Bugyotsuji

Many have looked but no-one has answered. A mystery indeed. Originally one of a pair? Part of a ship's decoration? Part of a Ranma as you suggest? Something from a temple or shrine that has been refurbished? Gosh... a nice thing to have, though. While we wait for further comments, I have two contributions this week. Both are questions. Number one is a a combination. I know the answer to part a), but not the answer to b)... 1. a) What do these two Jingasa photos have in common? b) What does the answer in a) tell us?

Hi Vlad, it describes the Daisho, and the quick answer to your question is 'Yes', but what else do you want to know?

Quick question. Why did you write ASAP in the title? :|

What a magnificent example of a gwalior. I wonder if the pricker was draped over the barrel between the sight and the (?) panlid handle in some way to stop the lid opening? I always carry a pricker separately in the Doran (beltbox), but there is certainly an attraction to having it attached near the pan.

I am beginning to think the same thing, Ron. The medallion cord hole somehow evolved over time through obsolescence, coincidence, necessity etc., into a very useful match snuffer.

If I fire an average of 7 shots, perhaps 12 demonstrations a year with this gun, then that means I must have fired it about 600 times since I purchased it. Oh, and apologies for the rather rupturous threadnap, Ron!

Ian, if that is a sheath for a pricker, I can imagine it would stay in if the gun was pushed down into a horse's holster, but would it not slide back out when lifted up into the firing position? Thought-provoking pics. Many thanks. Further to the above post, I include some shots of the quite shallow ringed hollow in the butt of my Kumamoto Castle gun. (I think a small bird might have made a nest in there.) You can also see the two parallel match holes and a separate narrower hole for a decorative lanyard.

Quick edit above. My Kumamoto gun is dated Koka 4 nen, 1847 (not '1867' as I mistakenly posted earlier. Now edited.) I will post a piccie of the hole in question when I get home, if I can just get this other deskwork out of the way first! Who invented work? The NAMAE site I have just posted above is I believe independent and unrelated to the earlier link to Sugawa san. Yes, I agree that our two previously extreme positions may be moving somewhat together. I have learned a lot in the process of this discussion. Many thanks.

Hi Ron, some quick thoughts regarding your points above. 1. Yours are very deep. Mine is shallower. I am beginning to wonder whether the original straight-through hole was under-used and someone tried blocking it with whatever, and then they disovered you could get away with half the hole and half the decorations (= half the labor/labour) during manufacture. This may explain why there is so little literature on this feature, and only later guns seem to have it in this form. 2. From personal observation I agree that it is located in an inconvenient place for me, especially when my hands are full of other clobber. The other side would be better. Our matches are seriously hot however, and even with a large dollop of spit you would have to have very horny hands to avoid getting burnt. You would then have the problem of relighting if such became suddenly necessary. 3.About the angled hole you mention, my long gun has two of these in parallel. These holes would be the ones mentioned in the line above the line quoted, in the description web page. 火縄通しの穴 有無、材質、内径、飾り金具 = matchcord tunnel(s), presence/absence of, material(s) inner diameter, decorative metalwork I have used these in the past to push the matchcord through, though I am not yet convinced that the angle of them points consciously (decoratively perhaps) towards the Hachimanza. 4. Granted, depending on the other factors. 5. My Kumamoto Castle gun, definitely a combat gun, but of late vintage (1847) has this half-hole, but ringed only once in plain but thick brass. The inner end is wood, so I am burning the stock a little more each time I use it! Is that why yours are deeper, thru much use??? 6. OK 7. As you see, I did say that his work is not definitive. Agreed. I don't think anyone has yet had this debate anywhere so I am glad we are having it here.

Before I answer your detailed post above Ron, I just want to put this up before I forget it. (Old age) This 'NAMAE' site, based in Kamakura, is a site that lists for descriptive purposes the names for all the parts of the Tanegashima, and in 'The Stock', section 3 from the top, line 16, you can find this line: 火縄消しの穴 火消壷　有無、材質、内径、深さ、飾り金具（段数） = Match extinguish hole, fire extinguish hole, absence/presence of, material(s), inner diameter, depth, decorative metalwork (number of Dan) This comes from the following page. (In Japanese, sorry) http://www.geocities.jp/nosuka02/NAMAE.html

Concerning the use of the decorated cavity/half-hole I cannot say that my teacher told me this was for extinguishing the Hinawa. All my instincts and training tell me this has to be the purpose, although I grant that when displaying the gun a short section of match fed into this hole might be a good way to display it. The problem is that it would fall out immediately if you tried to use it like that. Some older guns have a hole that goes straight through, but this shallow hole would mean use of a very short cord, which would make little sense in battle, I am sure you would agree. The cord is always wrapped around the left forearm and gradually fed to the serpentine, through the diagonal hole as you suggest when it is present. When we finish our displays there is always an urgent message flashed around to extinguish our matches. They were precious in olden times I would guess. Some of our members carry a pair of scissors, but I have found the easiest and quickest way to comply is to push it in and suffocate the cord within this close-fitting metal-lined hollow. On p 18 of Sugawa san's pdf he calls this an extinguishing hole, ie Hi-keshi-no-ana 火消しの孔 http://www.mlsa.jp/sugawa/hinawajyu3.pdf This is by no means definitive, but I would like to go away and toss this around a little more and gather a few more grizzled opinions if I may, Ron. PS Here is a further selection of Sakai muzzles. PPS Your gun also has influences of Sendai in it! (The trigger etc.)(Or am I beginning to see things?) :lol:

In the records of gunsmiths there is 国友平八国安　甲斐国住　享和三年 国友鳳澤舎国安　甲斐住　 There are also a couple of smiths listed not under Kunitomo, but like this: 鳳澤国重　甲斐住 鳳澤金平左衛門国重　甲斐住 鳳澤舎　国久　甲斐住 Those are all the recorded smiths of this school (?) that I can find.

Ah, that's a good idea. Thank you! This? http://www.city.otsuki.yamanashi.jp/17/ ... a/081.html

PPS I cannot yet find any record of a "Kuniyasu" gunsmith listed for Settsu-no-kuni Sakai, BTW. Here is an example of a Kunitomo gun with some similarities to yours, Ron, for reference.

Ron, the signature is quite interesting, but I think whoever took the photos must have missed the first characters for Kunitomo, which made my search a bit longer!!! All you have posted seems to be: First I found that the Mei Ho-sawa is recorded in a list of gunsmiths in Ko-shu 甲州　（甲斐）the present-day Yamanashi Ken, whence Takeda Shingen came. The third character has the meaning of Yadoru, 'temporarily living', or 'temporary abode'. Later following a few hours searching (!) I found that Kuniyasu is listed as a Kunitomo smith, but was he temporarily living in Yamanashi when he made this gun? The full signature should therefore be Kunitomo Ho-sawa (-zawa) Sha/Yadoru/Mi-o-yoseru/kari-ni-sumu Kuniyasu Saku, right? Admittedly the gun looks like a Sakai-zutsu, but being in fierce rivalry with each other , many Sakai and Kunitomo guns were almost indistinguishable. It may be that your gun looks restrained because it is in fact a Kunitomo gun, which were not generally as flashy/bling, or ostentatious as you say, as Sakai. PS I think you'll find the Chrysanthemum is an ashtray, for extinguishing the matchcord after use.

Thank you for showing your Tanto. Funny, it is fairly similar in some aspects to one that I have. Congratulations!

Lorenzo, some amazing stuff in those links. What is the FONDAZIONE ANTONIO MAZZOTTA?

...scales drop off the eyes of your understanding, Ian? I don't believe you have any left! :lol:

Oops, sorry, clicked on the second, but didn't look at the first link!

No information given, so hard to judge exacty when and why these were made. We can surely say that they are however Japanese style.

It looks as though the 'experts' are sorting them into different piles... for souvenirs, for preservation, for destruction, etc.

Well, no. I took it to a Kinko to see what he could do, but the result was not at all what I had expected. I wanted it perfect, just like before...

Thanks. Please do not ask me about the Tsuba, Philip. I went through a crazy patch buying Tsuba on internet auctions, in fairs, anywhere I found anything seemingly suitable. This one was not cheap, but perfect, in copper with a Shakudo finish and a nice twisted edge. It had no sekigane in the central Nakago Hitsu, so I cut up some copper sheet and folded and pushed it into the corners and adjusted the Tsuba to fit tightly over the Nakago. Or so I thought I was doing until I slipped with the tool I was using and put a deep scratch right across the Tsuba face...

Some bonus shots showing how the other small Bashin all sit happily there. I have reluctantly concluded that this slot was never originally designed for a Kozuka/Kogatana of the specially narrow width I had been searching for. To try to fit it would mean a redesign of the slot, and could lead to a split and more trouble than I need.

These are the candidates for the Hitsu side slot. The Kogatana/Kozuka is a solid piece of shibuichi, and suddenly seemed to be the perfect solution. The three Bashin are tetsu. The slot is triangular in cross-section. Hard to see because the horn entrance has been rather nibbled away. The Bashin all slide in easily. The Kozuka/Kogatana would break the Hitsu if forced in.