Swords Posted September 1 Report Posted September 1 It looks older by the signature Anyone know who signed it? or any info about it Quote
When Necessary Posted September 2 Report Posted September 2 Hi Steve, With all respect, why don't you ever put these in the 'Translation Needed' or 'Japanese Military Swords' sections? You would get a faster response from the right people and it would save the admin's extra work having to move your posts. 1 Quote
Swords Posted September 2 Author Report Posted September 2 Dose anyone know if it’s traditional and age Thanks for the translation xiayang Quote
Scogg Posted September 2 Report Posted September 2 20 minutes ago, Swords said: Dose anyone know if it’s traditional and age Thanks for the translation xiayang Sakō Kaneshige worked before and during WW2 I believe he made both gendaito and showato but the photos that you've provided do not show the entire nakago. Are there any stamps above the mekugi-ana? I'm going to relocate your thread to the Military Swords of Japan section, in hopes you get some more feedback. All the best, -Sam Quote
Swords Posted September 2 Author Report Posted September 2 I believe your right worked before WW2 I should have googled him ist No stamps that I can see I thing it’s traditional made but not sure Quote
Brian Posted September 2 Report Posted September 2 14 minutes ago, Swords said: No stamps that I can see I thing it’s traditional made but not sure I doubt it. Quote
Swords Posted September 2 Author Report Posted September 2 I googled his name and believe he was as active in the 1930s or during WW2 as you said It’s probably traditional but not 100% sure I will get photos of the makati Thanks for your help Quote
Swords Posted September 2 Author Report Posted September 2 Sorry Brian didn’t see your post You don’t think it’s traditional? Quote
Brian Posted September 2 Report Posted September 2 Based on that hamon, I do not. Looks like a typical wartime oil quenched hamon to me. Just an opinion. 1 1 Quote
John C Posted September 2 Report Posted September 2 Steve: There is a Kaneshige listed in Mal's Naval Part 1 document (page 114), however he uses a different kanji for "shige". Also, the originial seller used the wrong kanji in his description. I think he was going for Kaneuji, but not sure. You may need to do some further research on this one. John C. Quote
Bruce Pennington Posted September 2 Report Posted September 2 Hm. Sesko lists two with those kanji, but neither is a Sako: "KANESHIGE (兼茂), Shōwa (昭和, 1926-1989), Chiba – “Shimōsa-jū Moriyama Kaneshige saku” (下総住森山 兼茂), real name Moriyama Osamu (森山修), he has a self-taught smith and worked later as a rikugun-jumei-tōshō, he lived in Shōnan (沼南) in the Higashi-Katsushika district (東葛飾) of Chiba Prefecture (see picture right) KANESHIGE (兼茂), Shōwa (昭和, 1926-1989), Gifu – “Kaneshige” (兼茂), real name Sakai Katsutoshi (酒井勝利), born March 19th 1906, he worked as a guntō smith" Quote
Swords Posted September 2 Author Report Posted September 2 Anyone agree with Brian being oil quenched! Here’s another photo of the Nakago Probably not much different than the other one shown 1 Quote
Lareon Posted September 2 Report Posted September 2 The dark peaks in the Hamon to me indicate an oil quench. hard to tell with the photos, any indication of a hada? although it's in poor polish sometimes that's hard to tell. It can be hard to tell at first but once you know you can tell, turn it in the light and if it looks ...solid? it's most likely oil, the hard peaks are sure signs, sometimes you get a shadow line too underneath. Water quenched feel more "airy" and bright. You get almost a glow out of the hamon Best way i can describe something that is half visual half feeling 1 Quote
Scogg Posted September 2 Report Posted September 2 It looks non-traditional showato, in my opinion Quote
Rawa Posted September 2 Report Posted September 2 Example with stamp. https://www.warrelics.eu/forum/Japanese-militaria/Japanese-sword-676573/ Ask @Bruce Pennington he even commented about linked one. Imo yours would be showa stamped too. Ask for entire nakago photo. Another example with stamp https://www.militaria.co.za/nmb/topic/30543-new-purchase/ Another with stamp https://entry.winners-auction.jp/productDetail/7041 3 stamped examples If yours don't have one You should start to wander if it wasn't removed. Still Bruce's data should shed light on the matter. Quote
SteveM Posted September 3 Report Posted September 3 This one (below) is the one that made the sword in this post. 10 hours ago, Bruce Pennington said: KANESHIGE (兼茂), Shōwa (昭和, 1926-1989), Gifu – “Kaneshige” (兼茂), real name Sakai Katsutoshi (酒井勝利), born March 19th 1906, he worked as a guntō smith Sakai Katsutoshi = Sakō Kaneshige. Sakai Katsutoshi is his birth/real name, and his swordsmith name is Sakō Kaneshige. 1 Quote
Bruce Pennington Posted September 3 Report Posted September 3 He was a prolific swordsmith, for sure. I have over 30 of his blades on file, most with the Showa and large Seki stamp. If there are blades of his out there without stamps and possibly gendaito, I do not know as I don't catalog those. Odds are the blade is showato. However, it is my observation that the blades with the large Seki, and Showa for that matter, were quality made showato. Quote
Brian Posted September 3 Report Posted September 3 Lack of a stamp doesn't indicate Gendaito, but presence of one indicates Showato. When getting a military sword, you have to assume an "arsenal" type blade no matter if there is a stamp or not. Only when you look at the hamon and hada can you start thinking it may be better. If you have activity and hada, you can then start suspecting water quenched and/or forged. Without those, forget about what the mei tells you. But in this case, even the mei looks like a classic Seki Showato. Maybe with some additional processes in the forging, but nothing there points towards Gendaito. 3 Quote
Rawa Posted September 3 Report Posted September 3 1 hour ago, Brian said: Lack of a stamp doesn't indicate Gendaito, but presence of one indicates Showato. When getting a military sword, you have to assume an "arsenal" type blade no matter if there is a stamp or not. Only when you look at the hamon and hada can you start thinking it may be better. If you have activity and hada, you can then start suspecting water quenched and/or forged. Without those, forget about what the mei tells you. But in this case, even the mei looks like a classic Seki Showato. Maybe with some additional processes in the forging, but nothing there points towards Gendaito. True especially that he have made many stamped blades. Quote
Lareon Posted September 3 Report Posted September 3 3 hours ago, Brian said: Lack of a stamp doesn't indicate Gendaito, but presence of one indicates Showato. When getting a military sword, you have to assume an "arsenal" type blade no matter if there is a stamp or not. Only when you look at the hamon and hada can you start thinking it may be better. If you have activity and hada, you can then start suspecting water quenched and/or forged. Without those, forget about what the mei tells you. But in this case, even the mei looks like a classic Seki Showato. Maybe with some additional processes in the forging, but nothing there points towards Gendaito. Exactly this, the activity, hada and presence of crystalline structures is where you can identify. I guess the easiest way to say it is, this is the study of blades not signatures. Quote
ROKUJURO Posted September 3 Report Posted September 3 12 hours ago, PNSSHOGUN said: Textbook oil tempered Hamon. John, Tempering is YAKIMODOSHI, hardening is YAKIIRE. Hardening of carbon-steels is always around 800°C, tempering at about 200°C. Quote
Swords Posted September 3 Author Report Posted September 3 A lot of great opinions Probably not worth wasting money on this sword unless you like arsenal which I do not Thanks to all 1 Quote
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