Jace Posted January 6 Report Posted January 6 I inherited a Japanese sword that my great grandpa picked up in Papa New Guinea during WWII. I’ve removed the hilt and was wondering if anyone would be able to translate these markings. It’s a bit hard to read with the rust but I did an etching and drew generally how the symbols look on the paper. Thanks a ton for the help! 1 Quote
Ray Singer Posted January 6 Report Posted January 6 Bizen (no) kuni Norikane It is readable, don't do anything to disturb the rust on the nakago to improve the condition. Quote
Jace Posted January 6 Author Report Posted January 6 5 minutes ago, Ray Singer said: Bizen (no) kuni Norikane It is readable, don't do anything to disturb the rust on the nakago to improve the condition. Thanks a ton Ray. Is this a typical marking for WWII era swords? I’m not sure of the significance of a marking like this. Quote
John C Posted January 6 Report Posted January 6 Jace: I think the blade itself is older than ww2. It was common practice for soldiers to carry their family or donated swords. John C. p.s. I don't think the bayonet is Japanese. German (or derivative) perhaps. Quote
Jace Posted January 6 Author Report Posted January 6 16 minutes ago, John C said: Jace: I think the blade itself is older than ww2. It was common practice for soldiers to carry their family or donated swords. John C. p.s. I don't think the bayonet is Japanese. German (or derivative) perhaps. John, Thank you for your insight it is much appreciated. Do you mind if I ask what makes you think it’s older? Also, If it was a family sword, would it have more specific markings on it (like family name) or is that just in some cases? My apologies I have very little knowledge regarding this stuff. Yes, you are correct the bayonet is a čsz Czechoslovakian made m24 Mauser bayonet. Quote
Nobody Posted January 6 Report Posted January 6 The mei looks Sukekane to me. 備前國助包 - Bizen no kuni Sukekane 8 Quote
Brian Posted January 6 Report Posted January 6 It is most definitely antique...a few hundred years old. Very common for older swords to be taken to war. "Family blades" just means they were privately owned before. There is no family mentioned on them, just the smith's signature as per this one. Condition is poor, but don't do anything except oil and wipe. 3 Quote
mecox Posted January 6 Report Posted January 6 Jace, as per Moriyama san above probably is: 備前國助包 - Bizen no Kuni Sukekane Bizen is current Okayama. There were around 8 plus smiths of that name from around 1200 to late 1800's. Close up pic of sword hilt (nakago) without handle (tsuka) would be helpful 2 Quote
Bugyotsuji Posted January 6 Report Posted January 6 祐包 The one at the end of Edo and into the beginning of Meiji had a different kanji for Suke. 2 Quote
Ray Singer Posted January 6 Report Posted January 6 Agreed, Sukekane. My mistake above. Best regards, Ray 4 Quote
Bruce Pennington Posted January 6 Report Posted January 6 Jace, You may already know, but the longer sword is a Type 19 Japanese officer dress sword (sometimes called a 'parade sword' by collectors). They were worn in non-combat situations and not a real weapon. You can read up on them on Ohuma's site: Command Saber - Ohmura What is the length of the cutting edge of the shorter sword? It appears to be a wakizashi, the shorter sword of the two carried by the Samurai. Under 24" is a waki. 1 Quote
Jace Posted January 6 Author Report Posted January 6 (edited) 32 minutes ago, Bruce Pennington said: Jace, You may already know, but the longer sword is a Type 19 Japanese officer dress sword (sometimes called a 'parade sword' by collectors). They were worn in non-combat situations and not a real weapon. You can read up on them on Ohuma's site: Command Saber - Ohmura What is the length of the cutting edge of the shorter sword? It appears to be a wakizashi, the shorter sword of the two carried by the Samurai. Under 24" is a waki. Hello Bruce, yes I am aware that the saber is more of a Japanese ceremonial sword but thank you for confirming that. That sword does have a marking on the top part of the hand guard but it is difficult to make out. I also am not sure if it would be good to take it apart since the handle seems to have been riveted together. The shorter swords cutting edge is about 16 inches. One thing I have read is that in some cases swords factory produces during WWII were sometimes engraved with prestigious markings as more of an honorary deal rather than it being “original”. I believe this is referred to as gimei vs true mei? i am just not sure how to tell which case is true for this sword. Edited January 6 by Jace Quote
Bruce Pennington Posted January 6 Report Posted January 6 2 hours ago, Jace said: . That sword does have a marking on the top part of the hand guard but it is difficult to make out. I also am not sure if it would be good to take it apart since the handle seems to have been riveted together. You could try taking a clear, close-up and post it. You are right, though, there is nothing to be gained by taking the 19 apart. As to the originality of the signature on your waki, the other guys would have to help you with that. It's not something I study. Quote
Jace Posted January 7 Author Report Posted January 7 Here is a close up of the marking on the saber. It is very small and difficult to take a picture of unfortunately. Quote
Bruce Pennington Posted January 7 Report Posted January 7 Thanks, Jace! That is the mark of Echizen’ya Tazaki Shōten, one of the makers of these swords. Also, one of the few we actually know the name of. Most are unknowns. 1 Quote
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