badge if they have done X number of successful sales, so that they have somewhat of a "verified" badge that sets others at ease, but that we'll look at later.
I've just bumped up the hosting with more webspace. Just means the bill in a week or 2 will take all of the Gunto proceeds that is up for auction currently, but at least we won't run out of space.
Advertising will likely happen, nothing too intrusive.
Guys who take advantage of the services here like translations...well the board is self regulating, and as you can see they get called out. Nothing I need to do...you guys handle it for me :-)
 

[Scogg]

I am hoping that the gunto auction starts a small trend. 

If we can get a donation or two a year, to auction off, that could be pretty good money for the board. 

We'll see how it goes!
One week left for bidding.
-Sam