Bruce Pennington

Yes, not a one-off. Nagoya stamps placed differently and numbers on the old post are cutting edge up, like Nagoya numbers should be, but this one is cutting edge down. Same mix of navy and Rinji parts. I still like my post-war souvenir shop idea.

I have seen quite a variety of mixed fittings when the blade came from a family donation, then refitted for the army. But this isn't a family blade. The Showa stamp says it was made for the army. The felt spacer and civil fuchi might have been added post-war. Can't picture an active duty Japanese officer switching out those items for personalization purposes.

A first for me - a Chinese fake with rayskin saya cover and hinged dust-cover!!! WOW! I was willing, at first, to give this an "island-sword" label until I saw the writing on the nakago and the oh-so-standard serial number on the habaki (yes, legit examples of the numbered habaki exist, but this pattern is standard Chinese fakery). [Note: this is the standard Chinese craftsmanship on the metal fittings. Whereas Bazza's example of an unusual "knife" is way above this standard).

Quite an amazing piece, whether original or post-war; whether Chinese or Bubba. Truly an exellent piece of work. Thoughts: 1. It reminds me of Dawson's pages on Foot Soldier/Artillery SWord (pic attached). He had examples of wild custom jobs. 2. The mix of navy ashi and army Rinji-seishiki sayajiri/kabutogane + custom fuchi/koiguchi screams "Post-war". I can't see even a WWII custom shop mixing army & navy parts. 3. The Seki trademark, according to Ohmura, was created after 1940, yet the artillery sword was a late-1800's manufacture. And examples of the stamp observed are all post-1942. 4. Dawson's examples of the artillery sword don't show serial numbers on the blade, and the practice is LOVED by Chinese makers. 5. The kiku (Chrysanthemum) is 14 petal. My understanding is that Japanese kiku were 16. 7. The craftsmanship of the entire thing - how well everything fits, the details of the sakura, and metalwork, even the kissaki - are way better than any Chinese piece of fakery I've ever seen. {insert emoji of through hands in the air} It's quite a puzzle. One possibility - a late '40s skilled craftsman souvenir. It would explain the mix of army/navy/civil fittings, just like the Toyokawa souvenir sword. Even the ashi seem made in miniature for this piece. The detail is way better than Chinese work, and it's thinner and smaller than a standard sized navy ashi. Look how thick the standard size is:

Agree with Chris, the squared-off kissaki is classic Chinese fakery. I've never seen an island-sword with one. And it may sound odd, but the artwork of the fuchi and fittings is too good for island-sword work. Completely innaccurate artwork, but nicer than most fakes and all island-sword work.

My puzzlement as well - Really? That valuable an item on ebay???

Well the good news is that it’s all legit WWII stuff. Oddly sometimes that matters less with officer gunto than it does with NCO gunto (I mean original vs price-together).

I don’t think I’ve ever seen a Kai-island sword. Better close-ups of blade tip might help.

Marc, This blade has 2 holes because it was likely made to go into "Type 3" or Rinji Seishiki fittings which used a screw in the hole nearest the tsuba and a mekugi in the hole at the end. But this was cut off to fit into standard Type 98 fittings. Mark, Would it be possible to get a picture of the end of the nakago? Does the cut look fresh (post-war) or is it aged? I have 2 Mantetsu in the files with 2 mekugi ana, yet fitted in Type 98 fittings. The ends weren't cut like this one, so the fittings were obviously made to fit the longer nakago. But I mention them as examples that the mix of blade and 98 fittings was done during the war. Depending upon whether we can get evidence from the cut end, this may have been a field re-fit or it could have been done post-war. May come down to one of those "who knows?" cases.

Ha! I suspected as much. Trust me, the collecting side of the hobby is WAY more fun! I'm about to give up on my buying/selling effort.

Mark, That was one, tiny, hard to find Seki stamp, for sure! I couldn't keep my eyes off that "G" above it! That's a really nice piece, overall, with the leather cover in good shape. Pricing is tough to call, as the market is almost completely stopped with the COVID thing going on. WWII officer gunto NORMALLY are in the range of $900-1,400. I personally feel yours is worth $1,000-1,200. But good luck getting a buyer.

After comparing the 2, the side with, what I thought was different script - they simply flipped 2 lines. One is the date you mentioned Showa 15 (same on both), and the other is something else, but the same "something" on both blades. He's added 2 "flower" stamps to your example too. Must but a highly coveted "upgrade" to the 1941 model! Ha! Even this example, a waki, from Turner's page (http://jssus.org/nkp/fake_japanese_swords.html)

This particular faker-maker uses the exact same pattern. Here is another one with the same design and number. The script on the other sides seems to differ though.

Stamps Doc 5.1 - a couple more hotstamps added; some editorial cleaning; slight re-arrangment of some pictures. No major changes, but enough for an update (and maybe I just need something to do since there's not much going on!!!) Stamp 5.1.pdf

I expect you should be able to find a gunto with an older, gendai blade in it for that price. The expensive ones you are seeing are likely from someone famous, or the owner has paid over $2,000 for a polish. It's not something I look for, so somebody who collects nihonto will have to help you with where and how to find one like that, but it is definitely possible. The only one I have is in kai-gunto (navy) fittings, so it cost me $2,400. Kaigunto sell for more than army gunto; plus this had sharkskin saya and a family mon. So I paid extra. The blade is mumei and likely from the Muromachi (late Koto) period. Not much to look at, but like you, I just love holding a sword that was being made when Columbus was sailing the ocean blue! Pretty amazing.

Rich , Pics of the blade, as clear and close as possible, help the guys make a judgement about how it’s made.

The short answer is - No there is no "bluebook" sort of pricing list for WWII gunto. And you're asking at a weird time. The COVID thing has almost completely shut down the market. Some guys are still buying, but even when they do, the swords are either held up in shipping for extended periods or refused by air-carriers and returned. Having said that, officer gunto tend to run $900-1,400 in good condition (less if messed up); and NCO Type95s run $700-1,400 for the standard issue (much more for copper-handle and very late war). So, under usual circumstances you wouldn't be able to get both for $1,500. More like $2,000 for both, for average condition.

JP is correct. There is a longer thread about these, but I cannot find it.

It also semi-dates your blade, as all known examples of the stamp were used between late 1940 to early 1942 - so most likely 1941.

I recently wrote to Rock Island Auctions to let them know a post-war Toyokawa souvenir gunto they were selling was not a IJA military sword. Their response: "Good Afternoon Mr. Pennington, Thank you so much for reaching out to us here at Rock Island Auction Company. Our describer team has reviewed your email and have provided me with the following response. Basic research does indicate that Toyokawa continued making non-traditional swords in the occupation era chiefly for consumption by the U.S. post exchange system. This is the "pattern" of the sword - it is not listed original. It is a Shin Gunto Pattern Japanese Sword. If I can be of any further assistance, please do not hesitate to reach back out. Sincerely, Alexandria NM. Andrews Customer Service Representative | Rock Island Auction Company | website: www.rockislandauction.com phone: 800-238-8022 | fax: 309-797-1655 | email: Aandrews@rockislandauction.com 7819 42nd Street West, Rock Island, IL 61201" Incredible. So as long as they put "Pattern" or "Style" in the title, they think it's Ok to call it anything they want to to mislead the unsuspecting buyer. As always "Buyer Beware".

That’s a good point JP. Just got this back from eBay’s MAPCARGO: “Hi Bruce, DHL can not deliver blades over 5 inch , so this sword is classified as dangerous good If you would like to ship other blades over 5 inch again, please choose different service not eISD Best regards Niko Nikolov eISD”

Great discovery Chris! Just curious about the number - was it scratched onto the kojiri?

Thanks guys. This time, they've used "MAPCARGO", 2501 Redondo Beach, CA. I got the same response from the buyer. He's a collector and says he's had a dozen swords shipped to him, some from the USA, in the past year with not trouble. Maybe it's just the COVID backlog and whatever carrier they tried to use is just maxed out. I've given him the choice to wait for it to return to me, and I'll pay to ship it myself, or he can have a refund.

Well, I just got this from Ebay International Shipping: "Our shipping partners have notified us that the package cannot be delivered due to either the temporary suspension of service or custom prohibited regulations in the destination country. Please note that the item is being returned to you and, if it is not listed below, we will add tracking for the return shipment to the eBay transaction once it is available. We are sorry this has happened, and we want to make sure you are taken care of. You will be refunded the cost of the eBay international shipping label on your next invoice and will not be charged for the return shipping." I bought the shipping lable from ebay, to be shipped through USPS. But it turns out that ebay has their own international contract with someone in Redondo beach, who has obviously refused this sword. I sold it to a guy in Montreal, through ebay. Now they're sending it back to me! Last time I will use their shipping labels for international. Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr.

We need to combine the two threads. If we had an Admin that loved us, he'd do that for us! *XOXO*