Bruce Pennington

Unsigned blades are fairly common. Less common, I think, during WWII than prior years, but not unheard of. I've never read anything factual as to why this happened, but there are many reasonable ideas about it. Time crunch demands could explain it. I also recently read that smiths could get more money from the private market for their blades than they could from the army. The article stated that a registered smith would put a false name on blades sold the shops to avoid being spotted by Army officials. To me, a mumei blade would achieve the same purpose.

That's a very good point, Bruno. I've been so focused on blades WITH stamps that I haven't spent any time considering blades without them being showato, simply made in prefectures not governed by the Seki guilds/associations. *sigh* This means I'm going to have to go through the Showa files looking at each smith to see if there are any showa-stamped blades from smiths outside the Seki domain. It is worth investigating as I've recently re-read an old statement made by one of the smith's that the Showa stamp was put on by the Army while the Seki stamp was from the Association. If I can find a significant number of non-Seki smiths with Showa stamps it would confirm the claim. But to your original point, I think you are right. Blades sold privately to individuals or shops wouldn't have gone through either the Seki Assoc. or Army inspection process. So lack of stamping is not a guarantee the blade is gendaito.

Rob is correct, very poor fake. Sorry. I still have my first fake I bought as a rookie!

Thanks John. A little too unusual, me thinks! Turns out I already had KA 89, and it appears to have been recently re-fitted. Amazingly good job, whoever did it. It was sold on the same site too, as they used that long string of photos that are all one when you download the image. Here's the original. You can see there's no mon. The chuso is different, and the belt rings are different. Also, the original fitters had used the "89" as fittings numbers, which are gone on this re-fit:

Thanks Mark. Your blade is one of those with 2 sets of painted numbers. One is "(MU)　ム 78" and the other is "429". I would love to say the MU 78 was an RJT number, but the mekugi ana closest to the tsuba shows that it was drilled twice, so this blade COULD have been re-fitted to the current fittings from something earlier. This would explain, from a fittings shop perspective, the two sets of numbers.

Mark, Your smith, Kaneoto, was an RJT smith. The star on the blade indicates this blade was made for the RJT system using Army-provided tamahagane. It is a gendaito. I see the Seki Ju in the mei. I found this Kaneoto blade and they said "Noshu Seki" is in Gifu prefecture:

Mark, the date is May 1944. Someone will help with the smith. Would you mind taking a look at the back edge of the nakago to see if there are any stamps or numbers? Also, are the metal fittings stamped with any numbers?

Stephen, It's a number of clues. The fittings are found on a few known gunto and all of them have Mantetsu blades in them. We think the fittings might have been made by SMR. Also, the blade itself, and nakago, match Mantetsu work. Finally, the serial number on the mune is "い 1170". The katakana "い" is the one Mantetsu used in 1945.

I'd say your theory is as good as any. I agree the piece looks appropriately aged. The rest of the fittings are quite nice. What kind of blade is in it, out of curiosity?

Neil, I can say positively that this is the latest Mantetsu we know of. They were dating blades on a fiscal year starting in April 15th each year. So, the '45s existed in April 15-August 15, four months. If the '43/'44 production rate of 500 blades per month was maintained in '45, they they could have made 2,000 blades, putting this one right in the middle (end of June '45). But we don't really know.

Mmm, Mmm, Mmm, what a beauty! If I didn't already have my kyu quota filled I'd be all over that one.

Works anyway! I've found that if a picture rotates when posted, I take the original and crop the edges, even just a little, and it re-posts normally. I like your rain-on-boards idea.

Love it guys, great examples! Stephen, do you think that's a mon, the leaf in a circle?

@Kolekt-To, are you familiar with Mal Cox's 2 articles on Navy smiths? They are in the HERE and HERE

Thanks George, didn't have that one. My Jun '44 Masakuni has 75 on the mune. Is your 78 on the mune too, or at the end of the nakago? Any chance of photos for the files?

Are there any small stamps on the back of the nakago or elsewhere?

You have a star stamped gendaito in nice fittings. I admit I have not been in the market much lately, but it’s worth at least $2400 USD. Someone else more current might update that figure for you.

Geoff, Great topic for research! I have to admit I did not know there were navy certified smith’s, or a list of them, which you would assume there would be a list. I hope you get some answers. If not, good luck with the research, we will all benefit from what you find.

I don’t see anything that points to police in this. Seems straight up army.

Other sakura habaki showing up! This one posted by @Itomagoi HERE.

John, Since your example already has a kamon, I would tend to think the sakura on habaki was more a patriotic thing? Interesting to learn more about the sakura as a mon, though.

Thanks @SteveM! And another example of a Wakase Co. set of fittings! http://www.nipponto.co.jp/upload/img95/2903_26.jpg

How very interesting! ”Hakkō ichiu (八紘一宇, "eight crown cords, one roof" i.e. "all the world under one roof") or Hakkō iu (八紘爲宇, Shinjitai: 八紘為宇) was a Japanese political slogan meaning the divine right of the Empire of Japan to "unify the eight corners of the world". This slogan formed the basis of the Japanese Empire's ideology. It was prominent from the Second Sino-Japanese War to World War II, popularized in a speech by Prime Minister Fumimaro Konoe on January 8, 1940”

George, I had these in the database already. There are some earlier blades marked with "1" or "2" but these are always with arsenal inspector marks on the mune, so might be different in purpose. They seem to stop in 1943 and the numbering you mention picks up: 1942, Mar Norisada (RJT) – Fukuoka Na Ho “1” on mune Leen, NMB 1942, Apr Masakazu (RJT) – Fukushima 1129; “1” on mune George Trotter, RS, tsuba/seppa ニ1129 1942, Jun Kanenori (RJT) Na Ho 1 on mune 1943, Aug Hiromasa (RJT) – Ehime Yama Ho 2 on mune Itomagoi, NMB RS 1944, Jun Masakuni (RJT) – Osaka 75 on mune Star Volker62, NMB RS 1944, Jul Tomonari (RJT) – Kobe Hyogo 24 on mune Star 1944, Aug Kunihide (RJT) – Kyoto 90 on mune Trotter Survey 1944, Aug Kunihide (RJT) – Kyoto 98 on mune Trotter Survey 1944, Aug Kunihide (RJT) – Kyoto 99 on mune Trotter Survey 1944, Oct Masaharu (RJT) 6 on mune Star RS mounts

Ok, I’m not posting anymore when I’ve had a couple.