Jake6500

Hello expert translators! I recently made a new thread about a tsuba I recently purchased. The seller attributed it to Hirata however members of the forum have raised some doubts about whether this attribution is accurate or whether it might be Nagasaki shippo or *insert alternative attribution here!* I figured I'd see if anyone could translate the hakogaki and give me some additional insight into the origins of this piece!

Thanks everyone for all these responses! The attribution of Hirata school could very well be incorrect, I was merely going by the attribution of the previous owner/seller. I can see what everyone is saying. Stylistically when I am looking at the shape and materials Nagasaki shippo does seem possible or even likely. The two styles also originate geographically in close proximity to one another so it should be no surprise misattributions might occasionally be made between the two. To be honest, none of the examples I have seen for Hirata, Hirado or Nagasaki shippo seem quite close enough to be called a match to me so I'd be interested to one day see what the NBTHK think.

These fittings seem authentic to my eye. The fuchi seems to be made of good quality material. Not sure what this is priced at but if you're thinking of buying, seems like a decent purchase.

Hi forum members, You might have seen my recent thread about bird themed Tosogu in which I posted two of my recent acquisitions from my collection however as it happens, there's one more very interesting piece I have to share with you all and that is this Hirata school enamel tsuba! From what I understand it appears to be a tsuba from the main Hirata line and likely a pretty early Edo piece based on the shape of the Hitsu Ana. The enamel technique was protected and passed down only to the main line successors in the Hirata school who produced pieces directly for the Shogunate. The presence of the Tokugawa mon in the design therefore provides an indication of the origins of this piece, although precise dating would be quite difficult as all mainline successors went by the "Hikoshiro" moniker and rarely signed mei/kao. There are two theories about how the founder of the Hirata school, Hirata Donin, learned to produce cloisonne pieces. The first is that he encountered the technique in Korea during Hideyoshi's invasion in the 1590's after accompanying the samurai as an armourer. The second is that the technique was picked up back in Japan upon his return through interactions with the Dutch on Dejima Island. Regardless, the technique was valued by the Shogunate and protected for a long time. This is about all I know about these types of tsuba right now. Any additional information you may have about the Hirata school would be appreciated! Share some other enamel or early Edo pieces!

This one is very nice. I think as you said it is a phoenix... That one is my type of flashy!

I really like the simplicity of this kozuka Jason! Sometimes some high quality carving is all you actually need!

Thanks for the info Dale. The Hiroyoshi tsuba turned out to be even nicer than I expected when I saw it in hand! You can't easily see it from the pictures but the base metal has a nice strong hue and it's a lot lighter in colour than I had expected. The flower and the bird both have a bit of gold in them but they are two different shades (presumably two different levels of purity) which make them noticeably different! As for the Toryusai fuchigashira, I couldn't quite figure out whether it's authentic or gimei when I went through different reference materials but either way, the quality is there! Lots of chickens so far, but surprisingly no cranes in the thread yet!

Hey fellow Tosogu fanatics! I've been away from the board for a little while due to work taking up much of my attention recently but that doesn't mean I've stopped collecting these past few months! I have a couple new acquisitions I have been waiting to share with the board so this post is well overdue! As the title suggests, two of my latest acquisitions include birds in the mise-en-scene! Hoping for any knowledge the board might have about the artists Toryusai Kiyohisa or Marukawa Hiroyoshi (Mito school). Also, post your favourite birds from your own collections!

Thanks for the information, I will watch and learn! I have lots of room to learn about iron work.

In relation to my earlier comment I realise I might not have been clear enough. I was suggesting the tsuba was made from a cast mold and was made of iron, not necessarily that cast-iron was used. The use of a mold would suggest (in my opinion) that this tsuba is not that old, likely late 19th or even early 20th century (Meiji, Taisho). Then again I am going off a single picture, so I could be wrong.

Looks like Fans design, cast iron to me. Definitely later cast imo.

Lucky you, my love of flashy designs, shibuichi and shakudo has been bleeding me dry My favourite types of pieces by and large are the ones going through the roof in price. I do have a pretty broad collection though which has been described by other Australian members on this board as "random" (they're honestly not wrong) so I can still find affordable pieces here and there!

The Tosogu market as a whole is quite strong at the moment, pieces selling for big bucks over the past 6 months or so, multiple pieces exceeding the 400,000 yen mark. That said you can still get a good deal here and there with a bit of luck and patience. I've recently made three decent purchases over the past few weeks which I will be sharing with the forum soon. One of them I literally secured with the winning bid less than an hour ago at the time of writing this comment!! I think as a general rule shiny stuff (shibuichi, shakudo, gold) and cultural depictions like gods, oni or yokai are in vogue right now whereas some solid pieces depicting less flashy things are still going under the radar on occasion.

i highly doubt that any museum would do such a thing today but in the past, say in the 1890's or something? Absolutely. The city of Troy was excavated haphazardly by an amateur (at least by modern standards) with dynamite. He literally blew a huge hole in the middle of the ancient city without a care in the world in pursuit of gold and treasure. Compared to that a couple numbers on a tsuba is nothing!

Agree with Curran, I have also observed this same auction listing. The numbers are undoubtedly very old museum catalogue numbers indicating this tsuba has been around for a long time and is probably in some very old book somewhere.

I am not a Goto school expert by any means (or an expert at all) but as a general rule menuki are not often signed. You sometimes see signatures on the backs with inserted metal plates or sometimes on the sides as in this example, but mei on menuki are less common than on tsuba, kozuka or fuchigashira and it is usually only your mid to high quality menuki that got signed. In my opinion signatures on menuki are therefore more trustworthy on average than say fuchigashira, where there are gimei floating around all over the place. All this is to say that if you have a decent quality menuki with a signature on it, especially when that signature is a tiny detail on the side of the piece like this, the chance of the signature being shoshin is higher, relatively speaking. I concur with Brian, though I would like to see what someone more versed with the Goto school thinks... Regarding the reuse of the menuki, this was a fairly common practice. I once saw a Meiji period wooden drawer being sold on Jauce that featured an authentic, signed menuki on it (I can't remember whether it was Ishiguro or Ichinomiya). The practice was more common with pouches like yours.

Nice tsuba Mike, I'm usually not the biggest fan of open works and personally gravitate toward the solid stuff but this one has a nice design. Bridges were a major feature in mid to late Edo period art such as in Hokusai's famous ukiyo-e collection of bridges across Japan. The added fukurin is indicative not of additional structural protection or support, but of an additional aesthetic quality added to the piece. Think of it as the frame or border around an iron painting.

Interesting theme I have not encountered before. Thanks Colin, for spreading your cultural knowledge!

Looks like a boat in the reeds by the shore to me... Not sure what the overall theme might be though.

I had seen this listing before it ended and hard passed on it, not because I thought the tsuba was fake but mainly because I didn't like the style or quality enough to bid on it. As has been said already the nanako look quite good which indicates it is likely authentic. The copper in the sekigane is an interesting observation but not enough of a reason to conclude the tsuba is a modern fake. At least, not in my view.

Hi Justin, As you get deeper into the hobby you will find rats/mice are actually a fairly common design. I think the deep symbolism in this one has already been deciphered and I'm a bit late to the thread. What I will say is this is a decent pickup for a rookie collector! A nice cultural design, authentic piece from the Edo Period, the rat sticks out from the base which makes it "pop" which is a quality many collectors like. Hard to tell the school as others have said but if I was to hazard a guess, maybe Aizu-Shoami? Don't quote me on that though! I'm guessing mostly based on the 3 dimensional carving of the rat, the iron base and the contrast of metals in the carvings. Interested to see what Piers and Dale think, if they have any schools in mind.

Hi Giordy, There are a couple giveaways about this tsuba. Firstly as others have pointed out this is a commonly replicated design. Secondly, the nakago ana in the middle has been cut with an unusually square-ish shape. Finally, the space where the seppa would normally go seems unevenly shaped and does not appear to form a proper oval. These are the key points that stick out to me just at a glance.

Some fantastic examples Viktor! I agree that the differences in the kao are minimal and that your set is authentic. I never raised this earlier but the level of detail in the hands on your kashira are not the type of thing lesser artists could have pulled off. These new examples you've linked are also fantastic pieces that seem to exhibit similar features and I'm wondering if this might be an identifying point for Unno school (certainly for Unno Yoshimori) works!

Those are some incredible investigative powers as usual Dale! Collection and catalogue numbers are an important tool in tracing the provenance of antiques!

Thanks Viktor for the solid examples and the extra information! I did find another source that aligns with what you have said here, namely that this artist resided in Echigo province but a lot of this information is new to me including the connection to the Hamano school and the Matsudaira family! I do think the Shoki tsuba above shares some features with the Hamano style so in hindsight the connection makes sense. I think the mei in your examples are also a pretty close match which is also reassuring. The very minor differences as you've said can likely be attributed to the work having been produced at an earlier or later stage in the artisans career. The tsuba and fuchigashira you've posted here are both beautiful pieces! I'm not as keen on the kozuka, mostly I think because of the material but the craftmanship is still great. It seems Seisendo was big on the wave motif! Here is one more example I had found earlier when researching but forgot to post: Thanks again for the information!