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Interesting, thank you. Short answer is no, it does not extend the whole blade and is not the same on both sides. At least not to my novice observation. Muromachi would not hurt my feelings. This sword only put me back hundreds, not thousands. Muromachi was actually my first impression - but i'm not drawing any concrete conclusions until I get this sword into someones hands or Shinsa. What's your current opinion on age and school @Jacques D.? I understand photo kentai will be far from definitive. I appreciate your expertise and input, Cheers, -Sam

Hi Khalid, I am sincerely jealous of all of you attending the Orlando show. I really want to make it one of these years! Please share photos, so I can live vicariously through ya'll. Here's an ongoing thread about the show. You might have better luck finding fellow attendees here: BUT I will be at the SF show! All the best, Cheers, -Sam

Thank you @Lewis B! I appreciate your input One of the reasons I really liked this sword, is because it reminds me of an early O-suriage Tegai Wakizashi that I am having professionally restored. I wont get that sword back for over a year+. Albeit, that sword has ji-nie and other activity like sunagashi, while this one is much less active. Cheers, -Sam

Thank you @Jussi Ekholm, I value your input! I’ve really enjoyed reading your posts over the last couple years I’ve been active on this forum. Your information gathering of awarded Juyo blades has been really interesting. I also think this sword is greatly shortened. You’re right, it is very tricky to imagine how it originally looked (especially for me!), and I’m at a loss for dating it. It’s been enjoyable to admire nonetheless. Safe travels, and thank you! As for the height of the shinogi… Jury is still out. I’m having a hard time determining, but it does not appear particularly high to me. This has been a struggle for me to identify that I hope to remedy once I can see more blades side-by-side. Apologies

Thank you @Jacques D., and good question. I took my sword out this morning to investigate the shinogi height, and also that line. The line appears on both sides where masame is most heavy, but not in the same area (they don't mirror each-other by any means). It does not extend the entire blade. It fades into itame/mokume after a few inches toward the kissaki. Upon inspection of the JI, it seems the masame is mostly toward the hamachi, and in the middle of the blade. Toward the kissaki it blends into itame and/or mokume with more intermittent masame. This is just my observation. More experienced eyes may vary! I couldn't get great photos, i'll have to wait for another nice day. Here’s a highlight from my previous photos where that line appears to end on that side. I know photos are not ideal for Nihonto, but the discussion does help me learn. Thank you!

Thank you for clearing that up for me. That makes sense now, and is much appreciated! I agree that the shinogi does not appear particularly "high" - but I would say it's higher than it is low. I'll have to take a closer look at the shinogi height after work today. Edit: is there a way to measure, or photograph, the Shinogi height in a meaningful way? Thank you again, Cheers, -Sam

Thank you @Brian, some people just can't help themselves. This particular pattern is becoming predictable at this point For what it's worth I am still shopping for a papered mainline Yamato blade (as described in my "wanted to buy" thread). This particular sword I just had to have for the price. I'm under no illusions that it's a high end piece or anything. Like I said, I like it! I'm just a newly married blue-collar fella. I'd quickly lose my wife/life if I bought all the swords, art, and collectibles I REALLY want Cheers, -Sam

Thank you very much Rivkin! Your comment is very helpful, and offers me avenues to research. Even if I rule some out, I will have learned something in the process, which is exactly what I hoped to get from this thread. You are absolutely correct in your observation about the Jie-Nie, it's nearly absent, or very hard to see. Your observation about the nie in the hamon is spot-on also, its more ko-nie, and very fine. Getting the photographs that I got was a challenge to show that. No utsuri to speak of, but i'm sure that's no surprise. The open grain is less obvious in hand, and took some tricks of the light to expose. I have a question about your observation about the blade being "massive". I had perceived this sword as being fairly slender and small. What did you mean by that? Motokasane = 5.9 mm Sakikasane = 4.1 mm Motohaba= 27.1 mm Sakihaba= 17.5 mm Sori = 7.3 mm Kissaki = 32 mm Nagasa = 51 Cm Total = 65.5 Cm Thank you very much for your input. Cheers, -Sam

Thank you @Lewis B, and I like your sword very much! Right now I’m looking into Shikkake, Sue-Tegai, and Uda. But I’m mostly just enjoying the ride and not drawing any conclusions. Its easy to jump down the wrong rabbit hole with the combination of mumei, suriage, and my own inexperience. I’m trying to view it critically, and not allow my hopes and desires to impede my assessment. At the very least it’s got my nose in my books! And its condition allows me to enjoy it for what it is (whatever it is). Cheers, -Sam

Has masame that’s more prevalent near the suguha hamon. Otherwise there’s some mokume and itame throughout. Some more closeup outdoor shots of the blade:

First of all, I like this sword. It checks many of my boxes. It reminds me of another wakizashi that I’m having professionally restored. It’s unpapered and mumei. I think KOTO and suriage. I’m getting Yamato vibes. Am I just seeing what I want to see, or am I on the right track? Nagasa: 51cm (20.2inch) Motohaba: 2.7cm Sakihaba: 1.75cm Kissaki length: 3.2cm Still working on photography. I need a lighting rig. Light and reflections seemed to be battling me on this one. It’s easier to admire and looks better in-hand. Cheers, -Sam

Color me jealous... Lovely sword Lewis! It checks many of my personal boxes. Thank you for sharing! Cheers, -Sam

I think if you have a trained and professional crafstman do the work, then altering a nakago-ana is OK... That being said, if the Tsuba is papered, then the altered nakago-ana might make the papers appear/become invalid, because the photo no longer perfectly matches the item. < Question for the more experienced: would this be a correct assumption? Cheers, -Sam

I've always been told to leave Type 95s in their tsuka, because it's difficult to get them to fit together tight when you re-assemble them. It's cool to actually see one disassembled. I've flipped the images so we can see them properly oriented. Cheers, Sincerely, -Sam

I'm interested to see the Nakago. Keep us posted! You may get some flack, but i'd also take a swing at only $300 Best of luck, -Sam

Please don't take my opinions here as fact: - First and foremost, I have also never seen this combo of style and colors. - My guess is that it's real, maybe with some "post-production" customization going on. 0-10 and 10 is fake? I’d give it a 4 for now, pending more images. Obviously a big wild guess with just the one photo. Are you able to request more photos? Best of luck, -Sam

Thanks for sharing Brian, and congratulations! I've always really liked older blades in Gunto fittings and I collected them for a little bit. This one looks like a great find. I'd be curious to see better photos of that Sarute. It looks better-than-average to my untrained eye. Very cool! It always feels good to rescue a sword from the wild. Cheers, -Sam

Hello everyone, I have finally sold some of the beginner pieces from my collection, and would like to purchase something papered and in-polish. I'd like to get the best "bang-for-my-buck" quality wise; so I was thinking O-suriage mumei Wakizashi with NBTHK attribution papers. Let me know if you think this is a bad route with my given budget and experience - I am always open to more experienced advice and opinions. My tastes gravitate toward Yamato and Yamashiro den, and the older the better... I enjoy admiring swords that exhibit masame, mokume, hakikake, and suguha hamon. Length is less important to me at this stage in my collecting. In a perfect world I'd buy something Awataguchi or Rai, but I've got to keep my expectations realistic (but this gives an idea of the aesthetic I admire) I was hoping to find a good example of Yamato Taema, Hosho, or maybe Shikkake. Anything old Yamashiro would be awesome, but I just don't think I have the funds for that. Something in shirasaya so I can focus my $ on the blade. I don't want Mihara or Uda. Is something Kamakura or Nambokucho too much to ask? Hoping to find something in the States, and have started shopping around. I will be at the SF sword show this August, if anyone would like to discuss some blades in person. Budget: ~$3,500 All the best, -Sam

I’m sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but this sword is not a genuine Japanese sword. Unfortunately, It is likely a Chinese fake. http://www.jssus.org...japanese_swords.html Sincerely, -Sam

Interesting older discussion. Why, exactly, is it that shinogi-zukuri tanto with yokote are always such low quality? I understand that the form is unattractive. And I’ve seen so many that are more ‘touristy’ than anything. But does it not stand to reason that high quality blades could be suriage to such a short length, that they’d still have some level of quality and interest? When a really nice shinogi-zukuri blade had to be shortened to such an extent. Was the sword simply scrapped rather than changed so drastically? All the best, Cheers, -Sam

Howdy, neighbor! I am just a collector, and not an expert. I would avoid using it for practice until you've got a better idea of what you have. You never know! I will be following along to see what the more knowledgable have to say. Welcome to the forum! Cheers from Tualatin, Feel free to reach out if you wanna chat swords with a fellow beginner, -Sam

While it's well publicized, albeit hard to ascertain without experience, what a "well made" Nihonto should be. To me, there's a scale to any art, and ones budget restricts the quality. IMO art is subjective, and not all art is equal. My niece makes art at our house every weekend, but none of it will ever be displayed in the Louvre. Likewise, my sue-bizen late muromachi sword will never be appreciated as a masterful work of art; but I think it's cool, and it reminds me of better works i've seen in other collections. Not in a way I can appreciate for hours on end or anything, but it's just enough to spark my interest, study, and keep the Nihonto ball rolling. Just like that oil painting on my wall isn't a Rembrandt - it does remind me of fine art i've seen around the world - just a much lower quality. Should I tear everything down, and criticize it all, because it's not "tRuE aRt"? Not my style. Just my two cents, fART, -Sam

It's a shame there's not a club up here, I was surprised too. There's a few of us collectors scattered about. I've thought about trying to start a club, but I'm just too busy. Maybe someday. (But crossing my fingers someone else starts a PNW club before then ). A great alternative is the Northern California Japanese Sword Club. They do zoom meetings and offer a bunch of other great resources. I have yet to join their meetings, but I just recently renewed my membership, thanks to a advice from @Toryu2020 http://www.ncjsc.org/ All the best, -Sam

Good info here, and cool sword Hunter. I am also looking forward to seeing your other blades. Nice to see more Nihonto collectors in the Northwest. A kind hello from your southern neighbor (Oregon)! Welcome to the forum, Cheers, -Sam

Out of curiosity, and sorry if you've covered this before, but: What are you plans with your information gathering endeavors? Do you plan to write a book / provide info for a book? I imagine it would be more comprehensive than what we currently have available on gunto nakago. @Rivkin you thinking of writing a book? Cheers, -Sam