Pic Request - battle damage on blades

[vajo]

John i thought Kirikomi are only possible in the mune. Kirikomi "cut" is working because the harder cutting edge cuts into the weaker mune.

 

But this looks like a cut into the very hard cuttings edge? And is it a kirikomi or a fatal flaw because it is going through the temper.

 

 

[Dave R]

On 2/19/2023 at 8:30 PM, FrenchBreadPrime said:

It's surprising how many blades have been damaged by bullets during WW2, it makes me wonder, are there any pictures of older blades damaged by Teppo ?

WWII = full auto on the battlefield, lots of bullets, lots of hits.

[Lewis B]

On 10/31/2021 at 3:57 PM, TomBell said:

A sword I recently acquired has damage to the ha, muni and ji.  Most of the damage is from the middle of the blade increasing out to the kissaki.  Of these, a straight cut in the ji with a very steep V cross section is the most intriguing.  I don't think this is the result of bushwhacking.  The maximum depth were it terminates at the shinogi is ~0.3 mm.  It's maximum width at the shinogi is ~0.4 mm.  It's length is 6 mm.  A distinctive splatter pattern of fine rust on both sides of the blade radiates from the ji.  

 

As a complete beginner, I am trying to learn the names of the sword elements so please forgive me if I have mislabeled anything.

 

I inspected a sword at the recent Japan Art Expo with a very similar indentation described as kirikomi, and in a similar part of the blade, about halfway along. It was over a cm in length with quite a jagged appearance

 

 

[PNSSHOGUN]

From Japan: https://auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/u1209946393

 

[Lareon]

It's in Japan at the moment so don't have it at hand tot take better photos but one of my blades has a couple of kirikomi.

It's being polished at the moment but i wanted to them to leave it in as part of its story

[eternal_newbie]

3 minutes ago, Lareon said:

It's being polished at the moment but i wanted to them to leave it in as part of its story

 

This is the usual practice; kirikomi generally aren't seen as flaws but rather badges of honour. Check out the chunks missing out of the mune of the Ishida Masamune on Markus Sesko's article (scroll down for a picture you can enlarge): https://japaneseswordlegends.wordpress.com/2015/09/30/ishida-mitsunari-and-two-masamune-less/

[Scogg]

While I don’t have a time machine, and cannot confirm with certainty that these marks are battle damage. I suspect that at least one of them is kirikomi. At the very least, it is fun to think about. O-suriage mumei katana. 

-Sam
 

 

 

[John C]

Ouch. Through the fingers, tsuka, then into the nakago. Unless that is some sort of test cut for a different blade.

 

John C.

[eternal_newbie]

33 minutes ago, John C said:

Unless that is some sort of test cut for a different blade.

 

That, or it's an O-O-O-suriage blade that used to be a massive nodachi, and that was part of the mune earlier in its life.

[Lewis B]

39 minutes ago, eternal_newbie said:

 

That, or it's an O-O-O-suriage blade that used to be a massive nodachi, and that was part of the mune earlier in its life.

It's on the Ha side of the nakago. Given the angle of the strike it could have been struck while in its saya and being worn. Either way not a good day for its owner.

[RichardP]

Similar to Sam’s, but the kirikomi(?) is along the nakago-mune of a ko-Fujishima tachi:

[BjornLundin]

Not as impressive as other blades, but it has at least three battle marks on the mune, a remarkable old warrior, and only if the blade could talk

 

[Matsunoki]

Really sorry, I know it’s not a sword but I couldn’t resist….I bet that gave him a headache……

[Bruce Pennington]

 

[nihonto_1]

Hi,

 

Here are some nice kirikomi on a wakizashi. 

Including a cut to the end of the saya.

 

Will

 

Edited May 24 by nihonto_1

[NotANinja]

Here are some kirikomi on a naginata naoshi I have hoping to get it polished one day and maybe try and keep them if they can be saved, interesting history!

[ROKUJURO]

That does not look like KIRIKOMI in my opinion. Probably silly boys playing SAMURAI or King Arthur with it after WWII.

[NotANinja]

14 minutes ago, ROKUJURO said:

That does not look like KIRIKOMI in my opinion. Probably silly boys playing SAMURAI or King Arthur with it after WWII.

Oh I fully accept that it could just be that, but as we have no way of truly knowing I kind of want to believe it's kirikomi

[Brian]

I expect 99% of this sort of damage is neglect and messing around, and done in modern times. Blade to blade contact is rare and unlikely from those pics. We tend to romanticize these things, but it's important to realize that it isn't a desired thing in most cases and unless can be proven 100%, it's best to not see them as a feature.

[John C]

Rob:

I guess you could just define their characteristics: dark, so not recent; triangular shaped, so struck with or against sharp metal object; and located along the shinogi.

But other than that, it's anyones guess.

 

John C.