Old And Rusty - Gendaito?

[vajo]

I need help. 

 

This sword is for offer. Koshirae is mixed with gunto parts.

 

I think it is a gendaito sword.

 

 

[Brian]

No. It is much earlier than the war, and appears to be a wakizashi not a katana anyways.

[vajo]

First idea: Fujiwara Shigenori 

[ROKUJURO]

Chris,

looks like KISHU province, but better photos are necessary for my old eyes. Try with chalk in the KANJI. Date is HACHI GATSU HI - A day in the eighth month. A little strange.....

[vajo]

It's difficult. 

 

Brian you are right 52 cm. It's a wakizashi. With the Koshirae it's maybe for a tank comander or a pilot.

 

 

Kissaki is damaged. Hamon is not to see anymore. It must be polished. 

 

was it a good smith? What you think about the price?

[SAS]

Looks like it has possibilities.....what price?

[vajo]

I'm a little shoked now. He wants 1200 EUR. 

[vajo]

What you think is a fair price. Any idea?

[Stephen]

half...

[vajo]

I bought it now for 700 EUR.      It's ok.

[Grey Doffin]

Can't be sure, of course, but this might be retempered.  The exaggerated curvature is pointing that way.

Grey

[k morita]

Hi,

 

Maybe ,old blade Nobuaki(宣明),Dotanuki in Higo.

[vajo]

 Is it possible the sword was made for Fujiwara Shigenori

from Nobuaki Dotanuki in Higo?

 

Shigenori was the shogun begining 17c.

[SteveM]

There was no Shogun at the beginning of the 17th century. The Ashikaga line lingered until the late 1500s, and then ended leaving a vacuum.

Tokugawa (Ieyasu) grabbed the title for himself in 1603. 

 

Maybe you are thinking of someone else? Anyway, the mei on the sword doesn't mention any patron or benefactor or recipient. It just says it was made by Nobu-somebody (I agree it looks like Nobuaki).

 

肥刕隈本住藤原宣明

 

Hishū Kumamoto-ju Fujiwara Nobuaki

[vajo]

Then it is this smith?

 

Nobuaki

ID NOB642 Province Higo Start Era Tensho (1573-1592) End Era Bunroku (1592-1596) Active Period 1573-1596 School Dotanuki

Source Rating Reference/Page Hawley 15 NOB642 

[vajo]

Here some better pictures i recvied.

 

   

 

 

 

I hope with a good polish the blade will be back on life.

[ROKUJURO]

There was no Shogun at the beginning of the 17th century........Tokugawa (Ieyasu) grabbed the title for himself in 1603..... 

 

 

Steve,

 

1603 is the beginning of the 17th century!

[vajo]

I bought a second one 

 

reading Hida no Kami Fujiwara Ujifusa? 1596 - 1615 

 

  

 

The seller bought the two blades 30 years ago in Holland for round 200 Dollar from a collector. He wanted ever restore them but now he is old and needs the money.

 

I didn't know if the blade is good or not. But i think its old too. Maybe 17 century. And i want to give them a chance for restore.

[Stephen]

sorry to say your sword is beyond restore, you should see more before you buy    makes no cents to put more money into this bad deal

 

 

edit to say i was talking about first one

[vajo]

sorry to say your sword is beyond restore, you should see more before you buy    makes no cents to put more money into this bad deal

 

 

edit to say i was talking about first one

 

Maybe Stephen. I look when i have it. Than i decide. Two nihonto over 400 years old. The first one have seen many things. Thats right. 

[SteveM]

Steve,

 

1603 is the beginning of the 17th century!

 

I was going for accuracy. 1603 is three years after the beginning of the 17th century. 

[vajo]

My bad deal is coming today 

After cleaning the koshirae and cleaning the blade. The 16. centuri Dotanuki Nobuaki looks not so bad. The Waki has an nice ww2 tank commander koshirae and fits well in the saya.

 

One Seppa is a leather one and the Ashi ring is missing.

 

What you think.

 

 

     

 

Tomorrow i take a deeper look on the second blade the Ujifusa.

 

[ROKUJURO]

Chris,

looking at the photos I think the second buy is much worse in condition than the first. It looks as if the SHINOGI has been ground away, and there is a big flaw in the JI. In my knowledge this is probably beyound restoration, because grinding everything defective away wouldn't leave much to admire. 
Possible age and a signature are nothing that add to the value of a blade. 

The TOSOGU of the first blade have lost all their patination through 'cleaning', so this is worse than painting a Michelangelo statue in pink..... 

[vajo]

What cleaning you mean Jean? I took a very weak brush to geht the dust away. 

 

What you see on the pictures? 

 

Nobuaki

 

 

Ujifusa

 

 

There is no patination away. I think you interpret into something that isn't there.

 

[Stephen]

hes talking about the tsuba, were sure one time it was black

[vajo]

It is black when you look from this angle.

From the side it is pure copper.

 

 

Did you mean that?

[Stephen]

yes, its been overly cleaned, most of the patina has been removed

[vajo]

It's not from me.

 

To make it black is no problem. They take Hepar sulfuris in german "Schwefelleber" to get it black. But i didn't belive that the Tsuba was black, because the rest of the koshirae is not black.

 

You can it  heated in the oven between 55° and 85°. Or you dig it in the garden   because it is only copper.

I didn't see there a problem.

I like it as it is.

[Stephen]

Wrong...it was black...the rest was "cleaned" as well...ok we know you didnt...some GI my guess

[ROKUJURO]

I didn't see there a problem.

I like it as it is.

That is the problem