benatthelake Posted October 23, 2013 Report Posted October 23, 2013 All: This is a sword I'm considering for purchase from a friend. I would like to evaluate based on the Koshirae/Tosugu alone. I'm very new to Tosogu and would like to get some thoughts from you all. I know...research online, go to a show, read more books but this is being offered now, otherwise will go to a dealer. Sometimes you can't always time your opportunities. The Tsuba I believe is Masakata Choshu. I'm quite impressed with it. I've seen a few online but this seems to be a very nice one. Thoughts? I could use some help with the Fuchi mei. However, with the tsuka, I'm very puzzled with the absence of Ray or shark skin or even a fabric under the wrappings. Seems to be a thin layer of some gloss material. I don't think it is simply a lacquer coat. This seem unusual...is it a sign of shoddy quality? Everything else seems to nicely match. Overall thoughts are again greatly appreciated. Ben M. Quote
Grey Doffin Posted October 23, 2013 Report Posted October 23, 2013 That's Bushu Ju on the tsuba. The tsuka is different but not shoddy. All looks nice. Grey Quote
Ludolf Richter Posted October 23, 2013 Report Posted October 23, 2013 The Tsuba was made by Masakata (H 04070),who went from Choshu to Edo.It's not the Maskata from the Ito-School.Ludolf Quote
Ludolf Richter Posted October 23, 2013 Report Posted October 23, 2013 The Fuchi-Mei reads Suikyoshi Iwamoto Ikkan: H 01850.The Kao is one of the 2 ones he used.Ludolf Quote
benatthelake Posted October 23, 2013 Author Report Posted October 23, 2013 The Tsuba was made by Masakata (H 04070),who went from Choshu to Edo.It's not the Maskata from the Ito-School.Ludolf Ludolf: Which masakata was better? Quote
Ludolf Richter Posted October 23, 2013 Report Posted October 23, 2013 Hi,I prefer "Your" (ex Choshu) Masakata,but others may choose the Ito-artist.Ludolf Quote
docliss Posted October 23, 2013 Report Posted October 23, 2013 Really a fuchi-gashira by Iwamoto Ikkan? Please let us see some images of these. John L. Quote
chris covington Posted October 23, 2013 Report Posted October 23, 2013 I don't know much about the artist who made the koshirae but I have to say I really like it! At first glance I wasn't sure but the more I look at it the more I really like it! I'd love to see some higher quality photos if you can. Thank you for sharing Chris Quote
benatthelake Posted October 23, 2013 Author Report Posted October 23, 2013 Really a fuchi-gashira by Iwamoto Ikkan? Please let us see some images of these. John L. John: I greatly appreciate your thoughts. Attached are a few more pictures of the fuchi-gashira. Please let me know if you need me to take a picture of the inside of the fuchi and I'll disassemble. Thanks again, Ben Quote
benatthelake Posted October 24, 2013 Author Report Posted October 24, 2013 Mei...close up. Hopefully this helps. GIMEI or not? Ben Quote
docliss Posted October 24, 2013 Report Posted October 24, 2013 Ben, thank you for that, but a misunderstanding. What I required were images of the entire fuchi and kashira - not of the mei. The latter looks OK, but I would prefer to base any judgement on the quality of the work rather than on the mei. With thanks, John L. Quote
benatthelake Posted October 24, 2013 Author Report Posted October 24, 2013 Ben, thank you for that, but a misunderstanding. What I required were images of the entire fuchi and kashira - not of the mei. The latter looks OK, but I would prefer to base any judgement on the quality of the work rather than on the mei. With thanks, John L. John: Thanks again, a few more close ups and different angle. Shoot me a PM if these are still not good enough. Ben Quote
benatthelake Posted October 24, 2013 Author Report Posted October 24, 2013 Any other opinions on the Kashira/Gashira (still somewhat of a puzzle here) or overall Koshirae? Thanks to the feedback and verification on the Tsuba. Again...don't own it yet so any feedback is welcomed. Ben Quote
Stephen Posted October 25, 2013 Report Posted October 25, 2013 I like the complete set so far, may we ask to see the blade? Quote
benatthelake Posted October 25, 2013 Author Report Posted October 25, 2013 Stephen: Absolutely, however the koshirae and fittings are interesting so I thought to start on this thread. More importantly, I've been struggling with the very faint mei on the blade and wanted to get the best pictures available. I hoping to get pictures out this weekend. Thanks for asking. Ben Quote
Jean Posted October 25, 2013 Report Posted October 25, 2013 Ben, Is the F/K made of brass or gold? Quote
benatthelake Posted October 25, 2013 Author Report Posted October 25, 2013 Ben, Is the F/K made of brass or gold? The Fuchi is made from brass (I believe) as shown. I am assuming the Kashira is the same (although I have not removed it to inspect). Does this lead you to any conclusion? Thanks! Ben Quote
Jean Posted October 25, 2013 Report Posted October 25, 2013 Ben, I don't know the artist but from what John says Iwamoto Ikkan looks like to be a top artist. Do you think, if it is the case, that the F/K matches a top artist work? BTW, It seems that, from the pictures, they have been cleaned, they are very shiny. Quote
docliss Posted October 25, 2013 Report Posted October 25, 2013 Ben I am sorry but, in spite of a fairly good mei and kao, I do not believe that the quality of the work is good enough to be that of I. Ikkan. This artist is not rated in Kinko Meikan, where he is listed as I. Kazuhiro and considered only as Ryoko, but his work is superior to that of your fuchi-gashira, which I personally believe to be gimei. John L. Quote
benatthelake Posted October 25, 2013 Author Report Posted October 25, 2013 Ben, I don't know the artist but from what John says Iwamoto Ikkan looks like to be a top artist. Do you think, if it is the case, that the F/K matches a top artist work? BTW, It seems that, from the pictures, they have been cleaned, they are very shiny. Jean: In my limited research this does not match anything from Iwamoto Ikkan to your point. Which I find strange. It seems that if it is Gimei, it would be "close" to something he did. Mei seems strong...again from my limited experience. Almost as if this was a practice piece...an artist sketch versus a full painting. Grasping I know. I think I should consider it Gimei. I certainly haven't cleaned it either. Attached are a few pictures of the blade. Thanks, Ben Quote
Stephen Posted October 25, 2013 Report Posted October 25, 2013 The F/K are not of the norm, and do looked like they were shined, that or there gold. I think it fits the over all koshirae Blade looks good maybe a bit heavy n the acid wash, ill let you know about your PM when i see the nakago. Quote
benatthelake Posted October 26, 2013 Author Report Posted October 26, 2013 The F/K are not of the norm, and do looked like they were shined, that or there gold. I think it fits the over all koshirae Blade looks good maybe a bit heavy n the acid wash, ill let you know about your PM when i see the nakago. Thanks Stephen. Nakago posted under "very faint mei help" under translation assistance. Thought I should continue to seek help there as that's where it started. Mei is even more of a mystery. I'll need to pull the Fuchi off again and take a look. Could it be a gold coating? My friend knows nothing of swords, but he has a ton of antiques and knows better than to clean anything. He confirmed these have not been since he has inherited them 4 years ago. I'll take another look. The look of "acid wash" really came out with the camera flash. It is not that apparent under natural light. Does "acid wash" significantly impact the value?....i've heard mixed opinions. Really appreciate everyone's thoughts on the this one. Will help me make an educated decision on next steps with it..first one being to buy or not. Ben Quote
kusunokimasahige Posted October 26, 2013 Report Posted October 26, 2013 It could be gilded. The acid wash I do not see. Maybe Stephen can explain that one. KM Quote
Brian Posted October 26, 2013 Report Posted October 26, 2013 The blade/hada. It has that "hard" look to it like an acid wash does. People who don't know how to polish think that making the hada stand out and be all gaudy is a good thing. They have no idea what that perfect polish "wet look" is. Anyways, this one isn't done too terribly, and I think is a nice and desirable package as a whole. The individual parts may not be masterpieces, but as a complete mounting, it is quite pleasant. Brian Quote
benatthelake Posted October 26, 2013 Author Report Posted October 26, 2013 Ben, I don't know the artist but from what John says Iwamoto Ikkan looks like to be a top artist. Do you think, if it is the case, that the F/K matches a top artist work? BTW, It seems that, from the pictures, they have been cleaned, they are very shiny. Thanks again everyone. Posted one final picture of the Fuchi. Although I agree it is probably not Iwamoto Ikkan based on his historical works and level of quality, it clearly has some sort of gold guilding or something on it. You'll see from the picture along the edge, some parts are gold and some more tarnished brass. One flake had come off as well. Also pictured is a picture of the complete sword. According to Chris Bowen and a few others, the mei reads Norishige. Which one will require more research and may be impossible to know. Bottom line...I'll be making an offer of $2,500 - $3,000 on it tomorrow. Any opinions on this price are welcomed..pm or otherwise. Very welcomed! I hope the discussion on Iwamoto Ikkan (although probably Gemei) and Tsuba pics (I do like this one) added value to the board. Ben Quote
kusunokimasahige Posted October 26, 2013 Report Posted October 26, 2013 Thank you Brian for explaining that one ! KM Quote
benatthelake Posted October 27, 2013 Author Report Posted October 27, 2013 The blade/hada. It has that "hard" look to it like an acid wash does. People who don't know how to polish think that making the hada stand out and be all gaudy is a good thing. They have no idea what that perfect polish "wet look" is.Anyways, this one isn't done too terribly, and I think is a nice and desirable package as a whole. The individual parts may not be masterpieces, but as a complete mounting, it is quite pleasant. Brian Brian and all: How long has "acid washing" been an option for polishers? Recently (last 30 years) or something done even back in the 1800s? I was able to pick this up on the low end of my range and quite happy but don't believe I took advantage of my friend. Price reflects what I now believe to be true for blade and fittings. Appreciate everyone's thoughts and guidance. Ben Quote
Brian Posted October 27, 2013 Report Posted October 27, 2013 This kind (if it is acid enhanced, and that isn't a certainly) is usually done by amateurs when doing home polishing. I won't get into the whole "professional polishers using acid" debate except to say that when done it isn't as gaudy as some. I wouldn't worry about it. The package is a nice one. Brian Quote
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