Chinese Hussy or Japanese Gussy?

[Toryu2020]

Folks -

Would you all say this is a Chinese fake pretending to be something she is not or a late-War something or other that someone has gussied up by polishing all the parts and painting the same black?

 

No where near Slough at the moment so will appreciate any input.

-t

[cabowen]

My vote goes Chinese.

[David Flynn]

Originally copy of NCO. Chinese.

[Mark]

i maybe wrong but i do not think it is Chinese. The blade looks correct, the numbers and groove and the shape look genuine. The tsuba seppa and fuchi look real. It looks to me like someone cleaned and buffed the blade, habaki, fuchi, tsuba and seppa. The Chinese blades usually do not have the numbers stamped like your example and the groove usually end further from the tip on the Chinese copy

[kusunokimasahige]

The problem surely rests with the Fuchi. It carries the Koishikawa/Kokura stamp as well as what looks to be a rather undefined sakura stamp (cant see the details of the inside). Inbetween it has a character stamp, also quite unclear, which might be a Mukden arsenal control stamp.

 

The tsuba looks proper, the seppa also look crisp.

 

Furthermore an NCO Gunto would have had a metal tsuka, and would have been stamped with a number just like yours.

 

Is there a control stamp to the right of the numbers on the blade ? If so, please take a photo of it.

 

The fuchi stamps direction also matter. *See page 39, Military swords of Japan.

 

I am not sure about the nakago.

 

If not a Chinese knock off, then you have a factory made NCO sword there.

[Stegel]

Yes you're right about 'late war'....... very late..... like in the last few yrs!

I agree with the others, what you have is at worst a 'slapped together' NCO using original parts except for possibly a stripped naval (Kai Gunto Tsuka) instead of the correct metal one.

A patient search on ebay will find you one of those.... then at least you will have a Post war assembled Type 95 NCO gunto.

You should also be able to find a metal scabbard from the Kokura Arsenal which may not be matching numbers, but at least will be the correct type.

Everything being so 'clean' isn't very desirable with militaria collectors, however you should be able to off load it on ebay to someone.

Good Luck

Cheers

Ernst

added-

The fuchi and markings are fine, appear to be highly polished but original with the Arsenal inspection stamp matching the one on the blade after the numbers. ( they are visible in the photos you posted.... just ZOOM in!)

The tsuka appears to be naval, you should be able to determine with an 'in hand' inspection if it is Army white and painted black...

[Stu W]

The fuchi stampings are one set of several known correct combinations, being the kanji character ichi (one) within a cherry blossom for an as yet unidentified maker, a Tokyo First Arsenal inspection mark and the Kokura Arsenal identification stamp. In other words, a Tokyo First sword produced under Kokura administration by an as yet unidentified local maker working for Tokyo First. This also fits with the fact that the serial number is read with the blade edge down as opposed to those swords produced at Nagoya where the serial numbers are read when the blade edge is up.

 

Regards,

Stu

Reason for edit...must have been sleep deprived when I made my first comment.

[Ed]

Blade looks like a late war type 95, but I have been wrong before.

[Kai-Gunto]

100 % Original

[Stegel]

I think it would be more appropriate, for the benefit of Toryu, to say that the sword consists of Genuine parts.(that is... not reproductions). However, it is not 100 % Original NCO in its current form.

 

From the pics i cannot see any scabbard at all, but the correct type required,has been mentioned before.

The tsuka is incorrect type for this sword, it is not type 95 NCO issue, so obviously has been added to the other parts.

The blade, tsuba, fuchi (with locking spring broken off), and habiki may have been a set once upon a time.

As mentioned by Stu, the stampings and numbers are correct and in correct orientation, suggesting again that they may have been the original pairing from factory.

In my opinion, the number range puts it in the early 'mid' war range and it is possible that the tsuba is also part of the original factory set as the plain black steel one came into use (by this Manufacturer) in the 100,000 range.

 

Regards

Ernst

 

BTW- just saw this on ebay, very similar....

http://www.ebay.com/itm/WWII-WW2-JAPANE ... 5899125d96

[Stu W]

I think it would be more appropriate, for the benefit of Toryu, to say that the sword consists of Genuine parts.(that is... not reproductions). However, it is not 100 % Original NCO in its current form...

 

Hello Ernst,

 

Thank you for making that comment. Indeed you are correct and I should have taken more care with my reply. For the benefit of Toryu I'll post a photo of some of mine to illustrate the correct combinations of tsuka and tsuba.

 

Regards,

Stu

[Toryu2020]

great stuff Gentlemen-

This is one of those friend of a friend items. i have yet to see it in hand but once i do will post some more photos for the final verdict...

thanks,

-t

[Kai-Gunto]

The blade dosnt have anything that says it could be a fake!

Someone wanted it to look more like a real samurai sword.

I will eat my old hat ,if someone can point the fake issues!

[Stegel]

No need to be eating hats Thomas, as NOBODY said it was fake!

There is a big difference between 'Genuine' parts in this case, and '100% Original' in the sword as a whole.

I'll eat my hat if you can show me where it was claimed to be a fake... :lol:

The pictures from Stu, were simply showing the correct tsuka/tsuba combinations for a 100% ORIGINAL Type 95 NCO sword.

I hope you can nut it out from there.

 

Ernst

[J Reid]

My opinion- my experience is the chinese fake nco swords have a bohi that ends quite early. The real ones have a bohi that runs beyond the "yokote". Also the arsenal stamps on the fuchi are much larger on the fakes and smaller on the real ones. I think this is real.

[Stu W]

My opinion- my experience is the chinese fake nco swords have a bohi that ends quite early. The real ones have a bohi that runs beyond the "yokote". Also the arsenal stamps on the fuchi are much larger on the fakes and smaller on the real ones. I think this is real.

 

I've noted that too Josh. The components here are originals but not all to an NCO sword although most appear to be. The tsuka is the obvious mismatched item.

 

Regards,

Stu