paulb

Well, on first view the mei looks within the range of Omi Daijo signatures. In partcular the Fujiwara characters and the Hiro character look to be good matches. (kick your friend for cleaning it though) All I can say so far is that it is not an obvious fake (of which there are many) As said before it depends what he wants for it and how much you would be prepared to spend to bring it up to standard. good luck Paul

Steve, can you get a decent image of the mei? As to whether you/anyone should buy it, well as I think was said in an earlier thread to someone else only the buyer can decide that and what they are prepared to pay. General points to consider when thinking of buying an out of polish unpapered Hizen sword: 1. Hizen swords by the first 3 generations especially have always been popular and expensive. Because of this there are many forgeries some of which are very, very good. 2. Omi Daijo was very long lived which means a) there are a lot of his swords about, b) over the 60 years of his working life his signature varied a lot and c) because of this he is a main target for forgers. 3. It is always a risk buying Hizen blades out of polish. As has been often said here the skin steel is very thin and everytime you polish one there is a real risk of core steel showing through. On the up side if you buy it at the right price, it polishes without a problem and papers you could have a very fine sword. It depends how much of a gamble you are prepared to take. consider though that the cost of a good polish, shirasaya and papering would cost several thousand pounds on top of what you pay for it. As it has been shortenned it will never get better than Tokubestsu Hozon papers. Examples of this smiths work papered and polished have been on various websites in recent years ranging from £8k to £14k but these were before current economic situation. having had it polished and should it fail to paper you will have a gimei Tadahiro and would struggle to recoup the cost of the polish. Dont know if this helps. but I think you have to consider all possibilities when looking at a top name out of polish and un papered. Best Regards Paul

Hi Peter, Before going down the Bungo route I think it is worth looking at later generation Hizen smiths. From 5 through to 7 the quality did trail off a little which resulted in less nie and a more robust look. I still think this shape is too heavy but I also think it is worth looking a little more deeply before going to the outer schools. (Bungo Takada did do Hizen copies amongst others BTW) regards paul

Hi Peter, The jigane could certainly be described as Konuka. Against it being Hizen Tadayoshi school is the shape wch looks a bit clunky. I am guessing its hard to tell in current polish but can you see the thickness of the nioi-guchi or whether there is any nie running through the hamon or within the jigane?

Peter, can you post a picture of rhe whole blade and the boshi? from your original image I would go with ko-itame but could equally consider konuka, nashiji etc depending on what actvity, chikei, ji-nie etc is visible paul

Barry, John, It is an interesting point regarding teachers and construction. I am not aware of Munetsugu blades having a reputation for thin skin and Umetda Myoju blades least, at least Daito are scarce so difficult to judge. I have never been confortable with the deliberate attempt to emulate the sumitetsu in Rai and enju blades. I am becoming increasingly convinced that these features are a result of incorporating harder steel in to the jigane rather than core metal showing through which is what we see in Hizen Tadayoshi. Also Nabashima was a supreme marketing man so to cut back on quality was unlikely to be an option when he was promoting Tadaoshi blades as high quality and emulating good Yamashiro tradition swords. I had not thought of, but like the performance idea of Johns. It would make sense that a more robust and reliable blade would gain a strong reputation more quickly and as John says I doubt there was too much consideration given to how the blade would look 3-400 years down the road.

Hi Veli, without looking at Hawleys I dont have a definitive answer. However remember that the Tadahiro name went through several generations. With the exception of the 2nd and third gens it was traditional for the heir apparent to take the name Tadahiro until the father died and then change to Tadayoshi. Likewise the Omi Daijo title appears in several generations so it may be (I say may because I cant remember and I am too lazy to look) that two seperate generations used the same name and title. If so the later generation would not have such a high rating as the Nidai. Alternatively: Nidai Tadahiro was exceptionally good at Suguha, some say the best. He was less good at choji and choji midare. Is it possilbe this variation in points (which is extremely unreliable BTW) relates to his different work styles? I will try and double check tonight and if anythng becomes clearer I will let you know. regards paul

Hi Barry/ Brian Article forwarded as requested. Best regards paul

Hi John, should be in your in box regards Paul

Before studying under Umetada Myoju Tadayoshi was apprentcied to another highly regarded Hizen Smith called Munetsugu working in Nagase. Tadayoshi returned to Hizen after his time with Umetada but set up his workshop in Saga rather than returning to Nagase. When He changed his name in 1624 there was no-one within his School to take on the by now famous Tadayoshi name (his own son was about 9 years old at the tiime) so it was taken by Munetsugu's best pupil. This Tadayoshi obtained the Tosa no kami title some years later. However his work is in the Munetsugu tradition rather than what we now know as Hizen (in reality the Tadayoshi Hizen) so his work is closer to Bizen-den than the Yamashiro and Enju look of the Tadayoshi school. It is also suggested that Tosa no Kami worked alongside Tadayoshi 1 when they were both Students of Munetsugu. I am sure this adds to the confusion but if it helps I wrote a fairly long paper about Hizen Tadayoshi and his school some years ago and would be happy to send it to you. I think it will explain more clearly the relationship between the diffrent smiths. Just pm or email me and I will forward it on. Regards paul

Yes I think you are right John, now you have said it I can see the kami well done you cheers Paul

I am sure some one with better eyes and Kanj ability than me will correct this but at first sight it looks like a very worn Omi Daijo Tadahiro. Cant see enough to validate the authenticity or otherwise. Agree the second one looks to be a showa-to regards Paul

Experieince seems to vary with every sword that is imported. For what it is worth the easiest shipments I have recieved have been through Fedex, generally more expensive but yards ahead of parcelforce regarding claearance. The description I usually use and so far without a problem is " Antique Japanese Art Sword over 100 years old" on the customs form. I also usually get the buyer to enclose a letter confirming that he blade is a legal import as it is over 100 years old made using traditional methods by a recognised Japanese artisan. Whether or not it gets through easily will depend more on the mood of the cusoms officer than anything you say in the documentation. Good luck!

Steve, not necessarily silly but a huge question. Hada is a result of the way different grades of iron/steel are stacked in a block, welded and folded. Different schools worked with different materials and assembled the blocks and worked the steel in different ways. Presumably this was because it added to the functionality and the aesthetic of the blade. Likewise hamon were develooped to improve the performance, durablitiy and beauty of a blade. Once again different schools developed their own unique style. Nakago shapes? I have no idea but probaby formed a non written signature identifying the work to a particular smith or school.

It is always difficult to be 100% sure from photographs of blades in poor polish but the hamon on this blade looks to be acid etched in which was not an uncommon practice on dirks from this period with machine made blades. there is no visible nioi guchi and the gunome is too regular. Not a traditionally made blade imo regards Paul

Dear Rob, The timing of another NTHK Shinsa in the Uk has not been discussed. Typically it seems to take 3 to 4 years to build up sufficient numbers of blades to go to shinsa. I would therefore not expect another session until after 2011. However if there is sufficient interest I am sure we can persuade the team to visit us again a little sooner. Best Regards Paul

Thank you Carlo,

All, I contacted Jim Dawason and he kindly responded. He believes this to be a custom made koshirae and mentions there are several similar examples in chapter 29 of his book. If anyone has a copy and could send me copies of these images it would be much appreciated. thanks to all who have expressed an opinion they have been very helpful regards Paul

Hi Does anyone have an email Address for John Scott Slough? If so could they pm me. Thank you Paul b

All, I am hoping someone might cast some light on the sword described below. If I have posted it in the wrong place I trust one of the moderators will relocate it. The sword in question is an unsigned blade but has been papered to the same smith by both NBTHK and NTHK, namely: NBTHK Hozon paper attributing it to Taira Takada NTHK paper attributing it to Taira Takada NAGAMORI (1532 ish, Jo Saku) What is unusual about it is the Koshirae which although close to a number listed in Fuller and Gregory does not seem to match any. As this is an area I have absolutely no knowledge of I am hoping one of the Gendaito/ Showa-To enthusiasts might recongnise it. The tsuba appears to be made of bronze (possibly shakudo). The mekugi is wrapped in thick gold foil. The other metal fittings are nickel (perhaps shibuichi). The same is good quality. The wooden saya is wrapped in black leather. Does anyone have any idea what manner of official this may have been for?

Hi Patrick, There has been no date fixed for the next London Shinsa. The recent one came 5 years after the first so I would expect the next to be between 3 and 5 years away. If you wish details about joining the NTHK please email me you contact details and I will forward them to Graham Curtis who is a trustee of the NTHK. Regards Paul Bowman

Dan, you are right it is hard to tell from photos and you really need to show it to a polisher. First impression is that the form looks fairly sound with no obvious chips cracks or deep pitting. The red rust is likely to be still active and doing harm to the remainder of the blade so needs to be neutralised (others can tell you better than me how to do that) Althougth it looks pretty rough I have seen worse cases come up well. It is worth showing to someone who knows what they are doing to get a better assesment. regards Paul

Thanks Brian on my way to look it up regards Paul

Hi Brian it was Fuller and Gregory "military swords of Japan" I was thinking of p77. I knew I'd seen it somewhere but couldnt remember where. Give me another 10 years and I wont remember where the bookcase is either!! cheers

Its Ok I found what I was looking for thanks anyway Regards Paul