Ronald Aguirre Posted July 18 Report Posted July 18 Hey all, a seller has this copper handle NCO for sale, but I’m not sure of its authenticity. I don’t think the saya is correct for it. But I guess that could be a battlefield pickup. What are your thoughts? Is it authentic or a fake? Quote
robinalexander Posted July 18 Report Posted July 18 Hi Ronald I'm on my phone somy pics are terrible but I dont like thd look of it. Your right about the saya so to start with it's only 1/2 a copper. The tsuka does not look genuine copper (to light). The sarute wore looks overly large. The stamps look backwards and the seller hasn't even given u a shot of the blade number and stamp. Ask for clearer close up pics first. Rob Quote
drb 1643 Posted July 18 Report Posted July 18 Wrong tsuba also. I would walk away from this one. Tom Quote
Scogg Posted July 18 Report Posted July 18 Hmmm, interesting one. I agree, that you should probably walk away. Too many things are not quite right, and any attempt to move this sword in the future would raise the same red flags. I have actually seen this same sword before, and recorded it as a "heavily altered example". I record things in red font that do not adhere to factory specifications that I am aware of; while I record fakes on a different list. 2282 東 Copper, ? Punctured offset ito Steel Copper Suya, TO 東 , Kokura**** Wrong saya, leather covered Facebook 2025 Real blade+parts but suspect sarute. Steel tsuba. Heavily modified or repaired* What I see as wrong: Pattern3 tsuba, wrong saya, wrong sarute. The Pattern1 copper handles did not have a mekugi in that spot, but rather relied on the barrel nut where the sarute is located. What appears right: The blade looks good. Correct Pattern1 habaki. The tsuka has the correct ito alternation, and the mekugi is in the right place for the ito situation, which matches early Pattern2 placement. You sometimes see this with field/wartime repairs. My opinion: I think everything is real except maybe the sarute. I suspect this item is either pieced together from parts, or a heavily modified wartime repair. Just my thoughts with not ideal photos. All the best, -Sam 1 Quote
Stegel Posted July 18 Report Posted July 18 Hi Ron, I agree with Scogg's summary of the sword. A bonus i see, is the leather saya cover, even if well worn, these are hard to come by on any type95. Some better pics would help to determine if it appears original to the saya or a later addition. Do you have the serial number on the throat of the scabbard,or can you get it from the seller ? I'm sure there would be some people interested to see if it's matching. After a second look, it may be that the saya is made of wood? Can't be sure with the poor quality of photo. i have seen this style of sarute on two other copper handled swords before, here in Australia, not very pretty, but i think they may be field replacements. The mounting screw in the handle is typical of a field/factory repair, as is the steel variation of the tsuba from what i have seen previously. The pattern 3 steel tsuba appears surprisingly early in the production run and was produced concurrently with the pattern 2 brass tsuba variation as observed from production serial numbers. The fuchi stamps are genuine and not any cause for alarm, the sub-contractor and Arsenal logos, being reversed, have been observed on quite a few of the early Copper handled swords in the early serial number ranges (below 3000 from memory). This makes the sword a bit more desirable in my opinion as a collector. The asking price is what would swing my decision to buy or not. Overall the sword is not pristine and shouldn't justify a high end price. It depends what you are looking for as a collector and how happy you would be with it. If you do get it, please post some nice quality photos back here for us to look over. 3 2 Quote
Conway S Posted July 18 Report Posted July 18 Here’s the cross reference to this sword when it was discussed a few months ago. See bottom of page 17: 1 1 Quote
Conway S Posted July 18 Report Posted July 18 To Stegel’s point about the swapped tsuba, here is another example, but the seppa are correct for the the pattern 3: https://whartonmilitaria.co.uk/details.php?section=edgeweapons&item=EW0048 2 Quote
Scogg Posted July 18 Report Posted July 18 Good spot Conway, no wonder this sword was so familiar Great to see you posting Stegel , -Sam 1 Quote
Kiipu Posted July 18 Report Posted July 18 5 hours ago, Stegel said: the sub-contractor and Arsenal logos, being reversed, have been observed on quite a few of the early Copper handled swords Stegel commented on this many years ago and more recently I posted a list of them. Whats the DEMAND for early copper handled type 95 ncos swords?? The sword above got overhauled or repaired at some point in its active service. 1 Quote
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.