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What makes koto swords so desirable?


piryohae3

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I often get vague answers like "they look different." Is it the hada, sugata, or hamon? All 3? I've seen in a number of videos featuring contemporary smiths that say they're trying to recreate Kamakura period blades but none feel like they've fully achieved it. What features of the koto swords specifically are they trying to recreate?

 

I can find great HD pictures of koto blades that show the hada really well (as pictured below) but not for contemporary swords because they're taken too far away to see it. I want to see a side by side comparison to see if modern swords really don't look as good or if modern tosho are being modest.

post-5106-0-61152400-1574977328_thumb.jpg

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Sorry it is too large a subject for a quick answer. There are many who believe sword making reached its peak in the 14th century. while its true there have been very many masterpiece works made aftrer this time none quite reached the level of perfection achieved by these koto smiths. The main reason for this was the raw material produced in small quantities locally. Each had slight variation and characteristics that embued a blade with unique qualities. when  steel manufacture was centralised and greater volumes of swords produced to meet increasing demand much of the unique qualities of earler work was lost.

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I'm not so sure that it's mainly the local satesu - for example, after Kaneshige moved to Mino from Echizen, his swords still maintained the typical blackish, "Northern" jigane; I can't imagine that he had brought tons of sand from his old province.  :dunno:

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No, not just the satetsu, water, or anything else, except technique. Until you can train your brain & eye to SEE the differences, nothing anyone will say can really describe it.

 

From Momoyama onward, blades were made to be "flashy," both because the Kamakura techniques had been lost in time, & because the blades no longer needed to be used in battle for year after year. That flashiness appealed to many Tokugawa Era Samurai, & it still appeals to many/most Westerners...which leaves the older blades to those of us who have learned to appreciate them!

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In the TATARA, it is always just pure iron that is produced. There are no 'alloys' coming out of the furnace! The amount of impurities is very small and does not influence the properties or the looks of a blade to any reasonal extent. As Ken pointed out, it is indeed the forging technique as main factor to produce differences. If you imagine how complicated the construction of a blade can be, plus the care and precision the smith applied to the process, it is evident where the quality comes from.  

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So, let me try to add to what our esteemed friends have said above. I collect only Koto blades and I collect them as I am enthralled with their beauty, rarity and significance. The latter revolves around the founding ancestors of later smiths and people who have established the original schools.

 

There was a question by the original poster about how to compare, via photos, modern and old swords. Firstly, let me stipulate that Darcy Brockbank’s and Ted Tenold’s technique of shooting swords is second to none. It is a combination of skilful lighting, the appropriate positioning of the blade and a lot of interplay of focus, aperture, lighting etc. Other people take great sword photos with a lot of detail and high resolution but the angled shots of DB and TT are better for feeling the hataraki and shades of Utsuri.

 

So if you go to DB’s website, yuhindo.com, you will see how informative their photos are. You asked about old and new swords. Well, again you have everything on Darcy’s website: Heian blades (look at the Tomonari, the ko-Hoki, the Gojo), early to mid Kamakura (Mitsutada, Moriie, the Go, Shizu), late Kamakura to Nanbokucho (Kagemitsu and Nagamitsu, Y Ichimonji, Hasebe etc) and so on, all the way to the modern blades that you wanted to see (Ono Yoshimitsu, Gassan, Shibata Ke).

 

All you need to do is open a couple of browsers and put blades side by side in the browser windows, as the method of shooting is the same. So, you can compare the Ono Yoshimitsu to the KoHoki or the Kagemitsu.

 

Now, in my view, the jihada of the the Shinto and ShinShinto and modern blades lacks the vibrancy and beauty of the old blades. That is because the nie and konie and yubashiri and utsuri are not usually there on modern blades. Or if they are there, they look giddy, contrived and forced.

 

Also, look at the hamon of the older blades. You will see all sorts of activities in there - sunagashi, kinsuji, tobiyaki, yo, sprinkles of nie and kaleidoscope of colours. Modern (or new) blades to me are simply not as exciting and while the Shinto and onwards hamon, prima facie, might look flamboyant, actually look below the wavy forms and close to the ha ( and also just below the nioiguchi) to check actually what activity is there. You will notice that if you strip the flamboyance, there is not much going on. Even if there is, the control will not be the same or the nie crystals will be large and crude (ara nie). So, either the mastery to achieve any hataraki was not there, or the control is not the same and the outcome is cruder.

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All you need to do is open a couple of browsers and put blades side by side in the browser windows, as the method of shooting is the same. So, you can compare the Ono Yoshimitsu to the KoHoki or the Kagemitsu.

I've done that but the hada looks blurry to me, both antique and modern. Guess I don't have the eye to tell the difference.

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You're right, James, & the only way you'll ever be able to see the differences is by looking at high-quality blades, preferable in-hand. Some photographers, like DB, RKG, & Ed at Yakiba.com, can take good-enough quality images that you can learn something, but it's not the same as being able to hold & to look closely at blades, with someone pointing out what you should be seeing.

 

We've all had to go through this process, so don't think it's just you.

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I've done that but the hada looks blurry to me, both antique and modern. Guess I don't have the eye to tell the difference.

???

 

Even I with my poor eyesight (astigmatism and myopia) can see the hada and finest detail on the Yuhindo website. Not meaning to be patronising or condescending but might it be time for new glasses or a session with some folks who can teach you what to look at?

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#1 = Tanto; mumei, Juyo Bijutsuhin attributed to Masamune; known as Hachisuka Masamune

#2 = Katana, shumei Rai Kunimitsu

#3 = Tachi, signed Sanekage (Ko-Hoki)

#4 = Wakizashi; signed Hizen Tadahiro

#5 = Katana signed Gassan Sadatoshi, dated Heisei 30 = 2018

 

Uwe G.

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Longest running debate in Nihonto. Nothing to ad. Great works can be found across all the era's. The accepted rule is that the better Koto era blades are better works than the other era's. In the end it's going to come down to what appeals to any one collector and what they are after/find they desire. 

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Koto blades are most desirable to folk that desire koto blades. (and can afford the good ones)

 

If your not in that department for one reason or another, look for what offers the best bang for your buck.

 

Although prices in these departments seems to steadily increasing. (late edo, ww2, mukansa)

 

Becoming wary of mentioning certain names on here now, in case I assist in a price increase and put those out off reach too  :glee:

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(DISCLAIMER: the following is just meant to answer the OP’s question in the most unfair, dishonest way and shouldn’t be taken literally. What the previous posters say about Koto swords is true and this shall only be taken as a caustic reply in which most, if not all is exaggerated!) :)

 

Soooooo! What makes Koto swords so desirable?

 

Let me be, for a moment, the fly in the ointment! :)

 

1) TRADITION: just as everything was “better before”, so it is with swords. Japanese swords were made by a very rigid society that engendered a rigid hobby. So obviously, past and venerable techniques are necessarily better than newer ones, even if, at the time, they were only dictated by what swordsmiths had at their disposal.

 

2) PRIDE: have you ever heard someone boasting he’s driving a Peugeot? Nope! People who drive Ferrari do! Same here! It’s always more delightful to awe somebody by saying:” I have a 700 year-old sword” than: “I have a 70 year old sword”. The worst of the shame being : “I have a Chinese wallhanger!”

 

3) SLOTH: let’s face it, Koto swords are easier to study than Shinto swords. Learning about 5 traditions is always easier than learning a multitude of traditions.

 

4) FAKE NEWS: everyone knows Kamakura and Nambokucho swords were perfect! No, really! They had beauty, grace, efficiency... wait? Efficiency? They were so practical and efficient that they had to be suriage during the Sengoku era to be useful in battle.

 

5) SIZE MATTERS: Everyone knows Shinto swords are useless because they weren’t made for battle but to display showy qualities. Not so with Koto swords! Eeeerrr! What about those Nambokucho swords where samurai from the Southern and Northern court fought to see who had the longer one? I mean the sword, right? Isn’t that being showy?

 

6) SCARCITY: actually, this is my only serious argument, so no joke here. Most of the swords on the market today are Shinto swords. It’s logical. After all, they are more recent, didn’t experience real battle, so it is normal that we find an array of swords ranging from bad to excellent. Now, the early Koto swords are more scarce. It’s logical too. They’re older so had many more opportunities to be lost, destroyed, whatever. So it’s also logical to postulate that most of those that survived were cherished family swords of quality. If this is the case, we can also postulate that many swords of lower quality disappeared in the maelstrom of time, leaving only the upper quality swords. Thus, those Koto swords we have are truly better than the more recent ones because the good ones are the only one left!

 

Once again, anyone feeling piqued by my post, please read the disclaimer and realize this was written with a very humorous effect in mind! Please don’t send an evil ninja to exterminate me! :)

 

In the end collect what you like and attracts your eye until you stumble upon your own personal treasure.

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J.p.

While said in humour I have heard all of your points offered as serious comment at one time or another during the past 35+ years I have been collecting

From a purely personal perspective I have no doubt that Kamakura period swords are far better than anything that followed in the words of George Cameron Stone they truly are the nearest thing to perfection made by human hand and that has nothing to do with the points you suggest.

They are just better

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Well, that comforts me as it is the only one I really believe in. The other points, well, they’re the usual arguments you hear. I honestly haven’t ever seen a Kamakura/Nambokucho era sword other than in pictures, so I’m a poor judge of their quality and I rely on you guys opinion when it comes to that.

 

Still I like to make fun of the sacred, it’s just in my poor atheist nature! :)

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For me it is thinking about the romantic history behind them. My own interest in Japanese swords mostly spans from Heian until mid-Muromachi. Bit similarily my interest in European swords mostly spans from Migration period until end of Renaissance. Can't really explain why shortly but I just think for example viking age is interesting as is the Nanbokuchō period and so on. Just the time and history that is fascinating to me.

 

Unfortunately I don't think there is too much researched data in English about steel analysis regarding regional changes in Japanese history. We have had few threads about it over the years, here is one: http://www.militaria.co.za/nmb/topic/23184-steel-analysis-of-different-regional-schools/

 

As I know I cannot afford the fine quality top tier old swords and partly because living here up north, I've been really fascinated about bit lesser known rural schools. Some time ago I also encountered an article by Yoshikawa Kentaro about swords in Northern Japan and it had greatly informative bit where he mentioned that somewhat rough hada "hadatatsu" "hadamono" that often is prominent in swords of Northern region actually improves the performance in cold climate and hadamono swords offer good flexibility and strength. Living here in cold north myself I find stuff like this really fascinating. I don't consider myself as an art connoisseur who goes after top quality (as it is way beyond my means) but kinda low/mid tier collector going after what I consider to be interesting items. Hōju or Gassan tachi from up north would be right up my alley where as most of the serious collectors would not find item like that too interesting.

 

Historical preference is also one thing that will push people towards certain great makers. If those swords were highly regarded at the time when they were actually used, you can take it that they really were and are great swords. This is just a personal opinion and may very well be wrong but I'd think late Kamakura and Nanbokuchō period swords might be softer and more durable than Edo period swords. Therefore in general they performed very well in battle and were well rounded swords.

 

Also I think modern Japanese swordsmiths are very modest in general. I believe many of the modern makers make excellent swords that would have been cherished in historical period. I think warriors of old would have been proud to carry swords that some modern smiths are producing.

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I think warriors of old would have been proud to carry swords that some modern smiths are producing.

Probably true, Jussi, but would modern blades have stood up in battle? We don't know, because no one fights with Nihonto these days, & I don't plan to try Tachi Uchi No Kurai with anything useful, including shinsakuto!

 

Those old-timer tosho spent lots of time ensuring that their blades would be useful in battle, with techniques that are long-lost. Modern blades are good, but if I had to fight, I'd want one of my Kamakura blades.

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I will throw my own Jean Pierre inspired comment in for the fracas:

 

Muromachi swords are NOT Koto.

 

This is my own take. Koto ended with the Nambokucho period. There are perhaps a smattering of a few good smiths/works in the Muromachi period, but to me, it's not the level of work to qualify as "Koto". And of course this is the era where all the Kanesada, Sukesada, something-sada works come from that end up taking so much bandwidth here on NMB and FB with questions like "is this THE something-sada, the good one?". Usually, no it's not.

 

Darcy of course explains this better than I ever could here:

https://blog.yuhindo.com/visualization/

 

Key Chart; all Juyo and higher blades by era. The Muromachi period is the wilderness:

post-4009-0-87465700-1575240765_thumb.jpg

 

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