sanjuro

Like Lorenzo I find it odd that no one has yet mentioned kizu. My criteria are 1. Regardless of school, smith and age, the blade must be true to its origins. It must also be a functional blade. I dont buy art purely for art's sake. 2. No kizu if it is a shinto or later blade, and in koto blades, I will tolerate no easily identifiable fault or flaw related to the blade's forging. So basically the blade must be almost perfect. I also avoid very tired blades. 3. Whilst I am not a fanatic about papers, if they are present and reputable then it is a plus. 4. The blade must be in polish at least 90%. 5. I take absolutely no notice of mounts. Mounts are like a suit of clothes and are or were changed regularly. 6. The blade must have shirasaya regardless of whether it has a complete or partial koshirae. Generally speaking I have preference for ubu mumei blades It saves an awful lot of heartache involved in finding out something I own is a very high quality gimei blade. I've been there a couple of times and it isnt worth it. I buy only from reputable dealers and persons (other collectors) I trust. I avoid ebay for obvious reasons. The reasoning is "If it is supposed to be such a collectable piece then why the hell is it on ebay?" I may have missed out on the rare exception, but I can live with that. I guess that does it for general principles :D

Hi David. Not that I know so very much about tsuba, but I have seen this design on tsuba that predate the introduction of christianity into Japan. I would also have thought that the similarity to a christian cross would have been too overt for it to be intended as such, and those tsuba that are of a christian motif tend to be a great deal more subtle in the inference of a belief in a christian god on the part of the owner. This basic design more 'in the round', is often seen on smaller tsuba ( Wakizashi sized) intended for naginata, I have noticed. :D

Just an opinion, but isnt a world war two sword merely classified as a gunto and therefore neither legitimately a tachi or a katana. I realise this may incline some of our gunto collectors to go up in flames, but just hold your fire for a moment. The comment is not made in order to confront or to offend collectors of these artifacts, nor do I wish to denigrate in any way this classification of swords. Rather, I seek some clarification here for myself. I have always viewed gunto (swords made for the second word war) as a type quite separate from the traditional tachi or katana of older vintage, not conforming to either as it were, regardless of how they were signed. Am I in grave error in this belief?????? Just to explain a little further, I have never seen a gunto in its original and intended mountings, mounted as a katana. As far as my experience of them goes, they are either handachi style or sometimes tachi style in their mounts. Possibly this is where my confusion stems from.

Why would you want to keep such a thing? Its like collecting shrunken heads or severed fingers. One question........ is it gimei??????? :lol:

I have read of swords being broken during use at the mekugi ana, but never an account of a sword breaking specifically because of a rusted nakago. May I ask what is it you are trying to establish? When one considers it would take a few hundred years for a normal nakago to rust to the point of weakness that it would fail and break, and that no individual nihonto was ever intended to last in continual use for such a protracted period of time, then it is not surprising that there are few if any such failures recorded. A nakago that is merely left alone or receives normal care and is allowed to deteriorate normally reaches a point when the rust becomes inactive. Long before this time the blade if it is of any quality has been retired from use and is kept only as an heirloom and is no longer subjected to the stresses of combative use, hence it is not likely to fail in this respect.

Hi Hoanh. Better pictures... Thanks. This blade strikes me as a late Momoyama Katana rather than an Uchigatana. The sugata is reminiscent of a few similar katana I have seen from that period, and the nakago is far more katana-like than an uchigatana usually presents. Koshi sori says koto and the steel and apparent quality also point to a Momoyama date. Theres a few small openings in the hada which are also reminiscent of meduim quality work of this period after a few polishes have reduced the surface steel. In a way the forging is a little rough, which suggests a sword of the Sengoku Jidai by a competent maker but produced to a lower quality or a lower price. Not uncommon in that period. The above is merely my impression and of course others may not agree. Kantei is a difficult enough process even when the sword is in hand. Kantei by photograph is for the very brave or the very confident. An interesting blade though.

Maybe its just me, and my gears are starting to slip in my advance toward venerability, but this nakago just doesnt look right to me. It appears firstly to be curved slightly toward the ha. This may be a photographic effect of course. However, secondly the nakago appears to be too long for an uchigatana. A much later sword maybe, but not a koto blade may have this feature. If it is shinto then it cant be an uchigatana as has been observed. The pics are still not high enough res to make any call on the quality. An overall pic of the sugata would help a lot.

Without subscribing to the Lexus/Toyota, Honda/Acura theory of distinction and evolution, and possibly getting both of us ridden out of town on a rail, as far as uchigatana and Kodachi are concerned, the names alone indicate their relativity to oneanother. Uchigatana means basically 'strike sword' and Kodachi means 'small tachi' surely that is difference enough, and description enough to separate them.

Just a small side issue here if I may be forgiven the comment. From the above statement, my guess would be that you are probably an Iaidoka. :D If so, dont allow your particular martial discipline to limit your perspective on how these weapons were deployed. Think 'battlefield' and all that Iai theory goes out the window. Swanning around on a battlefield with a sword in its saya doesn't generally lead to an elongated life expectancy. Both swords once in hand would be employed in the same or similar ways since the physical difference between them was primarily the way in which they were mounted and worn. There was no simultaneous 'draw and cut' when kodachi and uchigatana were both in vogue. Iai techniques were a slightly later addition to the swordsman's art. Both a Tachi and a Daito can be used Iai fashion so the shorter Uchigatana and Kodachi could also have been used this way had the techniques existed at that point in history.

Surely, purely on a percentage basis, there were very few kodachi produced and they are specific to a fairly narrow time frame compared to the much more prolific and generally poorer quality uchigatana produced for the general soldiery. Higher quality uchigatana such as those in use by the higher ranking samurai, are fairly rare. Kodachi are even rarer and (at least those I have come into contact with and those posted in this thread), are relatively higher quality blades.

I thought this might help a little with the basic types used by various ryuha.

But Guys..... According to the seller and I quote directly here, "It has a great Hammon" and "It is in fawless condition". Now how could you not believe a seller who has such a terrific grasp of spelling accuracy and descriptive english?????? The listing absolutely inspires one with true confidence and trust.

Jean. It seems to me that these are also equally excellent reasons to stay away from ebay :D Not that any of the beginners would see it that way of course. If they can't afford it and don't have a clue what they are buying, then why the hell are they buying anything (apart from books) at all????????? This question excludes of course the "I gotta have one", instant gratification aspect of the newbie syndrome. A syndrome that the makers of fakes and reproductions are unfortunately only too aware of. Which brings to mind a line from the Magnificent Seven. 'If God hadnt intended them to be shorn, He wouldn't have made them sheep".

Looking at this from the other side as it were, it seems to me that given the preponderance of nihonto fakes and rubbish on ebay these days, that ebay has become a poor commercial choice as a place to sell genuine nihonto or tosogu. I look at ebay occasionally and usually give up in disgust because of the fakes and junk that predominates almost to the exclusion of the real article. Why a beginner would want to go there is entirely beyond me.

Hi Ford. I like it immensely! Its OK for a tsuba-like object (Just kidding about the tsuba -like object). A beautiful piece, masterfully rendered. My congrats and good luck in the competition.

Hi Bry. PM sent.

A very amateur job! Local experts are seldom what they claim to be and I guess you are the victim of one. My commiserations. The patina on the koiguchi is what it is and only an experienced hand can restore it. Ford Hallam springs to mind, and a word to him may be in order here. The saya is another matter, and I leave it to others in Europe to recommend a quality restorer close to home. I really hate to see this sort of malpractice, so once again , my sympathies and I hope you find a competent craftsman to rectify the situation.

As far as I know stainless steel does not have the ability to accept differential hardening nor does it have a 'grain' as does normal steel. It cannot therefore have a true hamon or indeed hada such as we see in true nihonto. Having said as much, I or at least my words, will probably be torn to shreds by the metallurgists among us. I do however have broad shoulders and can bear the 'slings and arrows' of adverse opinion whilst perhaps learning something.

These are not and never were shakudo as you have worked out for yourself. They are cast shinchu (brass), and any patina they may have had is now long gone. Whats done is done however, further cleaning will not really hurt them any more than what cleaning has already been done. Any abrasive like toothpaste will just remove detail, so keep the cleaning down to solvent type liquids. With cast items there will always be a roughness in the low spots that looks dirty but isnt, due to the fact that it holds no level of polish. Just be careful. :D JMHO

Jean and Jacques You are both aware of course that it is impossible to prove a negative theory such as the non existence of something, since the possibility of an exception that refutes it will always exist.

True, only in as much as it presupposes that all swords are equal. However, like men, not all swords are equal. One is tempted to modify the quote to read, "A sword is only as effective as the person who wields it, and only as good as the person who made it". :D

Mark My apologies... I got it wrong with the speculation. My last post was a flippant remark at best. OK, so its a shinsakuto in 90% polish. Even so, with the passage of one year or thereabouts, one can hardly expect to receive any compensation from any dealer regardless of whom it may be. If you did not see the hagire until it was pointed out to you by a polisher then it is safe to assume that the seller was also equally unaware of it. If this is the case then it was sold in good faith. It is unfortunate but an acceptable risk you have taken in buying the sword. Regardless of it being part of an investment fund for a college education, ( I assume this is what you mean by a 'nihonto college fund'), the caveat emptor rule applies to all nihonto purchases and moreso in this case since it entails the passage of so much time. You will take a loss on this sword when it is sold no doubt. Incidentally, there are more secure and greater profit yielding investment vehicles than nihonto, but that is beside the point. Your exposure to this kind of potential setback is also heightened exponentially in procuring ebay merchandise in less than full polish.

Sue the impudent samurai who had the temerity to possibly use a valuable sword in a nasty vicious battle, so damaging it that you were to discover when having it polished, some hundreds of years later, that it was in fact a second hand weapon and had subsequently developed a fault. How dare he commit such a sacrilege!!!!! Get real Mark....... You made an error that could not have been forseen, and now you are looking to pass off the responsibility for it and get back some of the money you have wasted. Get over it and move on.

Mark. Correct me if I am wrong here, but it seems to me that you asked Yitzy to sell you the sword, that you were initially thrilled by the purchase and said as much to the seller. Subsequently, about a year later when you had recieved the sword back again from your polisher, you found a hagire that the polishing had brought out. In other words you had taken the same risk that any of us take when we buy a sword out of polish and subsequently have it polished. Given that the hagire was not evident when the sword was sold to you, there is no foul by the seller. You simply took a risk and it didnt pay off. I cant see why you hold the seller responsible for what is plain bad luck. If this is correct then what can you reasonably expect the seller to do about it ???????

Variant of the Mikumo Mon. Usually portrayed with two straight lines beneath but not in a circle. When in a circle the two lines are omitted, and only the mon itself is within the circle. There may also be some other significance to either the lack or inclusion of the two lines. Se samurai archives.