Geraint

Here you go Matt. Looks like a nice find to me, hope it all works out. The oshigata is from Art and The Sword, Vol. 2 Very worth while getting hold of if you are looking into these smiths. All the best. (Sorry, idiot moment, this is the Ist gen, I will catch up in a bit.}

Well I certainly enjoyed it Chris, I second the award! Christian, "lantern rouge", if I understand your reference correctly that was a nice try but I fear this thread is doomed to run and run......,

Welcome Rick. As Ron says, there are several people who are interested in matchlocks so some pictures would get the conversation started. Looking forward to them. Cheers

And getting your posts moved to the right place is just one of the courtesies you can expect on this forum! Welcome.

Hi Natahan. I think Brian has spotted some really important points about the sword. If you have a look at the comparable wakizashi on here, http://www.ricecracker.com/ you may find it helps throw some light on the sword you are working with. (Item 517). Edit Admin - Link added http://www.ricecracker.com/inventory/it ... imitsu.htm Oei Bizen sugata tends to be slender and given a rather hard life might result in the very slim sword you describe. If large amounts of metal have been removed from the mune that might also produce the slightly strained sugata. While I can quite understand that on first sight an over polished sword with a very slender sugata might be categorised as a boy's sword I think this was a mistake. Once you have the idea it is hard to shake it off and this may be what has occurred. If the market rate for a fairly healthy, polished and papered sword by one of the Oei san mitsu is $19k then a severely worn, unpapered sword which has lost many of its indicative charcteristics is going to be significantly less. I am sure we would all be delighted to be proved wrong on this as a tribute to what we have all learned through the man's work, I look forward to other comments. All the best

Just so long as Martin knows the difference................

Hi Gwyn, Have a look at it with a lens, if it has been there for some time then might well be kiri komi, alternatively if more recent than the last polish, (shudder!) then could show some indication of this. Polishing out one and keeping the geometry of the blade correct would be a bit of work and they are often left because of this and perhaps for the romance. Cheers.

Hi Denis. This one seems to have been kicked into the long grass so let me resurrect it. I can't do enough with the koshirae image to see detail so points may be irrelevant but here are some things to think about. If the leather collar around the fuchi can be gently slid up the tsuka what do you see? This looks a bit like a cross between civil mounts and late war. At the length you quote it is basically a wakizashi, some people would want to call it an o wakizashi or there is a term which seems out of favour at the moment which is chisa katana. It is possible to find nakago that have been modified in a variety of ways to fit military koshirae but they are almost always done very well, this one appears to have had a hard time of it. Assuming that the sword all fits together tightly and seems to be of a piece then the possibility that it is a last ditch sword, assembled hurriedly from what was available suggests itself. No answers but some ideas for you to kick around. Cheers.

Lovely sword, Jean. Is that a vote for Denis to resubmit his blade?

The sword that Lee refers to is an interesting case, wouldn't it be great to be able to go back and ask the shinsa panel what their thinking was? The bigger picture has been well put by Paul but it leaves an interesting point for Dennis. Nakahara has some interesting things to say about the relationship between papers and the market for swords, admittedly blindingly obvious if you have given any thought to the mechanisms of the art market. As is so often stated the sword should be the first point to consider when dealing with any attribution. Given that the sword is mumei I can't imagine it making a great deal of difference what paper it has and of course there is always the possibility that another shinsa team may assign the work to a smith of lower ranking. My suggestion; enjoy the sword, use it as vehicle to research the smith and the school, save the cost of re submission for your next purchase. Most of all, enjoy the sword.

Hi Dow. Looks alright to me. What would make you think it a Chinese copy and why are you buying saya?

Hi Matt., Welcome and if you ever get down to the far south west let me know. Cheers

Hi Lee, really interested to hear about your sword. The suspicion that papers were issued for reasons other than scholarship around that time would hardly seem to apply to a sword by 6th generation Shigetaka. Also can't work out why someone would bother to produce a gimei of that smith when others would be far more valuable. You clearly have really good reasons for calling it gimei, would you mind sharing those? Always interested in that line and the bigger question about the papers makes it an interesting topic. Cheers

Hi Denis. I am sure that you will have seen this article, http://www.nihontocraft.com/japanese_sword_papers.htm which, while not exactly answering your question goes some way to explaining the issues. Your call but it seems like quite a lot of effort and expense to go through as the sword already has papers. I can't imagine that the difference would make that much of an impact on the value or the likelihood of a sale. All the best

Ah, Justin. Must be rather nice to have a sword with kinzogan mei, named like that. (British understatement for, "Wow! Look at that!) Any chance of some more images and a write up? Cheers

Thank you all, that explains so much about Kaga habaki that I had never realised.

Sigh! Thanks for posting these, what a feast! Interesting that one of the tachi (Possibly worth 80,000,000?) had a mumei Kozori blade like the one under discussion elsewhere. Also interesting to see another Gassan blade with part of the mei on the nakago mune. Also interesting to see the proportions of the nakago on the Hizen blade. Some really magnificent works, thank you again.

Hi Tobias. If you really want to get to grips with what can happen to a sword over a lengthy life can I suggest Nakahara, "Facts and Fundamentals of Japanese Swords". It has some very interesting observations about what happens to swords through repeated polishing and repairs. Have fun.

Hi Piers, That does sound like wonderful evening! One little question, you teased us with the mention of a story associated with the grooves in the habaki of the Kashu sword and didn't make good. What's the story? Cheers

Looks interesting Dennis, more images please. Especially of the blade. Cheers

Hi Steve, Do you mean a stamp? I have never come across that but of course several Shinto smiths cut the symbol in the same way as they cut the mei?

Curtis, Certainly not a Chinese fake. The koshirae is of a type encountered reasonably often. pressed brass components assembled to cover the whole of the sword. Usually assumed to have been done at the end of the 19th century to produce mounted swords for sale to the West.

Hi Curran. It certainly is an unusual feature though not unique; I have a memory of a tanto or ko wakizashi on Aoi Art with an extended nakago and there is one in the Boston Museum collection, number 51 in the catalogue. I believe the Aoi Art one had a steel sleeve fitted around the edge of the nakago but the sword has gone and is no longer on the website so I may be imagining it. In the later case a copper extension is used and seems from the oshigata to be riveted through an existing mekugi ana. Ogawa san comments; "The tang of this wakizashi was originally short, but now has a long copper plate 'nailed' (sic) to it. A long handle attached to a short tang would be very vulnerable and easily broken, so the copper plate was added to strengthen it." This was on a long Soshu wakizashi and one can imagine it mounted as katana; with the short Soshu tang breaking the tsuka would be a very real possibility. If I had bought the sword I think I would regard it as very much a part of the blades history and certainly wouldn't attempt to remove it, always provided that it had the probability of being a Japanese repair.

On the other hand , Christophe, check out the daisho tsuba on the "For Sale" section......

Welcome Ian. Buying from e bay is now almost impossible in the UK but there are very good sources for swords around the world. You have one great advantage, you live in the area of the Northern Token society! (Though having two members called Ian B might be confusing!) http://www.northerntokensociety.org.uk/ ... ut_Us.html It is so worth joining these guys, not only will you have access to a friendly and enthusiastic bunch of collectors but also when you do find a sword you wish to buy from overseas you will hit the problem of justifying its importation through customs. Membership of the society is one way of proving that you have a good reason for bringing the sword into the country. I would also advise joining the To_ken Society of Great Britain, http://www.to-ken.com/ which will be of benefit as you start to explore this fascinating world! Spare a thought for those of us who live in the outer fringes of the UK for whom any sort of contact with fellow collectors is a bit of a mission. All the best.