Horse themed iron Fuchi Kashira help

[shan]

Can anyone tell me if they recognise the style of this work at all.

It is in Iron with Mixed metal carvings inlaid and overlaid.

It is not signed but looks well done.

I would appreciate any ideas you have.

Many thanks

Shan

 

 

 

 

 

[Ford Hallam]

I think they're Japanese , not great work though. The copper horse looks to be stuck on actually, not inlaid.

[shan]

Hi Ford,

I think you are right........another wasted $150.

I must stop wasting money.

I must stop wasting money

I must stop wasting money

I must stop wasting money

I must stop wasting money.........

 

shan

[Stephen]

I must stop wasting money

I must stop wasting money.........

 

 

REPETE

 

I must buy books

I must buy books

I must buy books :D

[Bungo]

I must stop wasting money

I must stop wasting money.........

 

 

REPETE

 

I must buy books

I must buy books

I must buy books :D

 

and do not trust the valid mei samples in the books...............they can be fake, they can be faked EASILY.

 

 

milt

[Brian]

........they can be fake, they can be faked EASILY.

No..not easily. But a heck of a lot easier than faking very good work itself.

$150 for the f/k is a good deal. Not everything has to be a masterpiece. $150 doesn't buy a lot in Japan, and these would be great mounted with a horse themed tsuba. Why must it always be masterpieces or junk? There is a nice middle ground of perfectly respectable work that is like 80% of the stuff out there and was used for good working swords.

We have to stop looking for masterpieces constantly and expecting everything to either be fantastic or junk.

 

Brian

[Ford Hallam]

actually Milt you're spot on...in every other field of art that is generally well acknowledged. The signature is the one part of a painting that can be relatively easily copied. The part that is so difficult is the work itself.

 

This does raise the question as to how it is that in this field, fittings ( I think swords are another matter ) specifically, we have these reference books of mei but rarely are we given suitable examples of the artists work to equally asses and thereby begin to develop an appreciation of their working style, it's characteristics and their skill.

 

The amusing thing is, that with regard to earlier iron guards we have quite a lot of reference material that does focus on the pieces themselves...because there are relatively few mei to obsess over :D . With kinko work it seems we have to content ourselves with "spot the difference" on the mei and trust that conformity to the "officially sanctioned" signature form guarantees quality.

[Bungo]

ford,

I respect your opinion............

However, (and i could AND very likely wrong ), it is my personal observation that Japanese fitting makers ( regardless how

famous, master or otherwise ) are not very good in doing butterflies( just one example that spring to my mind ).

they just look plain aweful...........may be that's the convention they share that butterflies should be done that way

so........... what's workmanship/taste ? If one does not appreciate the way butterflies are done the Japanese metal workers' way, is it poor workmanship ? or is it a difference in taste ?

 

While this is like comparing apples und oranges. In the case of Picasso, I love his " old master classical style " but i think his modern works are craps ( and i don't give a sh&^% how many million they are worth at Sotheby's ). Do I question his skill/workmanship as an artist ? The answer is NO, but i do question his taste ( later modern works ).

 

milt

[Brian]

Do I question his skill/workmanship as an artist ? The answer is NO, but i do question his taste

I like that! Makes me feel better about a lot of art I don't always get. Do I question his workmanship...no. But I do question his taste. I think I might use that often.

:lol:

A lot of truth in that imho.

 

Brian

[Carlo Giuseppe Tacchini]

Once I said the same (somewhere else) about the following one, and was beated to death.

So no more arguing about taste or what art is on my part.

 

About Tate gallery : http://www.cbc.ca/arts/story/2002/07/02 ... 20702.html

[Ford Hallam]

Good taste is the last refuge of the true artist

 

Milt,

 

I may agree with you to a point on butterflies...but I think I could show you some by later artists ( both Edo and Meiji ) that are quite beautiful. With most work though, we're talking about stylistic conventions that were common at a particular time. The degree of skill in the work can be objectively judged, as you agree, and the matter of whether you personally like it is yours to make. Consider the Venus of Villendorf; as an accurate depiction of a woman it's not very accurate but it was not likely that it was intended to be...and yet it continues to enchant the modern eye and most probably in ways that the maker never imagined or intended either.

 

 

I think Picasso is a good artist to consider in this context too...his later work, that which seems to raise the greatest objections can only really be objectively "understood" by a more informed appreciation of the modern art movement, it's aims and influences, and the influence it actually makes on our visual world today. It is quite easy to dismiss if we don't understand/like or respect it, but this is a rather superficial reaction and one we can learn much from if we consider the parallel situation in our own particular field of interest.

 

regards,

 

Ford

 

p.s. I only posted this reply so that I could sneakily work in a reference to this statuette and so be the first person to post a nude on the forum ...thought you'd appreciate that Milt

[Bungo]

Brian,

If I don't get that ' agent X "title, you are not really worth any salt.....enough said !!

Ford, that may enchant you, but i seriously doubt you'll share( willingly ) the same bed.

I salute you on being the first to post a full nude ( Guido got in the partially clad and doesnt count )and a full frontal Monti at that !! , but it remains to be seen how long it'll stay there.

But, in the mean time........ ( drink that fast before they are taken away )

 

milt

[John A Stuart]

Hi Ford, I think that is an accurate depiction of a gravid woman. It is after all a fertility fetish. All the features of a fertile woman reproducing and producing milk. I think a few women may have had this figure after a few babes 20 centuries ago. :lol: John

[docliss]

Dear Shan

 

We seem to have rather lost the thread of your enquiry re the iron fushi-gashira. OK, so they are not special, but iron pairs are relatively uncommon, for obvious reasons, and yours also have an iron - rather than the more usual copper - tenjō. The brown, soft quality of the iron is reminiscent of Tetsugendō work, a school derived from the Chōshū artists, and this may even explain the presence of the nunome cherry blossom. They may, then, be late C18 Tetsugendō work, and I wouldn’t be too cast down by adverse comments about their quality - at $150 I reckon they were a fair purchase.

 

Yours, John L.

[shan]

Thanks John,

That perfect for my records.

A very nice Kantei of an average item.

I just like to know what period and school for my records.

I will one day mount them.

many thanks to you all ..........and glad you enjoyed the thread (even if you digressed a little) :D

regards

shan

[nagamaki - Franco]

The following book title is a recommendation for tosogu aficionados searching for that text which is above and beyond the eternal search for the correct mei ; TOSOGU MACHIBORI MEIHIN SHUSEI FUKUSHEI Shigeo (2005)

[Bungo]

Franco,

the point presented was............ you can't bloody trust the mei comparation, mei can be copied.

 

 

milt

[nagamaki - Franco]

Franco,

the point presented was............ you can't bloody trust the mei comparation, mei can be copied.

 

 

milt

 

milt, yes, I got it, thank you, but I must say your post leaves me wondering if you understood what was meant by the words "eternal search". While the book mentioned offers images of the mei for many pieces, the examples featured are above and beyond question in regard to workmanship! Which is the point.

[Ford Hallam]

I think Franco's comment "above and beyond the eternal search for the correct mei" is fair in reference to the book quoted.

A quick search found this; a link to a page from the book It does look very tasty.

and here's a link to it's full listing at the bottom of the page, although that's not a cheap book :? So if anyone wants to send me a chrissy present....

[Guido]

It's my favorite book on Machibori, and worth every Yen (38,000 last time I looked). Mr. Tsuruta of Aoi Art has quite a few in stock, but I'm not sure if he ships them overseas (the postage will be quite expensive).

 

Of course one could buy on eBay two Tsuba and a Fuchigashira set for the same amount. :lol:

[Brian]

Thanks Franco for the tip. That does look like a great book, and I will have to make a plan to add that to my library. Guido, sounds like Aoi's price is more than fair.

Milt...I can be bought. Send me this book and you can have your title you so long for :lol: Otherwise I'll consider myself not salt-worthy. I think I can live with that

Silly season is upon us. G-d help us all! :x

 

Brian