Kozuka from Col Hartley's Collection...

[Jorgensen]

Hi Folks,

 

I looked at the website of Col Hartley's Collection the other day and have this Kozuka I recognized immediately. It seems to be the very same one.

 

So it of course was a little funny and made me want to know more. The Kozuka seems to be late Edo, but does any have an idea about school? Maybe someone even did know Dean Hartley and have seen it before?

 

Below is the picture from his website and my own pictures for comparison.

[Brian]

Jimi,

Same theme/workshop, but I do not think the same kozuka. There are tiny differences.

 

Brian

[Jorgensen]

Hi Brian,

 

Luckily its possible to open a large picture from the Col Hartley website to better study and there are some spots and details that are identical and makes me sure its the same kozuka. Also when changing the angle of light reveals the same bumps and irregularities. Its the light on the pictures that makes the difference. I have pointed one of the spots out on this image, but thats only one identical out of many.

[Kai-Gunto]

Same motif , but still many differences.

 

Try look at his hat, the fur on the top is not identical.

 

The rings near his hand are different too.

[Stephen]

as is his sash, yours looks to be two cords

[Jorgensen]

As I say, its the angle of the light that makes a huge difference... However, any opinions on school? Judging kozuka is absolutely not my strongest side and if any have some info to share, it will be greatly appreciated, thank you.

[Gabriel L]

I am actually with Jimi on this one. I can see at least half a dozen incidental small bumps and divots which correspond between the two — but are very subtle in one photo or the other due to the completely different lighting. Just for example, look at the small bump inside the loop of the cord. What at first appear to be discrepancies are all accountable via the light shift and glare/bleed in the overexposed regions. Be forewarned, not only can the lighting difference cause glare and artifacts, but also complex camera lens distortions can subtly shift proportions.

 

Jimi, re-photograph your kozuka with on-axis light and it will be more obvious.

[Brian]

Jimi,

Not sure if generic kinko stuff like this made in late Edo would have a particular school. Nice, but I don't think there are specific schools assigned to this.

 

Brian

[Eric H]

Slight differences, strikingly the belt loop

Eric

[Brian]

Bottom part of the eye of the dog..not easily explained by lighting differences.

Doesn't matter if the same or not really. Quality is the same and obviously out of the same workshop.

 

Brian

[Darcy]

It would have been helpful to try to photograph it with the same lighting to remove the lighting illusions heh...

 

There are some little marks that fingerprint it and make it hard to say it is different, like this little pattern at the bottom.

 

However the color one has details that the black and white one does not, like two lines in the hat, and the hat is more pointy. If you put them directly on top of each other in photoshop then animate it the figures are not in the same place.

 

This is like one of those picture games, spot the 10 differences. The figure's index finger holding the rope on the black and white is open and through the gap you can see the rope underneath, in the color one it is closed. In fact all of the fingers are curved in the black and white one and they are straight on the color one. Mouth is open wider on the black and white one. The cuff of the shirt on the right hand is very different on both in shape and position. The right hand is closer to the edge in the color one than the black and white one as well.

 

It would seem to me that there may be some kind of a form that was used to impart the texture onto the ground before the figure was laid in and that has created the similar marks.

[Darcy]

I knocked out the color, this is part of the illusion since you're making your brain work to try to neutralize that first (as far as a computer is concerned these are radically different images). Once that is compensated for, you're left with the lighting illusions which you still have to cancel out in your head, and also the rotate orientation which makes it hard to note the differences (like if you look at someone frowning but they are upside down it registers as a smile still ... or even stranger... like this:

 

 

If you have a laptop pick it up and rotate it 180 degrees and you will see what I mean).

 

So basically to try to compare something like this at best you need to remove all the extra overhead that you're forcing onto your brain with the color change, sideways orientation (we see depth over the horizontal plane with our eyes since we kind of grew up on a flat earth and that's how our eyes are laid out and why nothing really went with one eye on top of the other as a good solution to binocular vision), and lastly lighting change, then you can start noticing the detail differences.

[Antti]

I dont think they are one and the same. The recession around the dogs eye, the shape of the man's nose, the shape of the top of the hat.

 

Also on the other Kozuka the leash is attached to a ring where in the other it is tied with a knot.

[Ed]

I won't comment on whether or not they may be the same kozuka. With the variation in lighting, etc., I don't think you will ever get total agreement one way or the other.

 

Frankly, I don't see the point. It is at best an average piece which may or may not have passed through his hands.

 

What I can tell you is that most of the stuff on that site was sold long ago. I knew Dean as well or better than anyone for some twenty five years, and was the only person aside from himself to have a key to his vault as well as unlimited access. I do not remember this kozuka being in his collection within the last twenty five years. You must keep in mind that he was dealing in this stuff before most of us were alive. He was a Marine Corp. aviator during WWII and was in Japan as soon as the war was over. Which is where he began his study of Nihonto under the premier scholars of the day, such as Dr. Honma and Dr. Sato. Many, many swords and fittings passed through his hands over a span of fifty years.

 

Dean kept meticulous records, all of which I now own. It is unbelievable how many individual items of Japanese art went through his hands, swords, fittings, armor, pottery, paintings, guns, coins, etc., etc., literally thousands.

[Jorgensen]

When windowshopping a bit, I fell over the very same style kozuka on a koshirae listed on Aoi Art...

http://www.aoijapan.com/img/sword/2013/ ... shirae.jpg

 

Funny...

[jason_mazzy]

I thought it was the one from AOI art

[Sly]

Hi.
 

I asked to a local auction house here in France some photos of a tanto which will be at auction next week. Look at the kozuka ! Funny ! What can we conclude ? All these different kozuka were cast ?

 

Sylvain

[Pete Klein]

They were mass produced out of thin, cheap mettle, probably by repousse' technique along with thousands of other items to be sold to foreign markets to bring currency into Japan to support it's transformation into a 'modern' state.  This is why you run across so many of these items in foreign collections of the day.  If the piece looks like you could dent it with a bit of finger pressure, it's most likely one of these.