August Tsuba Kantei Exercise - For Fun

[Curran]

It is a slow time of year on NMB

   Many are on vacation or going on vacation. A fair number of this crowd will be at San Fran Sword Show next week.

Work is more sieta time than fiesta time. I figured I would post a simple kantei for a bit of fun.

 

The attached tsuba is one of my Catch-n-Release tsuba that I sometimes buy.

These tsuba are usually interesting and educational, even if outside of my main areas of interest.

This one wasn't what I thought it would be, and taught this old dog a bit.

 

Size:  6.7cm x 6.5cm x 5mm (4.75 at mimi)

[TETSUGENDO]

I'll throw caution to the wind.  Nishigaki?

 

-S-

[Brian]

Akasaka

[Curran]

SteveK: Not a bad start. You're on the pathway.

 

Next contestant?

[Curran]

Akasaka

 

For purposes of what I think is the answer, also not a bad guess.

Let us see what else people say.

[DirkO]

Higo Jingo? Basing it on nakago ana and design...

[Curran]

Higo Jingo? Basing it on nakago ana and design...

 

Ahha! You are onto something there.

  Nishigaki and Akasaka are often the prime suspects for this design.

The dark iron didn't look Nishigaki or Akasaka to me and I also noticed the particular nakago ana shape that we associate w/ 4th and 5th gen Jingo.

 

5th gen sukashi Jingo are somewhat rare---> Hence why I bought it.

-After it arrived and I thought on it a few days, I don't think that is the final conclusion.

 

Hint:  see the last photos of inside the sukashi.

[Pete Klein]

Ko Shoami???

[Ian]

Yagyu design?

[DirkO]

With your additional info, Curran, I'll switch to ko-shoami as well. Odd nakago-ana in that case. interesting piece,nice buy!

[TETSUGENDO]

Ko Shoami is becoming a curiously  popular new catch-all!  Why not, if it good enough for...........

 

-S-

[christianmalterre]

just see this....

nice! Curran

 

why Higo ?

( please explain on what point you do ground or do point your´s individual Kantei Gentlemen.)

 

Catch-n-Release is a wrong wording here definitely Curran! I have seen worse!

[MauroP]

If not Nishigaki could be 土佐明珍?

[Curran]

If not Nishigaki could be 土佐明珍?

 

We have a winner!

Mauro-  how many times have I looked at someone's thread to help kantei something, and I scroll down to see you've posted exactly what I would post.

 

I do believe this one is Tosa Myochin.

I have a difficult time usually making that attribution when the piece isn't signed.

In this case, I feel it is right as not Nishigaki and not Akasaka-  nor is it the 5th gen Jingo I hoped from the seppa dai.

 

The carving isn't as deep as I would expect of 5th gen Jingo. The iron wrong for most Nishigaki and Akasaka.

The iron is blacker and harder. Activity along the mimi and inside the sukashi reminded me significantly of the mokume tsuba we sometimes see.

Opening the Tosa Myochin book given to me by one of the NMB members, there is a good example of this exact design as done by a Tosa Myochin smith.

[MauroP]

Honestly I've to say that Nishigaki was my first choice...

[Vermithrax16]

I really didn't have a strong opinion (still learning tsuba) but I LOVE these posts. They really make you think and study. Well done.

[Curran]

Honestly I've to say that Nishigaki was my first choice...

 

I understand.

Here is an expensive example: http://www.tsuruginoya.com/mn1_3/f00089.html

 

It would be easy to pass this off as Nishgaki. It would be financially advantageous.

I thought I was in a Win-Win when I purchased it, as it would be Nishigaki or Jingo.

 

My coming to the honest conclusion that it is probably Tosa Myochin is an economic loser. Oh well  

Still, I have always struggled with How to Identify an unsigned Tosa Myochin, and think I gained some education.

There are certainly a few Tosa Myochin where I'd swear they were Nishigaki or Akasaka if they were _NOT_ signed.

 

It was educational to me, and I figured I would share it.

Mokume style iron isn't very Akasaka or Nishigaki, is it?

[Curran]

Just to add a bit:

 

https://www.seiyudo.com/tu-050718.htm

 

Here is a copy of a classic Nishigaki design.

Luckily this one is actually signed by the Tosa Myochin artist.

[TETSUGENDO]

Perfect!

 

     -S-

[Curran]

And a Nishigaki precursor to it:

http://www.tsuruginoya.com/mn1_3/f00072.html

[Jean]

Opinion on this one, which school?

[TETSUGENDO]

Echizen Kinai?

 

          -S-

[Dojikiri]

It is traditionally said to be a Horai school design. 

[Curran]

Opinion on this one, which school?

 

Hi Jean,

I'm not ignoring this one. I'm still going through the books and thinking on it.

 

The tsuba could use a little rust clean up, but is a very well done one. 

As Steven said, Echizen Kinai is one possible attribution. Given how well some of the carving is done and how rounded off the mimi has been done, I have also thought to check other schools.

 

There are several schools I can suspect might have produced it.  Ex:  There was a line of Choshu artists who were originally under-studying with the Yokoya (Somin, Soyo) line. Their carving resulted in particularly fluid looking Choshu.  I owned one, and was dumb enough to sell it off to a Cajun member of NMB. Seeing yours reminded me of it, but their mimi are usually squared off and the tsuba signed. As I think through possible attributions for yours, the list of suspects is slowly being reduced. Only Echizen Kinai and a certain Hizen area school did tsuba like this without signing them. Still I keep wondering if there is someone not on the suspect list that should be. As time allows, I go through more books.

___________________________________________________________________________

Dojikiri (name?) mentioned Horai, and I've read that before on the Haynes+Long website. I haven't found it in the Torigoye book that isn't in summer storage.

Maybe he can comment further.

[TETSUGENDO]

Curran,

 

I think Dojikiri was referring to design not maker, Horai pieces don't generally exhibit the degree of modelling present in Jean's tsuba.

That Chosu group is a possibility, I believe, there are the rare exemples with rounded rim and those that are completely modelled.  Hizen is possible as well....Will see.

 

-Cheers,

[Jean]

Thanks a lot guys. My photo don’t do justice to this tsuba which has a very good iron.

[Curran]

My photo don’tdo justice to this tsuba which has a vey good iron.

 

That is part of the problem. I can tell it is very nice, even from the one photo.

Given the time it was probably made, I can't explain why it isn't signed. Without the signature, I'm torn between schools were maybe someone asked the maker to leave it unsigned- or one of the schools that wouldn't sign.

 

It could be a particularly good example from several schools. Artists did have exceptional periods or exceptional works. Think Van Gogh c.1889

______________________________________________________________

 

I'm researching one of my own questions about a particularly old Saotome tsuba and stumbling through about two dozen books to try and find any further insight into your question or my question.

[TETSUGENDO]

Indeed, the Arles paintings 1888-89, includes Irises also Starry Night,etc.........talk about going out with a bang!

 

-S-

[Jussi Ekholm]

This has been educational thread. I was browsing lots of dealer sites and scrolling their tsuba selection by pics and try to identify them on my own. I was set on Higo few times while the attribution was to Tosa Myōchin.

[Curran]

Update Correction:

 

As Dojikiri cryptically said and left the discussion, further study through about 30 books has popped up several confirms that the tsuba is indeed Horai as in closely associated with the _Kaga_ Myochin armor makers. These are from 40 and 50 year old texts and a modern shinsa team may not 100% support- but I understand these tsuba are traditionally of the Horai school. Indeed, the one listed in Wakayama's 8 volume set is very similar to mine.

    

 

My Tosa Myochin call seems a near miss. I don't know much about Kaga Myochin.

Link to Bob Haynes and Long website on the topic of Kaga Myochin:  http://www.shibuiswords.com/haynesTsu3.htm

Regarding my kantei tsuba, I revise my opinion slightly and think best attribution should be 'Horai Ippa' (Kaga Myochin linked) instead of Tosa Myochin.