JOE HLOUCHA`S TSUBA COLLECTION

[BIG]

https://publikace.nm...Kraemerova_ocred.pdf

[vajo]

Many trödel. I wonder what i looked at. 

[Spartancrest]

I did a cleaned up copy of this collection with a few corrections - I wonder if Brian can add this up-dated version to the download section? The images in my version are much clearer - - disclaimer - still plenty of wrong information present from the original [so don't blame me!] I did a printed book copy for my own records 85 pages- PM if you want a copy - research purposes only and not for general sale. 

 

 

   

 

 

 

  

[ROKUJURO]

Thanks Peter!

TSUBA fig. 9a/9b has a wrong description. Not clouds but waves. Looks a bit like a famous YAGYU design.

Looking at the early date when these were 'gathered', it is interesting to see how a collection was built up in these times and what was seen as collectable. I think however, these TSUBA would look a bit different with good pictures. 

[BIG]

Hi Jean, absolutely right. I check my sources and see the 9a/b ident. BAD LUCK NUMBER so..

 

BEST Peter

[Spartancrest]

19 hours ago, BIG said:

9a/b

Waves for sure! 

[BIG]

9a/b

 

Tatsunami (standing wave ) design, original made in the early edo time.

 

prob. Kodai yagyu, like it very much, esp. the „thin“ waves..

[BIG]

Ausgewählte Japanische Kunstschwerter / Selected Fine Japanese Swords

NBTHK EUROPEAN BRANCH

Deutsches Klingen Museum Solingen

[Spartancrest]

The PDF states that 

"The swords guards in the second group represent the opposite extreme; they can be
characterized as souvenirs and were probably given free of charge to the buyer when his
purchase was big enough. This often happened in both Japanese or European antique
shops. They were nice presents even though they have no historical or artistic value
(Fig.Nos. 21, 39, 45, 56, 75, 76) and they probably motivated the buyer to come to the shop again."

 

Now 21. is a "Hachiman Sparrow" and unlikely to be a fake or just "given away".

39. is cast, see Dan Tsuba's multiple examples from page 13 ["Tsuba casting molds?" thread]   
45. tale of Genji - unable to see enough to tell if it is a 'modern' copy, so a big ? mark.
56. crude images - likely cast
75. monkey and kanji - common theme but not necessarily cast. A copy or utsushi is more likely.
76. likely a very worn copy/utsushi. There is a thicker rim version in the Cleveland Art Museum  no. 1919.373

 

So in my opinion not all the "free gifts" are rubbish but a few have snuck into that collection that could be "thinned out" - except they too are part of the trade history between Japan and the West and I guess they represent what passed as 'collectable' in the early 20th century. 

[vajo]

Come on. Thats the worst collection i ever noticed. 

Dale that is trash in my eyes. 

[Spartancrest]

2 hours ago, vajo said:

Dale that is trash in my eyes. 

It's not my collection - don't shoot the messenger. You are right though, it is not a collection of much value and lots of questionable pieces. The way the images were done in the original Pdf don't help either, couldn't they take nice clear images back in 2007? It isn't 1907 and those images could pass for being done in 1807!

[vajo]

No Dale its not about you, sorry. But i wonder that no one says that it is trash. All the pieces are not worth to waste time. I think its just a joke or the museum is total uneducated.

[Brian]

Chris,
Are you having a bad day or something? I see many that aren't exactly top grade work...but they are perfectly legitimate examples of tsuba that would have been used hundreds of years ago on swords. Maybe they aren't the finest examples, and there are some poor examples mixed in, but I see quite a few nice tsuba there that I would gladly owned. Saying a collection is 'trash' and that ALL are not worth the time is far from true.

[DirkO]

I would agree the larger part of this collection is situated at the lower end of the spectrum, we all collect within our own capabilities. But the pictures aren't doing them any favours either!

Item 41 - they used the same side twice!

 

There's a few in there I think if you saw them in hand, would look quite different.

[Spartancrest]

27 minutes ago, DirkO said:

Item 41 - they used the same side twice!

We might get a ura view from this Chinese copy. Not very pretty either.  The monkey on the right has his right arm going in the opposite direction - down instead of up.

I wonder if the design was stolen from the Hloucha's pdf?  Many of these fake guards are designed from published works - they don't need to own or even view the original piece these days. 

[George KN]

Thanks for the pdf! The more online resources the better  

[vajo]

Brian i have not a bad day. I read the things and try to discover something new. But this is what it is.

 

The text refers further to 11 Tsuba of high quality in his collection. 

37; 38; 48; 50; 51; 55; 61; 62; 67; 69; 70 

 

The second group are characterized als souvernirs.

The third group are better quality.

The last group are not real sword guards. 

 

They were nice presents even though they have no historical or artistic value
(Fig.Nos. 21, 39, 45, 56, 75, 76) and they probably motivated the buyer to come to the shop
again. 

 

So lets take a look on the 11 high quality pieces which are described in the text.

37.

 

38.

 

48.

 

50.

 

51.

 

55.

 

61.

 

62.

 

67.

 

69.

 

70.

 

 

 

For my personal interest i would like to see this decoration tsuba in color.

 

 

[Spartancrest]

Some colour ones here - but there are a lot of fakes and really ugly "things"

 

     https://www.militaria.co.za/nmb/topic/32778-merry-friends-of-y-auction/page/4/

 

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/373960524735          https://www.liveauct...sword-dagger-tsubas/

 

[Spartancrest]

Chris there is a better version of number 69. here  https://www.jauce.com/auction/c1135298510    There are always another one somewhere. 

 

 

Is it just me or does number 61. look like a ski resort with chair lifts?  

[PNSSHOGUN]

This one really got me, what an absolute howler

 

[vajo]

He carries his rips on his knee. Freedom af art. 😂

[Spartancrest]

Number 26 a/b  has a utsushi for sale  https://hareitiba-ja...antique-koshirae-edo

Rusty Crab anyone?