Bruce Pennington

Thanks JP, I appreciate it! But it is one I have already.

Nick Komiya says it’s a cherry blossom. I can see it now, but it’s crafted in a way I’ve never seen.

This koiguchi is on a mumei gunto being discussed on Warrelics http://www.warrelics.eu/forum/Japanese-militaria/katana-inscription-cloth-help-730056-2/#post1957514 Any ideas what this is on the koiguchi where the cherry blossom should be? The blade is nothing special, an unsigned WWII factory blade, and fittings normal except for this and an extra thin tsuba. Ideas?

Thanks, great one! It's my first and only "No" serial number! And yes, the nakago looks quite worn! I don't see how a nakago could get so worn under a tsuka. I almost want to think it was previously heavily rusted and has been cleaned, but "cleaned" would look shiny and buffed, where this still looks old and just worn. Interesting one.

Neil, my feelings exactly! Just look at the NCO production for 1945 - they went from an average of 2,500 guntos/month to Jan 45 - 5,000 and Aug '45 - 10,000! This was the final year of the war when materiel shortages would have been at their highest level, yet the Govt was demanding that production be increased due to their fear of a looming Allied home invasion. They must have been scrambling to get their hands on any piece of koshirae they could find. As a side note: My early feeling that the mysterious NLF gunto (mixed navy and army) was late-war pieced together parts - falls apart in light of your collection. Your 3 are how things would look when peicing things together in desperation. The "NLF" gunto were to precisely uniform and really good looking. It's clear in comparison that they were newly produced for souvenirs.

I'm firmly on the fence (though wavering to fake). The mei and serial numbers are as good as any Mantetsu out there. New- I first thought "well, the polisher would have cleaned the whole thing, that's why it looks new." I checked my polished Mantetsu, and while he shined the nakago, there is patina still imbeded in the kanji cuts. Soooo, either the one in question was cut recently, and no patina, or the polisher REALLY cleaned the nakago - UNKNOWN. We have a sample of 2 (maybe 3), but both the current ones looks identical and too new. I'm saving this one like I did the last one - "under suspicion". I would love to see (assuming fakery) one come out with an identical serial number to an existing one in the database. But, there were approx. 38,000 of these made, with a database of 160, so the odds are in their favor right now.

Ibex, How about going to the settings section and inputing a first name so we can really chat with a person. Not being trite, it's forum rules, and we really do like to talk to real people! Here's a great read on the Rinji/Contengency Model/Type 3/'44 Model from Nick Komiya: http://www.warrelics.eu/forum/Japanese-militaria/legally-rebutting-existence-type-3-army-officers-sword-708745/ Does your rig have the double release button or just a single? Would love to see a picture of the fittings. Yours doesn't appear to have the star at first glance. Recommend taking everything off including the habaki. Sometimes stamps hide up higher on the nakago (tang). Here's a picture of my star stamp. You may also have small stamps on the back edge (mune) of the nakago.

Thanks Brandon. I just learned that on a similar discussion on the Translation Assistance thread. They said these "signature" marks by the polisher have been used for centuries. I'm not a nihonto collector, so I haven't come across them before (or noticed them if I did). I guess the problem is the same, though. Even if the polisher was a current one from today, not WWII, it doesn't prove or disprove, by itself, the age or legitimacy of the blade. If the marks are unique to a particular polisher, I think it adds some building evidence that a particular seller in Japan is turning mumei blades into Mantetsu blades and having them polished by his favorite polisher. They all have the same look, polish, and attribution characteristics.

Thanks Logan. So, even if the polisher is modern, that fact alone doesn't mean the blade is new, so hrumph.

Logan, is that what those parallel lines are that my arrow is pointing to? The polisher puts that there? Is that a modern polisher practice? I don't recall seeing those on WWII era blades.

I’m thinking about coming down on “fake”. These are almost all attributed to admirals, generals, and colonels, and they have a distinct NEW look with this unique pattern under the habaki:

John, Thanks for the photo. I agree they all have the same luck. They all have attributions to generals or admirals or colonels. Brian, I’m finally there with you on this. The file marks are never correct for Mantetsu blades. And they all have these unique marks that I’ve pointed to in this photograph.

Not much I can add beyond what you guys have said. I checked Fuller and Dawson - neither have this variant. I have never seen it myself. Dawson talks of "home defense" gunto which were lower in quality, but they have the uniformly styled kabutogane and sayajiri. If I had just seen these on the market, and not in Neil's collection, I'd have written them off as Franken-gunto, pieced together, with recently poorly re-wrapped tsuka (except the one in the middle with clear hand-oil wear). But the poor quality from tip to stern indicates all original, and the fact that they are all 3 by the same smith. (I have a vague memory of someone else discussing his theory that a smith was using the same koshirae maker). Dang, I'd sure like to see an updated Fuller or Dawson with all Neil's discoveries and all my stamps and all Steve and Ernie's 95s. Oh, it would have the news about the "NLF Gunto" being a post-war PX item; and all of Nick Komiya's charts and production data. I'd throw in some bits we've learned on the Mantetsu, too. What a great book that would be!

Ed, My post came from a Buyee.jp action site, but it's post is a Yahoo auction, that seems to be the same: https://buyee.jp/item/yahoo/auction/w307428001. I don't know what "Buyee" is, but there are USA sites that gather sales from around the globe. Mabye that explains it. Hamfish, I checked all my '41s and agree - their nakago remain pretty uniform in width, without taper or much taper. Also, the Mantetsu nakago mune began as flat, like other blades, but in '40 they began rounding them, not all but a mix. By '41, all Mantetsu mune were rounded, EXCEPT those specifically made for Rinji (type 3) mounts, which were flat. Both these wavy blades are '41s and are flat, but in Type 98 mounts. That would lean toward fakery, but not proof alone, as a custom blade could be made any way the smith desired obviously. On the other hand, the "skin" of this blades does have the look of a polished Mantetsu. When I had mine polished, the polisher called the look "sliced pear", which this one has. "SIGH"

The file marks aren’t Mantetsu standard either.

You made me realize it would be easy to find out - the gunto was a Tokyo arsenal product (blade and fuchi Stamps). So the question is why was a Tokyo inspector using this stamp? We may never know. A possibility is that the thousands of gunto per month were too much for arsenal staff to inspect, and company inspectors were augmenting them. The 95s were made by a few contractor companies. It could mean a contractor inspector checked this one off.

Great picture Jareth. I’m pretty sure that’s a Type 95, with a leather NCO tassel, though.

Just found a stamp I've never seen before on a Type 95 saya drag. Am told it's "Sha". Anyone know the significance? Drag stamps are usually inspector stamps from an arsenal - "To" from Tokyo, "Na" from Nagoya.

Thanks to all for your thoughts. You have a depth of knowledge on nihonto that I will never know. John, Is his name in the action text as seller, or are you saying that this is his style of product? I'll have to go back and check if the other wavy hamon blade was a Komonjo sale. I had a brief chat online with him. He says he sells on consignment from sellers in Japan. I'm beginning to suspect that a particular seller in Japan is becoming a Mantetsu geimei professional. I will find out about the previous blade. Update: The previous '41 Wavy also came from Buyee.jp auction site, so Komonjo is not the seller, though, the same guy in Japan very well may be. I don't see a seller name on that site for blade autions.

Classic Damascus steel

Thanks to Ontario_Archaeology for this find on a Japanese auction site https://buyee.jp/item/yahoo/auction/w307428001/detail#googtrans(ja|en). Claims to be carried by a Col Nakagawa on Peleliu; FULL HAMON. It's the second one I've come across recently with wavy hamon, and both are Spring '41's. I've got the inscription posted over on Translation Assistance, so I'll update if significant news comes from it. As always, I welcome your thoughts. I'm aware Mantetsu made some custom blades, but these wavy hamon blades generate a bunch of suspision about gimei jobs on otherwise unsigned nihonto to drive the sell price up.

Guys, This is on a Mantetsu blade and the Japanese auction site says the inscription is: "Kunio Nakagawa Colonel Carrying A Sword Showa Tsurami Spring" and claims it was carried by Col Nakagawa on Peleliu. Thoughts, corrections, geimei?

Interesting. I do recall seeing others where the number on the blade matches the numbers on the fittings. That could mean they were assembly numbers, or it could mean that the fitters simply stamped the number already on the blade to the fittings, and the blade number was originally there for other reasons.

Bojan, I haven't studied this particular numbering system that closely. George Trotter has looked at it more deeply and says in another thread: "George, regarding "contract numbers" - does this mean each number was tied to a custom contract with an individual, or does it refer to the smith's contract with the army; and/or are the numbers representative of how many blades he's made for the army under contract? That is what we don't really know clearly Bruce. I think every customer who walked in the door and asked for a sword got a number, but maybe also the brothers just numbered each sword they produced before sending it to the polisher-mounter-retailer in Tokyo who then sold it in the Army Officer's Store on their behalf. The later type of number system may have been introduced by the RJT to identify contract makers working from their own shops in the various prefectures. "ta" may have identified Niigata Pref. and "o" may have meant Aoyama Pref. (I have a number "o"154 on a tang by Aoyama RJT Nagao Kunishiro dated 19/2). We just don't know yet." At first glance, it does seem to be tied to RJT blades, but from my vague memory, I don't think all RJT blades were numbered, though I could be wrong about that. Sounds like more study is needed on this!

Nice pic Dave! Too bad they’re all wrapped! Would be nice to see the sarute.