Mainline Goto Menuki By The 9Th Master Teijo

[Frank B]

Very pleased to have this wonderful set in my collection. When I first got interested in tosogu, a dream of mine was always to own a pair of mainline goto dragons. At that point I did not have the knowledge nor the means to acquire a good set. Thankfully now after some trading I am the proud owner of these Teijo menuki. Teijo was the 9th mainline master and 41 works by him have passed Juyo. Furthermore, he is rated in the Kinko Meikan as Meiko(Great Master). While this rating is not the most important thing, as there is no logical way to judge hundreds of years of artists. I've got plenty of studying to do now, and comparing to other generations.  

[Vermithrax16]

Wow Frank!!!! Stunning set, detail work is amazing. Congratulations sir!

[TETSUGENDO]

Great dragons Frank, WELL DONE....and best of luck with the them!

 

-S-

[Frank B]

One aspect that has puzzled me are the "notches" on the back(can be seen on the last photo for the menuki on the right https://yuhindo.com/goto-teijo-dragon-menuki/#shield).An older Momoyama period set of Goto dragons also has these similar 

 

http://www.ncjsc.org/item_momoyama_goto_menuki1.htm

 

If anyone knows what these are please let me know, and if anyone would be willing to share photos I'd appreciate it very much. 

 

Thank you 

[Fred Geyer]

what notches are you reffering to ?? can you share a photo of the back side of this set ?

 

Fred

[John A Stuart]

Must be these which are just incidental I suspect. John

[Frank B]

Sorry if it was vague, yes those 4 notches on the back. I don't think its incidental as the other set I referenced also has similar marks.

[nagamaki - Franco]

Pure speculation at this point, but have to wonder if not like the notches sometimes seen on the spine of the nakago, if these aren't simply assembly marks of sorts???

 

Otherwise, they appear to be too casual, unskilled, to be more significant. But, then, I could be completely wrong.

 

P.S. it's difficult to imagine Darcy missing something so obvious in his attention for detail if these marks were something more significant.

Edited March 19, 2019 by nagamaki - Franco

[Frank B]

Pure speculation at this point, but have to wonder if not like the notches sometimes seen on the spine of the nakago, if these aren't simply assembly marks of sorts???

 

Otherwise, they appear to be too casual, unskilled, to be more significant. But, then, I could be completely wrong.

As they are ordered and do not seem like random scratches I'd lean towards them having some sort of meaning. In theory these could be old dealer marking similar to the lacquer, but I wouldnt see a point to it as there are clearly already lacquer on the back of both sets of menuki. 

[lonely panet]

at a guess, could they be gold purity test related ??

[Frank B]

at a guess, could they be gold purity test related ??

Interesting thought, but I dont think so. By that logic, someone tested the set multiple times. Usually gold testing is done by rubbing on a surface and seeing if it reacts with certain acids. 

[Pete Klein]

Frank - on your set how deep are the marks?

[Frank B]

Frank - on your set how deep are the marks?

Not very deep

[Pete Klein]

OK - that's what I suspected.  If you look at the pair from the NCJSC picture enlarged those look to me like they go deep which means they most likely had to do with raising the tail 'spines' on the omote.  The surrounding plate is recessed so this might have been necessary as they are on both menuki.  Yours might very well be scratches from someone at some point using a sharp instrument to remove the pitch concoction from the ura.  There are other scratches on them as well.  If not that then I really don't know.

[Fred Geyer]

The one set above looks like just clean out marks getting the pitch out, the one from the ncjsc is push marks making the motif of the front

 

I agree these are unskilled marks and just marks not done by the maker, some of the highest rated makers of the time and cant make a straight line??

 

  I looked at first 7 generations last night and nothing other then clean out marks

 

Fred

[Fred Geyer]

AAAHHHH Pete Funny we are typing the exact same thing same time !!!

 

 

Fred Geyer

[Pete Klein]

Truly great minds think alike...!  LOL

[Frank B]

The one set above looks like just clean out marks getting the pitch out, the one from the ncjsc is push marks making the motif of the front

 

I agree these are unskilled marks and just marks not done by the maker, some of the highest rated makers of the time and cant make a straight line??

 

  I looked at first 7 generations last night and nothing other then clean out marks

 

 

 

Fred

As a reference could I see one or two of the "clean out marks"?

[Fred Geyer]

will take photos this weekend you will them on alot of gold menuki from any school if they are thick enoght to get it dug out  

 

Fred

[Frank B]

will take photos this weekend you will them on alot of gold menuki from any school if they are thick enoght to get it dug out  

 

Fred

Thank you