Fukuoka Ichimonji Wakizashi?

[Death-Ace]

Hi guys! Sharing a blade I picked up last week from a very nice old collector and martial artist who was selling a few. Is a bit of a puzzle, so hope you enjoy!

 

This blade is a very old wakizashi that appears to have been o-suriage from a longer tachi in the past.

 

Measurements:

Nagasa: 17 1/2"

Nakago: 5"

Motohaba: 3/8"

Kissaki Width: 3/4"

Width: 15/16"

(Will take more detailed measurements aa I forgot a few!)

 

It appears that the hamon is a midare with sunagashi leading up to choji and into the boshi which is wide with much hakikake. Will take a better photo tomorrow! I believe the hada to be masame with itame mixed. As can be seen, there are a few delamination and ware/loose grain. There is also a very minute amount of rust that has been stabilized, but also, the hadori on the omote almost appears too muddy, and I can barely see any details.

 

The kicker? Apparently he had it noted as belonging to the Fukuoka Ichimonji school and I definitely see characteristics in the blade of one, I don't believe I could rightly call this one or a Ko-Bizen at that. Possibly a Bizen school of the Nanbokucho period? Either way, it is a gorgeous blade and must have quite the stunner before it was cut down.

[paulb]

Sorry but from the images I am not seeing anything which would suggest ko-Bizen and certainly not ichimonji. It may just be the images but there appears to be definite masame in the shinogi ji which would point to something much later. Also you mention masame in ther ji-hada which is not typical of either of the schools you mention.

Again impossible from pictures to be accurrate and it may be the polish but the steel just doesnt look that old.

Another key indicator which isn't mentioned, is there any utsuri? if it were ko-Bizen then you might expect to see jifu if ichimonji then midare utsuri.

Please dont misunderstand me I am not saying it is a bad sword, infact it looks rather nice I just cant see reasons for the attributions given 

look forward to hearing other's ideas

best regards

Paul

[Gakusee]

I concur with Paul - the hada and hamon do not seem right for the attribution. You would expect more choji in the hamon and the hada to be mokume -itame mix. Not masame and not such suguha notare based hamon.

With Ichimonji you also get a lot of utsuri (mostly midare but could be jifu).

 

Attached are NBTHK papered examples from my own collection (a slightly earlier Yoshioka katana closer to Fukuoka in workmanship and a slightly later Yoshioka wakizashi, late Kamakura or early Nambokucho). Apologies for the amateur pictures but that is what I can do.

[lonely panet]

either you have massive hands, or its a rather slender blade

[Death-Ace]

either you have massive hands, or its a rather slender blade

They call me the George Foreman of our times! Haha, kidding aside, nada, my hands are regular sized...lol. The blade really is slender.

 

Thanks for the comments so far! From the blades I've seen here on the net, I cpuld not see any resemblance to any Ichimonji school blades due to the characteristics that y'all stated, but figured I'd post it up here for the viewing pleasure and some kantei. Ill have to check again, but I honestly could not see any utsuri. Thought some details looked a little similar to some ko-Bizen blades, but as said, I really don't see anything to could confirm it as one. So the search continues to evaluate it!

 

The polish is a bit murky and kind of blinds out some of the details, especially with the omote side. The hadori polish wasn't done by any of the known polishers in the states, it seems, but looks rather well done, but like some girls, has a bit too much "make-up". In either case, I do like the blade and for whatever age it is, still a bit healthy. I bought it mounted in a nice, decent koshirae for a good price. Definitely one of the better blades Ive picked up from what y'all can see from my past buys and with my loan paid for, I'll be keeping this one to study for awhile. Possibly send to shinsa if I can figure out what it is I'm exactly dealing with and see if I'm close.

[PNSSHOGUN]

I was struggling to find any indications of Ichimonji in those photos. What gave you the idea it was Ichimonji school?

[Brian]

...The hagiri polish wasn't done by any of the known polishers in the states,...

Hadori polish.

 

[SAS]

I was hoping for him that was the case

[Death-Ace]

Hadori polish.

 

I really need to double check the autocorrect before I post. Thank you!

 

The only indication I wpuld have thought, if even, was the choji hamon in the monouchi.

 

But in any case, the seller had it noted as one, which would have been nice, but figured that it probably wasn't. Still like the blade though!

[tokashikibob]

I really need to double check the autocorrect before I post. Thank you!

 

    DA,  maybe if you used some of that chili oil you wrote about  in a previous post can bring out the hamon details?    Nice blade!  How about a pic of the koshirae?

[Stephen]

First pix in your hand i think boys sword, i haven't seen anything to change my mind.

[J Reid]

Good eye Stephen ! I agree that it very petite.. Habaki too..

[Death-Ace]

That's actually something that has been on the crossed my mind, but hearing you all say it sounds better, haha! It seems a little wider than some boys day swords, but I can see that with this trying to emulate a tachi. Even if o-suriage, the the nakago does seem oddly shaped for a cut down. Even so, the hamon appears to continue long past the hamachi. Ill post some pictures of the koshirae here later tonight as well.

[Death-Ace]

Wasn't able to make it to the storage unit today, but I have some pics prior to the blade's purchase.

[Stephen]

http://www.nihonto.us/BOYS%20DAY%20SWORD%20CHI%2017.htm

[Death-Ace]

Ahh, Ive seen that one before! Looks like it is still a nice blade and some definitely were better made. Definitely a good reference piece. Appreciate it!

 

Looks like everything here is solved for the most part. I appreciate everyone's help and comments. Definitely helped to solve the mystery. Still a nice blade to study, however...as embarrassing as it is to state, even if I just posted this, I'm going to have to list it. One of the reasons I didn't get to the storage unit was due to car problems, stuff that needed to really get sone before I leave my current duty station. I'm going to put it for what I have in it. I seem to can't catch a break...

[Gakusee]

DA, by the way you mention choji in your hamon but it is notare midare with some sunagashi. Choji is a very specific shape which resembles cloves and buds.

[TheGermanBastard]

Good eye Stepehen ...

 

Andy Images make the Hamon more visible while teh Hadori has pretty much obscured it.

 

No Ichimonji blade.

 

Boys swords are not much thought after. I give this without any judgement of my own. Just saying from my observations. Nothing wrong with the quality of your sword. But not an important blade.

[Death-Ace]

Appreciate the comments again, gents! After viewing the blade, I see what you mean. Like you all said, a nice blade, good to study. Hopefully someone will be able to here in the future. But until it sells, I'm still gawking at it. Haha.

[Jamie]

This is a bit off topic but I think this thread illustrates well the need for us to attend shows. They are so supremely valuable. This was compared to a ko bizen blade. Once you've seen a ko bizen blade in hand you probably won't mistake something else for it.. Not many of us will see ko bizen outside the shows. I've only seen one but it's characteristics were unmistakable. Personally my taste has well outgrown my budget. So I go to shows and study there.