Katana authenticity: should I wait for a show?

[oyhou]

Hi there,

 

About a month ago I acquired a katana at an estate auction (I was there to buy antiques and it caught my eye). I've ordered a few books and done a fair bit of internet research to try to determine its authenticity but I'm not sure how far down the rabbit hole I'm ready to go. I sent pictures of the sword to two resources (one in Japan, one in the US) and got two different answers as to its authenticity, so I feel I might be best served letting an expert actually hold it, along with the experience of attending a show, which sounds like a fun experience, even if I decide nihonto ultimately isn't for me.

 

If I attend the upcoming Midwest Token Kai in Chicago (around a 12 hour drive), or similar (maybe an enthusiast club meeting; I've looked into various chapters of the JSSUS and searched for Japanese sword clubs, the closest appears to be in Denver, about 13 hours from me), will there be someone, maybe someone from here, to chat with or who I can show a sword to see if it is authentic? I spoke with Mark Jones (the guy running the show if I understand correctly) about the show's NTHK shinsa but "authentic" or not the sword has a false signature so it won't pass; paying the $100 for the shinsa seems superfluous, and if it's not authentic, embarrassing.

 

Thanks!

 

Allen

[Grey Doffin]

Hi Allen,

Post pix here; you'll get the answer you're seeking.

Grey

[Tcat]

[John A Stuart]

I saw your question, it is fine here I think. More people will answer as time wears on, but, pictures as noted would be nice and perhaps helpful. John

[Jamie]

There's no sword club in Denver that I know of and I'm here.

Post some good pictures and you'll get a conclusion.

[oyhou]

Thanks everyone for your replies. As full disclosure: my original intention was to sell these swords after receiving word back from a sword dealer in Tokyo that they are authentic. However, I immediately withdrew them from sale after someone here in the States told me that they're inauthentic (I have no intention of ever cheating anyone). If they turn out to be inauthentic then I won't be too bummed as I've already turned a profit on my acquisitions from that particular estate sale.

 

Here are links to the pictures; they're very high-resolution so I think it best to link to them on Dropbox. However, if anyone would rather I shrink them and post them here as attachments I can do so. Just let me know.

 

Sword Photos

http://tinyurl.com/jvv94au

 

Signature Photos

http://tinyurl.com/lws3xvj

 

Panoramic Photos of blade

http://tinyurl.com/luw6zcf

 

Thanks,

Allen

[oyhou]

There's no sword club in Denver that I know of and I'm here.

 

Hi there,

 

I was referring to the third listing I found on this site: http://www.nihonto.com/upclub.html . I assume it must now be defunct.

 

Thanks,

Allen

[Mark]

Allen

 

very wise to post pictures, will save you $100 and some embarrassment, in my opinion it is a modern Chinese fake. Please check "Fake swords" link above

[bone]

Yup. Afraid he's right. One curious thing is the hamon actually raised above the blade?

BTW if you want something real that's inexpensive there was one on the for sale thread you should take a look at. Hang in!

[Peter Bleed]

I vote with Mark.

Peter

[Brian]

Not the worst fake by any means. Oil tempered Showato that have been etched or acid washed have a hamon that looks like that.

Someone put a lot of work into faking that, if it is a fake. Yasurime and decent lines.

I'd go with fake, but does need to be checked out further. Wouldn't be more than an arsenal WW2 blade anyways if it was real.

 

Brian

[Dr Fox]

The mei looks machine rolled not chiseled, especially where strokes cross each other.

[oyhou]

I appreciate everyone's replies and time. The provenance of the estate items surrounding the swords do point to their origin being Japan; at an auction one has to consider lots of factors and try to create an unbiased story when one is about to participate in competitive bidding. Other items included WW2 Japanese army boots, uniform materials, sidearm holsters, belts, WW2 era rising sun flags, spears from several Pacific islands, Japanese art that appeared era correct and more. Lots of items from the auction were going for hundreds of dollars and a few items went for thousands, including what was probably the most beautiful Japanese room screen I've ever seen.

 

For what it's worth I scoured this site's threads, eBay, and the links referenced above including the Fake Swords page. In fact the way I found this forum was while I was at the estate auction I used my smartphone and googled "fake katana" and found the http://jssus.org/ page referenced above and looked through its guide before bidding started. I probably looked at pictures of over a thousand "fake" swords in detail over the past few weeks since my acquisitions, especially on eBay, and looked at pictures of hundreds of genuine Japanese forged blades as well. It's been fun. If I'm at an auction again and see swords I might take the risk again to be candid, but for now I think I'll stick with furniture, art, old toys, and comic books.

 

My next goal is to see if they're, like Brian says they might be, mid-20th century blades. Honestly I think they could be used as excellent cutters. Everything has value for somebody. I'd still like to be able to put them in the hands of an expert to really get a good solid opinion and appraisal.

 

If nothing else, for the purposes of members of this forum, the pictures might be educational. I'll take good pictures of the other blade and post them here. I just got a new macro lens for my camera I've been wanting to try out.

 

Thanks,

Allen

[Grey Doffin]

Hi Allen,

Not all blades should be used for cutting, only well made ones. A friend learned the hard way when a Chinese katana shattered in a cut and the flying pieces came back at him.

The easiest way to see what the fakes look like is to search ebay for Japanese Sword and specify that the results are located in China; they're all fake.

Grey