Kai-Gunto Posted November 6, 2013 Report Share Posted November 6, 2013 I need to share this. I got a sword on hold a week ago and was about to pay yesterday via bank transfer , then I got a mail from them this morning that the sword was sold to another. He didnt get it on hold , He just payed for it. And I could say godbye to the sword I was planning to buy. I will never deal with them , cus will they do it again? Does anybody have the same expirence? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stephen Posted November 6, 2013 Report Share Posted November 6, 2013 Thomas Ive had good experaince in buying from them, not a sword, but Tsuba. Things happen in internet sales, id give them another chance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex A Posted November 6, 2013 Report Share Posted November 6, 2013 As annoying as it may be, i was just thinking how many sales they may loose by folk dropping out whilst an item is on hold. In Aoi,s defence, it is good of them to put items on hold without taking a deposit, maybe the offer of "fast cash" was just too much to turn away. Alex. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kai-Gunto Posted November 6, 2013 Author Report Share Posted November 6, 2013 In the mail from Aoiart , was a confirmation on the hold and they would get back to me with shipping info ,either Fedex or EMS. Please pay all bank fees , they say. Bank transfer is expencive and the transfer could have coursed issues. I will not think twice ,am not gonna deal with them at all. I have a friend that bourght a sword from them and it was mixed parts on the complete koshirae that didnt match the blade in shirasaya. they didnt tell. In my world its fraud. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jean Posted November 6, 2013 Report Share Posted November 6, 2013 No problem whatsoever, I have bought more than 10 items from them, more than 5 blades with no problem at all. Easy to deal with, but I must confess it was more than 10 years ago, more recently I bought a kogatana, sales went smoothly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lee Bray Posted November 6, 2013 Report Share Posted November 6, 2013 Please pay all bank fees , they say. Bank transfer is expencive and the transfer could have coursed issues. Not related to the topic but bank transfer is much cheaper than paypal when you get over a certain price, as the transfer is a set fee rather than paypal's percentage. I'd also think transfer between banks is much less prone to issues than a paypal transaction between email addresses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jean Posted November 6, 2013 Report Share Posted November 6, 2013 You are absolutelly right Lee, for amount above 1500$, I pay by transfer, the fees are fixed and very small when consequent amounts are transferred. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marius Posted November 6, 2013 Report Share Posted November 6, 2013 In the mail from Aoiart , was a confirmation on the hold and they would get back to me with shipping info ,either Fedex or EMS. Please pay all bank fees , they say. Bank transfer is expencive and the transfer could have coursed issues. I have a friend that bourght a sword from them and it was mixed parts on the complete koshirae that didnt match the blade in shirasaya. they didnt tell. In my world its fraud. Thomas, Well, I am surprised to hear that. I have bought a few swords from Tsuruta-san recently, and there was never a problem with holding them for me, even for longer than a week. Communication has been excellent, too. Have you agreed on a date on which the bank transfer should been made? If yes, maybe there has been a misunderstanding concerning the date? I find it very difficult to believe that they have done it on purpose. In your friend's case - was the blade not fitting into the saya/tsuka? The fact that in most cases koshirae are made from mixed parts is not a secret. And yes, they do rattle and so on... I guess you should state all facts (in detail) - otherwise people could come to the conclusion that what you say is slander. I don't say that you are not telling the truth, but you haven't provided evidence. Some of our statements seem pretty erratic: e.g.: what do you mean by "transfer could have caused issues"? The only issue is that it takes a few days if between two banks in different countries. Sorry to be so blunt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kai-Gunto Posted November 6, 2013 Author Report Share Posted November 6, 2013 I was about to transfer prox. 6000 usd and I meant was , issues with withdrawing payment. Fees i pay ,need to be refunded and so on. What I dont like in this case ,is that when I get a confimation that the sword is ready for payment , i belive that its "mine". Did I get the sword if I payed right a way ? They told me that they would get back to me with shipping info . The reply was also slow and only telling me I was sold. They need to be more clear in the future when ordering , but as I said I dont want to be fooled again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marius Posted November 6, 2013 Report Share Posted November 6, 2013 Thomas, I still do not quite understand you. When you make a transfer you can just pay the fees on your side, no need to refund anything. Anyway, that is not the topic here.. From what you have said, I would see this as a communication issue. You were waiting for shipping info (shipping is included in the price), they have been waiting for payment. They sold the sword (may we know which one it was?) I am sorry for your lost purchase Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrantK Posted November 6, 2013 Report Share Posted November 6, 2013 I've had good experiences with Tsuruta san of Aoi Art, and it's strange to hear about the shipping as shipping is included in the price they list, unless something has changed (I last purchased a tsuba around 5 months ago, and a sword nearly two years ago), all shipping charges were covered by them and my address was provided when I paid through paypal. I was also told before that they do holds for only a week unless discussed further so I would assume like everyone else this was probably a communication error. If English is not your native language and you tried to communicate with them I could understand that happening, did you try and work anything out to resolve the issue afterwards? Grant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adrian Posted November 6, 2013 Report Share Posted November 6, 2013 Pretty much any antiques dealer who accepts to put things on hold will expect payment within a specific time limit. Things may be different from dealer to dealer and a well known customer may get a much longer time limit then a new one, but I find it hard to believe that the mail from Aoi didn't mentioned a time limit for holding the sword. Anyway, when purchasing an item that is not exactly cheap, it doesn't hurt to spend a few pennies on a phone call and figure out the details if email communication is slow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cabowen Posted November 6, 2013 Report Share Posted November 6, 2013 I know Aoi Art is very busy with many inquiries, foreign and domestic. Knowing as I do the situation there and that they are often times rather pushed to their limits with their personnel resources, I would not be surprised if your experience was in fact not more common. I am sure it was an oversight and that it wasn't done intentionally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
takakage Posted November 6, 2013 Report Share Posted November 6, 2013 I'm not very surprised..........I've got several deal with him, some good but one was very bad and i loose some money. in fact the mainly trouble is often some flaws are not written on the appraisal.( pin holes, blade over polished, tsunagi broken) I've got the same trouble with 2 others shop......However he always keep sword on hold for me when i sent money. have a nice day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jean Posted November 6, 2013 Report Share Posted November 6, 2013 And AFAIK, you have a period of inspection and can send back the sword if not satisfied. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
takakage Posted November 6, 2013 Report Share Posted November 6, 2013 And AFAIK, you have a period of inspection and can send back the sword if not satisfied. Yes Jean of course, and it is the begining of many troubles when you return it.......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kai-Gunto Posted November 6, 2013 Author Report Share Posted November 6, 2013 I got order confirmation the 30/11-2013 ,3 days after I wrote my address and when I was making a bank transfer as requsted. 3 days after a reply , that sorry it was sold to one who just payed for it. I still dont get it? What I meant about issues to ,was the hassel if I had made the transfer and then got the news. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jean Posted November 6, 2013 Report Share Posted November 6, 2013 Which ones,Patrick? Have you experienced sending back a sword? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
takakage Posted November 6, 2013 Report Share Posted November 6, 2013 Expensive shipping costs by chronopst, damaged pack, mekugi broken, blade split in the saya, blade hold by Japanese custom for two month. Loose of time, loose of money.... I was disapointed and angry because i used to buy to this shop. It takes long time for me to order again. Just buy 2 years ago a new one with a new good polish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex A Posted November 6, 2013 Report Share Posted November 6, 2013 Now that puts an whole new spin on the inspection period/return policy, ouch.. Alex. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marius Posted November 6, 2013 Report Share Posted November 6, 2013 Alex, what's news here? Shipping costs money, customs are a nuissance, Japanese regulations are as they are. What has Aoi Art to do with it? What did Patrick expect? This is just whining... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex A Posted November 6, 2013 Report Share Posted November 6, 2013 Mariusz, the thread as gone off topic and as nothing to do with Aoi art, as you say, but in light of this, it is good for folk, who may not know how difficult it can be to return a sword back to Japan after an inspection period. Alex Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jean Posted November 6, 2013 Report Share Posted November 6, 2013 Mariusz is right, no problem with sending it back, the problem was with package handling and Japanese customs. Now Thomas, have you inquire with Aoi Japan the reason why they did not keep the sword on "Hold" for you? IMO, an explanation os mandatory. More than 10 years ago, I ordered a splendid tsuba from Aoi-Art, pay for it (110 000¥) and receive it by EMS. Few days later, I received mail from the shop asking if I had ordered it, then another one asking if I had paid for it. I gave proof of my order and payment. Then Tsuruta san gave me the reason and the why's of these e-mails. This tsuba has been bought in the same time (and paid for) by another person and Aoi-Art employee forgot to tell the other person the tsuba was sold and already shipped. Perhaps this is what happened. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kai-Gunto Posted November 6, 2013 Author Report Share Posted November 6, 2013 Mail from Aoiart: We would like to explain. There was a customer who has said they were considering the blade but they would not hold. Therefore, we thought we could offer you this blade. However,the former customer has sent payment. If there are any other blades that interest you, we would like to do our best service. We sincerely hope you could accept our apologies... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
takakage Posted November 6, 2013 Report Share Posted November 6, 2013 Alex, what's news here? Shipping costs money, customs are a nuissance, Japanese regulations are as they are. What has Aoi Art to do with it? What did Patrick expect? This is just whining... Yes Mariuskz , of course, aoi art is not guilty for customs, Japanese regulations, tsunami, earthquake....... However when you ask by mail if the sword has got flaw or others troubles, it is not fairplay to hide some pin holes and overpolished blade. i remember his answer, "a fantastic sword" It is a bad trade or a lie. I don't cry, i'm too old , just a story with this shop. I can add too a gendaito written on the appraisal "polished before sending" and never done.........but fairplay he pay back for that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Posted November 6, 2013 Report Share Posted November 6, 2013 In the interests of fairness, we allow all comments on dealers here as long as they have some basis. However, dealers only have to look at the average comments to know that the NMB can be very good for business. That said, I think there was a mistake here, and unfortunaly you lost out and they said they are sorry. What happened here is that they offered to hold it for you, expecting to tell anyone who enquired that it was on hold. However a previous interested party made a payment without further contact, and they went the route of the one who had already paid. One of those things. It happens. I would also be disappointed. But perhaps ask them to look for something similar for you and maybe they will give you a good price next time. Or avoid dealing with them..that is your perogative. What's done is done, let's move on. In general I find most dealers online to be pretty good. Bad experiences travel far and fast, so no dealer can afford to deliver constant bad service. But no dealer is perfect either. Brian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kai-Gunto Posted November 6, 2013 Author Report Share Posted November 6, 2013 Sure. Life goes on Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex A Posted November 6, 2013 Report Share Posted November 6, 2013 Yep, and you still have $6000 in your pocket :D Any chance of a loan? Alex. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jean Posted November 6, 2013 Report Share Posted November 6, 2013 In fact you should have had the priority, because it tooks you time and costs to mobilize the 6000$. Furthermore, it was put on "hold" specialy for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Klein Posted November 6, 2013 Report Share Posted November 6, 2013 Just a bit of warning. AOI puts new listing in the 'Auction' category. If you bid on them there and win there is a no return auction policy. If you wait, and it doesn't sell at auction, and they re-list it in the standard sales category, they have a return policy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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