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Sword for "left handed Samurai"


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Hi,

 

I just came across this ebay listing where the seller claims that due to the location of the menukis this sword was made for a left handed samurai. I have never heard about it but would not classify it as nonsense either (it could make sense). Can anyone confirm that the location of the menukis eventually indicates whether the original ower was a left or right handed samurai?

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/TAMBA-NO-KAMI-YOSHI ... dZViewItem

 

Stephan

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That is called Gyaku-Menuki (逆目貫), not for left-handed samurai.

An additional benefit of the Menuki 目貫 placement of Tachi 太刀 was the better grip on the Tsuka 柄, since the Menuki 目貫 filled the gap in the palm of the hand. On Uchigatana 打刀, Gyaku-Menuki 逆目貫 (“reversed Menuki 目貫”), or Menuki目貫 placed in ergonomically correct position, so to speak, were almost exclusively found on Yagyű-Koshirae 柳生拵.

Ref. The Mountings of Japanese Swords

http://www.arscives.com/historysteel/ja ... rticle.htm

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I do know (being clever and stuff) that left handed-ness was not tolerated in Japanese schools until quite recently. Very similar to my home country were my father continually entertains the family with stories of how boys and girls in school got their knuckles wrapped with a ruler if they used their left hand to write.

 

I could be wrong, so if anyone finds this all too much to swallow please let me know.

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I do know (being clever and stuff) that left handed-ness was not tolerated in Japanese schools until quite recently. [...] I could be wrong, so if anyone finds this all too much to swallow please let me know.

 

My wife is 33 years old, Japanese, and had same experience at school when she was a child, when writing calligraphy. She is not left handed but a school mate of her same class was.

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I know it doesnt prove anything but in the film "When the last sword is drawn" one of the main characters is left handed and it is refered to in the plot. May be pure fantasy but it seemed fairly matter of fact.

Of course being left handed in no way influences my view

Paul (lefty)b

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In all of my years of collecting I've only seen one Daishô that was obviously made for being worn on the right side (at least judging from the Kurigata); it had Tokubetsu Hozon Tôsôgu papers, a very good quality Handachi Daishô, belonging to one of the dealers of the group Bob Hughes is a member of, too (a Mr. Ii???). I believe it was on display at the 2007 DTI.

 

In any case, as was pointed out already, left-handedness was "strongly discouraged" to say the least. IMO it was rather made for a one-armed Samurai than a lefty.

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Samurai walked tending to the left of the roads/paths. Thus the scabbard would never click together with that of a stranger. Even today, knocking shoulders or bumping someone in public is considered the height of bad manners and can lead to violence if the apology is not accepted.

 

For this reason, even if there were indeed left-handed Samurai, (one-armed for example I can understand) they would have been presented with a serious dilemma out of doors, necessitating some special design to get around the carrying problem.

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Hi,

 

Today, in iaido, left hander or right hander both used right hand ton hold the tsuka.

Moreover, if a left hander carry his sword on the right side, does that mean that kirukata too is on the opposite side on the saya ... ? :crazy:

 

Sebastien

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In many counties left handed children were/are forced to use their right hand quite recently :(

 

Fortunately I'm both handed (could use sword left and gun right) so its an interesting topic for me. But I'm neither a shooter nor a swordsman... :lol:

When I try to build a DIY koshirae, should I do it in traditional manner or a left handed version for me :roll: ...?

 

What is the reason for the traditional placement on a katana tsuka, if it's more practical for a left handed person?

Not "form follows function"?

 

And from an individual point of view - a left handed swordsman trained to fight against right handed opponents could have an advantage against a right handed person only trained to fight with other right handers...?

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Good Evening all,

 

Just picked up on this thread, and Moriyama san's observations about reversed menuki.

 

In support of his opinion, I draw your attention to Tozando Budogu's Yagyu Koshirae Iai-To with "Sakasa Menuki"

(Reversed position according to: the document of the historical Yagyu diary (sic)

 

http://www.tozandoshop.com/Yagyu_Koshir ... 6-s106.htm

 

 

Cheers

 

 

Malcolm

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  • 3 months later...

Right and left-handed iaidoka wear the sword on their left side. For the initial cut, the sword is in the right hand, BUT, the left hand is JUST (some say more) as important as the right. In iaido, the saya is removed from the blade, not the sword taken from the saya, left and right sides of the body are equally important. My teacher (22 years of practice) asked his Sensei when he first started, if being left-handed would be a disadvantage, Sensei told him that it is an advantage.

 

btw: the overhead cut is done with both hands, with the left hand providing 80% of the power.

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  • 4 weeks later...

Gyaku menuki always made much more sense to me ergonomically, although I prefer normal menuki visually. I never knew however that they were virtually limited to Yagyu koshirae, that's interesting. Dr. T has a related article (related to menuki placement, I mean, not left-handedness).

 

Very interesting that left-handedness seems to be so globally discouraged through history. Perhaps because it's an automatic minority regardless of other demographics? Not one of humanity's nobler track records it seems.

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  • 2 weeks later...

I had a teacher in elementary school who did a peace corps type thing and spent some time in Ghana. The left hand was the "bathroom" hand and therefore it was rude to use that hand with someone else. You were supposed to take something with the right hand then put it in your left. They would slap a student's hand with a ruler if he used his left. So there is a rationale behind it and in what we know about today/how disease is passed, it totally makes sense. As much as you may not like it... ass to mouth is how a lot of germs are spread. Although, as a lefty I find it horrible, we have feelings too you know! Good thing lefties are smart and can use both sides of their brain. I write with my left but play most sports with my right. Bowling and darts are 2 sports I am not sure which hand to use. I do remember seeing I think it was on ebay a sword setup for a lefty. It wasn't a tachi koshorie so it had to be worn for a lefty and was the only way it was to be worn facing down.

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  • 3 weeks later...

the samurai were all conformists as are most older Japanese even today rules must be followed without question so all trained and fought right handed there were no one armed samurai they were just Dead one armed samurai the misplacement of menuki is a chinese thing on the swords on Ebay and some bigger manufacturors were if you notice the chinese fight left handed stupid but true my oldest son was made to use his right hand at school in Britain about 40 yrs ago now he writes with the left shoots plays gold /tenis and fishes right the wakasashi was often used in the left hand as a pary weapon mutch like the small dagger was

 

tezza

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there were no one armed samurai they were just Dead one armed samurai the misplacement of menuki is a chinese thing on the swords on Ebay and some bigger manufacturors were if you notice the chinese fight left handed stupid but true
Let me see if I got this straight, Mr. or Mrs. Tezza: Gyaku-te Menuki are a Chinese invention because the Chinese use their left hand for holding swords (not withstanding the fact that Chinese swords don't have Menuki)? And one-armed samurai were subject to ... well .. euthanasia? And finally: are you somehow related to Shan or Nick?
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Tezza,

I hope you don't take offence (being in Oz, I am sure you won't) but 2 things we require here are real first names, and punctuation. Haven't had to request the latter up to now, but now I should. :lol:

For those with a headache, a translation : I don't subscribe to most of it, but it can be read now.

The samurai were all conformists, as are most older Japanese even today. Rules must be followed without question, so all trained and fought right handed. There were no one armed samurai: they were just dead, one-armed, samurai.

The misplacement of menuki is a chinese thing. On the swords on Ebay (and some bigger manufacturers) where if you notice the chinese fight left handed. Stupid but true. My oldest son was made to use his right hand at school in Britain about 40 yrs ago, now he writes with the left, shoots/plays golf /tennis and fishes right. The wakasashi was often used in the left hand as a pary weapon, much like the small dagger was.

:phew:

 

Brian

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  • 4 weeks later...

Hello

 

To add in my two cents worth. My Iaido instructor always told me that a left handed grip (I.E left hand above right hand on the tsuka) shouldn`t be used because it creates an opening in the guard, sort of an imaginary triangle between the pommel, the tip of the blade and the opposite hip, this is owing to a change in angle apparently. It therefore makes it harder to parry some forms of attacks, I would take a guess that the biomechanics of the wrist play some roll in the way impact is absorbed and redirected which might be affected to but thats just a theory.

 

As to the properties of the sword in question, well that I`ll leave up to someone with more experience to judge. Hope that helps

Regards

 

David S

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Several schools Kashima, Kashima shin ryu grip with the little finger of the left hand circling the base of the sword/bokken like the koudai of a chawan. It prevents the sword from slipping through the hand.

 

Philip

 

...hence everybody can see they are no more able to fence as before the fault they had to remediate with Yubitsume.

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  • 10 months later...
Interesting as in modern fencing/swordmanship, lefthand is considered as an advantage

 

Being extremely left handed I can attest to some advantage in fencing. Some years back I was part of a fencing school and I was able to score quit easily on even the more advanced students. That is until someone had my number and then I would get destroyed (Unforgettable match with a 17 year old Junior Olympic girl...)

I have also found this advantage in shinai sparring. I do not think that many "righty's" are a custom to left handed techniques.

So I encourage all parents to put socks on the right hand of your children to force them left handed. :)

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