Oh dear!

[Geraint]

Dear All.

 

Surely not!  https://www.bonhams.com/auction/32016/lot/304/a-pair-of-mixed-metal-tsuba-edo-period-19th-century-2/

 

Apologies for hurting the eyes.

 

All the best.

[Brian]

Oh good grief. Someone please tell them. Some moron is going to pay thousands for trash

[Jake6500]

Dreadful

 

Nothing else needs to be said

[Matsunoki]

I’ve emailed Rachel Hyman. (“Senior specialist”) ……erm.
Let’s see what she does.

 

[Hokke]

What I find interesting is no where in that listing does it use the word Japanese. It states a Japanese time period but that’s as close to Japan as it comes. Was this purposeful, I wonder? Can’t see how it would prevent fraud claims, since the “edo period” claim is wrong as well. 

[ROKUJURO]

I am sure Dale could find another "pair" (or a dozen) made in the same press mold!

[Kantaro]

Bonhams seems even worse than Catawiki?

 

[Spartancrest]

5 hours ago, ROKUJURO said:

I am sure Dale could find another "pair" (or a dozen) made in the same press mold!

Do I have to? 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/116660887829      Even this one is trying for twenty times its worth! [50 times maybe?]

[ROKUJURO]

I knew it.....

That one is even a nicer one than the Bonham's!

[Spartancrest]

Jean there are others - of course. https://www.sellingantiques.co.uk/1089133/Japanese-meiji-period-iron-tsuba   

 

 

 

Worse when they copy a crap copy!!!  https://fi.pinterest.com/pin/696932111117232603/ 

 

 omote view of another sold at auction   https://www.invaluable.com/auction-lot/a-bronze-wolf-under-pine-tsuba-ein-tsuba-aus-bron-261-c-f28490a948

 

Edited Sunday at 01:17 AM by Spartancrest

[Jesta]

I mean… they are absolutely identical, which you would hope would raise a flag for the auction house… 

[ROKUJURO]

15 minutes ago, Jesta said:

I.....which you would hope would raise a flag for the auction house… 

Justyn,

only in case they would care to do a tiny bit of research on their items.....(if one has no knowledge at all on the subject).

[Spartancrest]

[I guess the word "utsushi" wasn't in the vocabulary of these early collectors?]

 

From "Ornamental Ats of Japan" 1884 by George  Ashdown Audsley -   "Although we have in the course of our studies, examined thousands of guards, we do not remember ever to have seen two exactly alike" 

 

From "The Scottish Arts Review Vol 1 Japanese sword-guards" by J. P. MacGillivray 1888-89  - "From the variety of designs it would almost seem a first principle with makers of sword-guards in Japan that there should be no two alike. There is nothing characteristic of wholesale manufacture about them." 

 

Wow how things have changed!   

[vajo]

The same ones from 2024 ??

[vajo]

I like this one.

mei Ichiiriuku Hisamitsu

 

Edited Sunday at 03:24 PM by vajo

[ROKUJURO]

Chris,

it is not my taste, but it is very well made !

[John C]

I like it as well, however the head of the wolf would impede the kozuka. Seems like a design flaw.

 

John C.

[vajo]

It's not mine unfortunately. Picture is from the cambridge museum, but i like it very much and search further for a tsuba like this.

[Matsunoki]

Appears that they have been withdrawn. I was a bit blunt in what I said……so best we don’t expect any thanks🙂

[Hokke]

56 minutes ago, Matsunoki said:

Appears that they have been withdrawn. I was a bit blunt in what I said……so best we don’t expect any thanks🙂

As someone who has never been to an antiquity auction, does anyone know what kind of liability auction houses have for this kind of stuff. Did Colin just potentially save them from being sued, or do they have loop holes in the fine print of their auction agreements? 

[Matsunoki]

10 minutes ago, Hokke said:

or do they have loop holes in the fine print of their auction agreements? 

Whilst you really need legal expertise to interpret and understand Bonhams extensive Conditions of Sale they generally protect Bonhams from liability. “Caveat emptor” is the apparent principle. 

[Hokke]

2 minutes ago, Matsunoki said:

Whilst you really need legal expertise to interpret and understand Bonhams extensive Conditions of Sale they generally protect Bonhams from liability. “Caveat emptor” is the apparent principle. 

That’s unfortunate…..makes auction houses seem more like just expensive garage sales. I could see if they simply described it as a “tsuba”, the rest would be up to the customer to judge authenticity and age, but to date a piece and auction it under that premise is just fraud, period. 

[Matsunoki]

16 minutes ago, Hokke said:

That’s unfortunate…..makes auction houses seem more like just expensive garage sales. I could see if they simply described it as a “tsuba”, the rest would be up to the customer to judge authenticity and age, but to date a piece and auction it under that premise is just fraud, period. 

…..and they commonly charge us Buyers over 30% premium for the privilege of doing business with them……but that is a choice we as buyers make…..it’s up to us whether we chose to actually view a lot or whether we actually chose to buy it unseen and risk it. It’s a tough reality!

[Matsunoki]

I was wrong…..they did thank us!…..
 

[Brian]

Kudos to you Colin, and to them for actually listening. A small victory, but a victory none the less.

[ROKUJURO]

....and generously, they will assist Colin further, who will probably be very happy about it. 

[Spartancrest]

  This example from a still active company with hundreds of faked/copied designs, operating out of Osaka

 https://www.jauce.com/user/9sBuThXpTqPVk2Hk6fEs19XhMiFkU?&search=tsuba&n=100&page=1   I did toy with the idea of doing a catalogue with the fakes and the original piece they are based on - but it might end up being a very very thick book!  

 

Edited Tuesday at 01:20 PM by Spartancrest
better image

[Jesta]

What are your thoughts on this one: https://www.jauce.com/auction/u1227971547 

 

It feels off to me. The sekigane look fake, the sloppy execution of the bamboo(?) and other bits, the too small kogai ana, along with the dusting of rust all make me feel that it is more than a little suss… 

[Curran]

8 hours ago, Jesta said:

What are your thoughts on this one: https://www.jauce.com/auction/u1227971547 

 

It feels off to me. The sekigane look fake, the sloppy execution of the bamboo(?) and other bits, the too small kogai ana, along with the dusting of rust all make me feel that it is more than a little suss… 

 

Very off. An Akasaka design with a lot of fakes floating around. That and the Axe + Lightening design.  Rust them up a bit, and someone might think they are real.

----Avoid----

 

[Spartancrest]

Looks oddly "oily" - not impressed with the "paint on highlights"