Bruce Pennington

Chris, We are no longer certain the presence of the Showa and Seki stamps are signs of showato. So it is possible the blades are gendaito. As always, the blade must tell the story. Interesting note on the Kaneshige blades with Kobuse stamp - I have 5 on file now, and the 3 showing koshirae are all civil mounts! Interesting item!

The banana cutter is steel, but the next 2 are pierced brass.

Partially and poorly struck stamps can really play tricks on us. I know I've been down a couple of rabbit holes with some! Many of the Gifu stamps I have on file are really poorly struck. Seems symptomatic of their inspectors, for some reason. Here's how I see it:

Thanks for the added photos, beautiful craftsmanship on that fuchi! Now I think there is a chance it is the same mark as on that blade I have on file. I think it's a shop logo. Guys can correct me if I'm wrong, but it's not a kanji that I've ever seen, so it's some sort of emblem, maybe intending to look like a fish?

That’s perfect thank you! Could be the same shop, or two different ones. They are slightly different and how they are crafted.

Thanks Chris, I think it's a Gifu stamp. Adding it to the files!

Welcome, Lee! Looks like you're going about it the right way.

Numbers, "2342". Don't know why they don't match the numbers on the fittings. Sometimes they do, sometimes they don't. Could I get a good, close shot of that stamp on the seppa? Haven't see that one before. It's very similar to an unknown stamp on a Yoshinao blade I have on file:

I don't think so, Thomas. Incredible! Thanks for sharing!

Chris, Is that a Showa or Gifu stamp? and can I get a clear photo?

You're right! And those new photos show a better view of the tsuba, which looks the same. Just lower quality kabutogane, I guess.

Aliaksandr, There is a serial number on the back edge of the nakago. Can you please post a photo of that? An overall shot of the whole rig with fittings would be nice too! The key to decipher the zodiacal dates is here: http://japaneseswordindex.com/kanji/zodiac.htm, since we're doing the 'learning' thing! @Kiipu @BANGBANGSAN

I could be wrong, but this one looks like a fake imitation of the real one. Note the differences in the kabutogane in style and quality. Also, the wrap on this one is folded in one direction which is typical for Chinese fakes, and the material/color looks new. The fact that a faker would imitate the original means the original was legit WWII stuff. Fakers don't copy other fakes.

A plain tsuba posted by @Yukihiro HERE.

Didier, You may have this already, from Sesko's book: "SUKENORI (祐則), Shōwa (昭和, 1926-1989), Gifu – “Sukenori” (祐則), real name Nagata Eiichi (永田栄一), born August 28th 1910, he worked as guntō smith." It is an old Urban Legand in the sword community that stamping was "comulsory for non traditionally made swords". To date, no one has found a law or military regulation stating that swords had to be stamped at all. It was not a regular practice at the Tokyo 1st Army Arsenal, for example. I only have found 2 "Ki" stamped blades and very few "To" stamped blades from that arsenal, yet they clearly handled thousands upon thousands of showato. So stamping was not compulsory. The famous large Seki stamp you refer to, we believe, was being used by a civilian organization call The Seki Cutlery Manufacterers Association. The Seki City website states that "all Japanese swords" were inspected and stamped, but Ohmura has a 1939 survey of blades stamped by the Association, and it states that gendaito were not inspected. Even if the blade is showato, there are various ways a blade could have gotten to market and by-passed the Association's inspectors. As always, judge the blade not the (stamp) to misquote the adage! On a side note, nice civilian employee tsuba!

Thanks Trystan! I've always like that dark grey colored saya style.

Sorry guys, see my edit above. I don't have a shot of the Yoshimichi tsuba, and it's likely the same one, no swap was done.

Spend some time browsing through these pages! http://ohmura-study.net/900.html then spend some time here: https://www.militaria.co.za/nmb/gallery/category/7-fake-Japanese-swords/ You will see the difference!

Might have been brought home from the war, but that's not a WWII sword. Much older. Still could have been used during the war, of course. Better pics of the saya (scabbard) might help, but it looks like a civil one, maybe wrapped like that to protect it?

An update. For anyone filing/tracking these, it turns out Jonathan's sword is the same sword posted earlier by @Yoshimichi. Don't know why the tsuba was swapped for another, but the nakago, and saya marks are identical. Edit: Disregard the mention of tsuba. I had mind-melded the sword from Stegel into this, which has a different tsuba. I checked my files and don't have a shot of the Yoshimichi tsuba. It's likely the same one.

These kind of swords are always controversial. The problem is that there is no documentation to verify their source. Another problem is that the lower quality workmanship of the occupied lands is so similar to the workmanship of Chinese fakes that it is almost impossible to tell them apart. We do know for a fact that swords were made in occupied lands. And I think there are some telltale signs one can go by. For example, the alternating direction of the wrapping, and the quality of the metal fittings. Both are typical Japanese and not normally found on fakes. I believe many of our top experts on nihonto have very little experience studying World War II gunto and almost no experience studying late war and occupied land swords. It is just not their area of expertise.

Ok, I see now the seller was simply referencing Fuller's discussion of swords made in the field and by collaborating forces.

Wow! Did you buy this from Richar Fuller?! Same maker for sure. I didn't post the kabutogane of Yoshimichi's, but they are the same The fuchi and leather cover snaps are also the same. Interesting that all 3 have different tsuba.

From Sesko's book: NORISADA (則貞), Shōwa (昭和, 1926-1989), Gifu – “Norisada” (則貞), real name Katō Sumitarō (加藤隅太郎), he worked as guntō smith

Agree with Brian, that without seeing the nakago, or greater detail of the blade, ID is impossible. John, @PNSSHOGUN, ran a thread on long swords, where several were discussed: