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Steve Waszak

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Greetings, men...

 

Having acquired some rather fine iron tsuba over the last few years, the question of the proper care of tsuba has become more pressing. Specifically, the issue of rust arises. Most of us are aware of Jim Gilbert's site on tsuba, which contains advice on the care and cleaning of tsuba. The advice is clear and detailed, and is to be greatly appreciated for these qualities. However, if one reads the advice on this subject offered by Sasano, Kremers, Sean Sweeney of the NCJSC, and others, the details in the language there would have it that the elimination of all red rust on a tsuba is essential; the advice even goes so far as to suggest that picking away at the red rust in the ana and sukashi elements is acceptable, if the rust is pronounced enough.

 

Reading such advice after having read Jim's presents one with something of a dilemma, as his words make it clear that the cardinal rule is not to overdo it. Describing below the part of the process of cleaning where one has successfully removed the most egregious of the red rust on the plate and rim of the tsuba, he then states the following:

 

"If you think you've got the rust under control, take your tsuba out in the sunlight and have another look. Most artificial lighting hides red rust somewhat, but sunlight will reveal all. You will probably find that there is still more rust there, but don’t get carried away with trying to remove every trace. Don't over do your cleaning. The idea is not to make a 500-year-old tsuba look new. Older tsuba can have quite a lot of oxide build up that is best left alone. The idea is to remove any active corrosion and restore the beauty of the surface, not to fundamentally alter it. An over cleaned tsuba is always worse than an under cleaned one."

 

Remember, the words of Sasano, Kremers, Sweeney, et al have it that removing all traces of red rust is vital.

 

So, now what?

 

I think the matter is confused, perhaps, by the lack of full clarity I have of what, exactly, constitutes "red rust." One question I have is this: does ANY rust-COLORED tinge on a tsuba constitute ACTIVE red rust? I see many tsuba with bright orange, crusty rust spots, and these, to me, do seem to be evidence of rust activity. But what about those tsuba whose "red rust" is describing only thin hints of washed-out maroon or coral colors, areas on the guard where the "rust" is only suggested, looking more like a remnant of rust or like some sort of rust "residue" than actual, active red rust? Or those spots we often see on tsuba that appear more like rust in "arrested development," dark, reddish/rusty-brown? Is this the sort of "red rust" that Sasano and his team would see as requiring removal? Personally, I am much less bothered by the presence of red rust on a guard if I know it is not active, so I ask again: does ANY rust-COLORED tinge on a tsuba constitute ACTIVE red rust?

 

One final thought here. I have gone through my library, attempting to find examples of iconic, superstar-type iron tsuba, to see whether they present with any traces of red rust. After all, as Sasano and Kremers would have it, to allow these icons from Japan's past to suffer the neglect that the continuous presence of red rust would constitute is tantamount to a cultural crime of high order. And yet, I can find Kaneie, Nobuiye, Myoju, Jingo, and others whose tsuba exhibit red rust ranging from the merest echo of rusty coloring to fairly pronounced patches of reddish-orange/brown. In some cases, this manifests only in the various interstices on the guard's plate (due to tsuchime, bori, etc...), but in others, nearly the whole of the plate is covered in this "film" of rusty breath. If one wants to see the degree to which this exists in these tsuba, try amplifying the color-saturation mode on your computers as you're viewing the images.

 

Sorry to have gone on so long. But I find it frustrating that this subject does not appear to have been dealt with as fully as it should be. Too many ill-defined terms and meanings, too many pieces of contradictory advice from very experienced, knowledgeable scholars and collectors. As I get more deeply involved with the holding of these pieces for a time, I want to know more definitely how to deal with the matter of "red rust."

 

Below, please find examples of great, iconic tsuba, each of which exhibit clear red rust. Please note that I have amplified the color saturation in each image to show more clearly the presence of this red rust.

 

Cheers,

 

Steve

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Hi Steve,

When I think of active red rust I think of something building up from the surface of the tsuba. In the 3 examples you present I see nothing of concern. At most, I see a red tinge that is likely just the color amplification you mention. In deed, I often find when I photograph iron tsuba, that they appear redder in the pictures than in life.

When I clean an iron tsuba I try to remove anything on the tsuba that appears built up, obviously red, and/or crumbly and easily removed. Once I'm down to the original surface I can figure that the tsuba is stable and that the patina will take care of itself. This is oversimplification, I know, but not far off what usually happens.

Grey

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The Kaneiye Daruma tsuba has no red rust in other post year 2000 photography of it sent to me a few years ago.

I doubt it did prior and suspect you are dealing more with photo quality in the three examples provided.

 

Some felt Sasano overdid the cleaning on his tsuba. Not to the point of damage, but rather that they were just pristine and polished / brushed to a point at the edge of what others liked. I passed on one a few years ago after seeing it in hand and thinking it had been polished too porcelain clean for my liking. It is probably one of only 3 or 4 that I sincerely regret passing on in the last decade. My deep regrets to the former owner, who is on this list.

 

Overcleaning is another issue. Do enough low level tsuba as hobby or learning experience and you will eventually decide/learn when you have gone too far. Definitely teaches you about a feel for iron. My 'too far' was an edo Tosho tsuba that I overdid a bit and spent the next few years trying to get the chemistry of patina to start naturally healing in. Feel a bit of guilt on that tsuba that it was a good one (not a great one) in that I took it from where it was to a healthy point, and then past that too much. With the exception of one extreme rescue tsuba that needed removal of considerable rust, I've never done it since.

 

As for doing it within the sukashi. That is a harder lesson. But I agree. If you don't intervene on those with it in the sukashi... what you get is the Boston Museum collection.....

Go and look at the iron ones in person some day. It saddened me to finally get to Boston. couldn't arrange a meet with Mr. Earle, so went with a college friend to the museum. A fair number of the beautiful tsuba are rusted through in the walls of the sukashi, though you wouldn't know from looking top down on the tsuba. Like a nice house where you lift up the siding and find the supports eatten through by termites.

 

I regret to end it on that visual image. caring and cleaning for tsuba goes well beyond Jim Gilbert's article and there are 1 or 2 individuals who have accumulated decades of knowledge in it. But the ones I know don't "do the internet thing"...

 

Curran

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Some felt Sasano overdid the cleaning on his tsuba. Not to the point of damage, but rather that they were just pristine and polished / brushed to a point at the edge of what others liked.

 

If you compare someTsuba from Sasanos first edition of Sukashi Tsuba ("Early Japanese Sword Guards") to the 1994 edition you can clearly see that some Ji-Sukashi Tsuba were overcleaned and their Patina almost completely polished off.

I heard, that Sasano (or his relatives) let some obviously inexperienced people take care of the Tsubas when he was ill. Some of those people have exaggerated the "care" and used abrasive materials to polish the pieces.

 

Cheers,

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Grey, Curran, Martin...

 

Many thanks for your thoughts on this topic. It's very useful for me to hear about your experiences and viewpoints. I encourage others to share theirs as well, as getting a fuller dialogue on this subject is important, I think. Grey, I especially appreciate your words on what constitutes worrisome (i.e. ACTIVE) red rust... Very helpful. :) And Curran, your recounting of what you saw at the Boston Museum was a bit harrowing, but what you say here is exactly why this topic is warranted. After all, the wisdom out there in many circles is to NEVER touch the rust in the sukashi and ana walls... I would love to hear what those who subscribe to this last dictum think about what Curran describes here. Just to be clear: I am NOT looking to start any sort of feud of viewpoints; I just really want to understand in depth what the opinions are, and why they're held by those who espouse them. Thanks again, guys... :)

 

Cheers,

 

Steve

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To be clear, I would never clean inside the sukashi as you would the rest of the tsuba.

 

I do not believe the "never touch the inside of the sukashi". I do believe that *most people* should not. I think someone teaching communicated the idea that most people should not until they are comfortable with it such that they do no harm. Somewhere along the line it got simplified to "never touch the inside of the sukashi".

 

As is, I am loathe to go inside the sukashi with anything other than a natural horse hair brush. Amazing what it can do and that which it might remove probably shouldn't be built up so loosely there. I can only think of one tsuba in the past decade where I made the judgement call to use a special thin tool fashioned from deer horn to go in to work areas inside the sukashi. I still have that tsuba and intend to keep it until I croak, so won't worry about disclosure until I am dead.

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Interesting topic....... We border here on a subject touched upon before, inasmuch as cleaning a tsuba of the efflourescent rust may impinge upon what the tsubako intended when first he made the tsuba , knowing that it would at some point begin to rust. What did he envisage the evolution of the patina to be?

We cannot know of course. What we can assume however is that iron of any type will rust. We also know that what we refer to as patina on an iron tsuba, is often stabilised oxidation, sometimes enhanced or induced, sometimes perfectly natural.

Where does patina end and common or garden rust begin? For that matter, where does rust end and patina begin?

The old addage of 'better to underclean than overclean' has much to recommend it in the light of a lack of certainty as to what amount of rust (which will become patina) is acceptable, given the age and style of a given piece. Also, the question arises as to what part of the overall aesthetic is served by the presence or absence of oxidation, and what part of a natural evolution of that easthetic is served by its presence. Also what degree of oxidation in its various stages serves to enhance or mar the piece in question?

As recommended by others, I tend to believe that the removal of proud red active rust is a part of the maintenance of an iron tsuba. Where I falter is how far beyond that obvious canker of rust must we go in the cleaning process before we begin to destroy what was intended to be there? Its' not a call I would care to make on a masters' work.

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Here's an example of what I consider a fairly straight forward clean up.

 

Here's a link to the large image

 

I removed the surface rust residue, neutralised the surface and touched in the patina where the corrosion damage demanded it and re-waxed. I can't be 100% certain the final result is as the maker intended but I feel reasonably confidant it now looks far more like it would have done when initially used than it did before my intervention.

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Ford,

 

Looks like a tough job for the folksy way I work on the the occasional tsuba. The moat around that tsuba would have taken me forever, and I confess to once giving up on a basketweave Bushu tsuba with a spray of rust on it.

 

Keith- Ford or someone like Boris (Denizens of Vahalla, Boris is less frequent) will be quicker on the inorganic chemistry lesson. Cliff notes version: Magnetite is good. Rust is bad.

Now go learn how to make magnetite

:laughabove:

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Ford,

 

Thanks for that example of before and after. Now, did you remove that rust by simple ivorying? And could you elaborate on what you mean by "neutralising"? Finally, a word or two on how one goes about "touching in" the patina would be very interesting to hear (if that's not a trade secret, that is... ;o).

 

Keith, many of your questions here echo my own. Your observation that tsubako of old knew, of course, that their guards would rust to some degree is a good one to keep in mind. My question, as a follow-up to yours here, would be how the Japanese dealt with/cared for these iron guards over the course of centuries. Did they clean them? How? How often? To what degree? How was it known to what degree they "ought" to be cleaned? I mean, some of the tsuba we have are a good 400-500 years old (or more). Without care, they'd have rusted to dust long before now. So clearly, they received some attention. But what kind? How often? :o)

 

Cheers,

 

Steve

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Curran

 

I do not accept that patina is magnetite and nothing else. Nor that it is the only acceptable Patination of the raw material. Rust is in some cases a deliberately induced and then fixed oxidation is therefore an acceptable patina. An over simplification of the definition of patina such as yours, ignores the presence of alternatives to Magnetite or magnetic oxide.

 

Steve.

 

My train of thought was leading (Before it went into a tunnel at 3AM when I wrote the post), toward a suggestion of the possibility of a lack of information, misinformation or misinterpretation of the information available as to what exactly constitutes patina. I am sure there are various views on this, but also there is the facts which I am certain are not universally understood or agreed upon. If this is the case, then surely we must first define what is meant to be present as patina upon a tsuba and is therefore acceptable, and what is not. (I for one, would appreciate a clear definition of patina). Red rust being an obvious example of what is not meant to be there of course, but also plain old grime and acidic deterioration of any steel or iron surface over a long period of time can produce some strange and variable surface effects.

This knowledge is then in tandem with what to clean off and how much of it to clean off a tsuba in order to bring it back to a semblance of its original appearance.

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Hi Keith,

 

Yes, good questions. Very good. Another term that may need defining is "iron" or "steel." What I mean here is that, discussing rust and patina and how these affect our iron/steel guards without considering that the various composition of the metal we're referring to might react differently to oxidation, may be only marginally beneficial. Things start to get a bit wobbly conceptually when we really settle into defining our terms, especially when we throw in the destabilizing factor of varying opinions on how these metal works "should" look, and even more so when we consider how they "should" look NOW, versus at some point in the past. Of course, the "proper" appearance of a tsuba, on the one hand, and the best state in which to conserve/preserve it, on the other, may not be the same thing, at least not to all of us. Whose judgement, then, decides?

 

All of the above have direct bearing on how we approach the question of how to tend to and care for our temporarily-held possessions. This is what prompted my question here on the forum in the first place: it is frustrating to have the best intentions and desire to care for tsuba in the most conscientious way possible, to have the willingness to devote time and resources toward that end, and to then be stymied due to a garden of divergent opinions on the matter. The trouble for me is that I find several of these opinions to be persuasive, including some that directly contradict one another! I am left wanting simply to leave well enough alone, and do nothing. Except that, according to some, such "negligence" is perhaps the worst thing I could be (not) doing, either for the aesthetics of the guard, or for its proper preservation, or both. I thus can't win for leaving things be, nor for taking up my ivory and choji oil (and/or wax) and scrubbing away every whisper of red rust...

 

It would seem that the conservative Japanese perspective is to allow some red rust to remain. Based on what I've seen from the condition of a number of ultra-great, iconic tsuba (including the Kaneie Nara deer tsuba at the Hosokawa exhibit at the Asian Art Museum in San Francisco last summer, which is virtually frosted in light red rust), the more conservative Japanese element in whose care these tsuba are entrusted see little/no harm in letting a bit of red rust stay on the surface of these pieces. They may even argue that the aesthetics of the tsuba are enhanced thereby. Perhaps they're right, I don't know for sure... But given some of the opinions I've heard on the harrowing dangers presented by red rust on iron tsuba, that conservative Japanese viewpoint is a little hard to embrace...

 

Sorry to ramble here... Just thinking out loud a bit... :)

 

Cheers,

 

Steve

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For the sake of discussion, and possibly at the risk of public outcry, the following is a method I use to preserve one of my tsuba. The piece in question is an iron tachi tsuba dating back to the mid Momoyama (or thereabouts) period. It is entirely plain, of aoigata shape and has an almost velvet finish to the steel (or iron depending on your definition). It came into my possession some ten years ago and is one of my favourites.

When I initially obtained it there was a fine dusting of red rust on the surface. I removed what I could with a soft, old, tatty toothbrush. The surface was unpitted so I simply wiped it with choji oil on a soft cloth until there was no more red rust discolouring the cloth. Since then, I repeat the wipe with choji oil perhaps once a year after cleaning down with denatured alcohol. The finish is still excellent and the rich dark brown colour of the steel remains. it has not rusted again since doing this, and only the faintest of red is found on the cloth after wiping it down each time.

 

Am I doing anything wrong? If so, what and why?

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Keith,

 

if you're getting traces of rust on the cloth a year later then clearly some further corrosion has taken place, however sleight. Choji oil is also not recommended ( nor any mineral oil really) for use on ferrous patina as it can break down that part of the patina that is stable and protective.

 

Gents,

 

for the purposes of this discussion regarding patina and rust I think it safe to consider iron and steel pretty much the same thing. Carbon ( in such minimal %) doesn't really feature in either the artificial patina formation nor in any significant way in terms of corrosion.

 

I'm reluctant to go into any detail regarding the processes I use professionally as, 1: this is part of my livelihood ( if you could call it that :roll: ) and 2: I fear that used inexpertly some serious abuse could result....mainly to the objects but possible directed at me subsequently ;)

 

The science that describes corrosion of ferrous metals is quiet complex but I am working on a fairly comprehensive paper to try and present as complete a picture of the problem and possible remedial approaches as is practical.

 

The larger discussion about art restoration/conservation is a very thorny one and one which is very well described in James Beck's excellent book,"Art Restoration"

 

regards,

 

ford

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Ford.

 

I confess I was under the impression that choji oil (at least the type I use), is actually composed of camellia oil and a very small amount of clove oil, both of which are vegetable oils. Be that as it may, would wax be a better preservative for the existing patination?

 

Sorry to go a little off topic here Steve, but I dont think we need to wait with baited breath for Ford to publish a paper, in order to determine what patina is and what it consists of. Surely there are other equally reputable, perhaps even more reputable sources. Anybody?

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Ford

 

Sadly, I have read none of Sasano's books. An oversight I shall now address, when I can take time out from the difficulties of making a living in the ruined global economy within which I am obliged to operate. My only excuse is that I am usually not a tsuba type dude, but more a blade man. Mia Culpa. :cry: Unfortunately, one cannot be all things to all men, but I am trying.

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Ford

A good start I would say. :lol: But I fear we stray from Steve's excellent topic.

 

In an effort to return to the business at hand, what were the methods used in times past to preserve tsuba? Are there in fact any records to indicate that efforts were made to maintain tsuba and the other mounts of a sword?

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Keith,

 

Yes, the question of how tsuba were cared for and preserved in earlier times is intriguing, isn't it? :o) Did the owners of these pieces then ivory them? Apply camelia oil liberally? Sparingly? Ever? Did the never-clean-the-walls-of-sukashi-and-ana rule apply then? I know pieces were lacquered sometimes, but was any other coating applied? I imagine there may not be a lot of existing literature on this subject extant, even in Japanese, but who knows? Maybe there is an old pamphlet kicking around filled with such secrets... ;o)

 

Ford, I see you referenced Sasano and his recommendations for tending to iron tsuba, but I understand that he was known for "over-cleaning" his iron tsuba, in some cases nearly taking the patina off the piece. I don't know if this is accurate, but I have heard this on more than one occasion, and the tone used in recounting the stories was rather reproving... Given that he also recommends eliminating all red rust on a tsuba, I just wonder if some might not view his approach as a bit on the over-zealous side.

 

Cheers,

 

Steve

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A little perspective cant hurt at this point. :D Today, we tend to view all genuine examples of tsuba as worthy of attention, but I feel it was not always so. The practices of ivorying and wiping with choji oil are I think fairly recent developments, having come about by the need and perception of these artifacts as works of art. This is only my opinion, but in the past, iron sword mounts including tsuba were considered as disposable utilitarian items. In the practical world of the samurai who faced conflict on an almost daily basis, the preservation of utility items would I feel have been a secondary at best consideration. Sword mounts, tosogu of all types were frequently damaged and easily replaced. This is in the early days of course.

A factor in the rarity of early tsuba may well be that they were discarded and replaced frequently.

Given that early tsuba were, like it or not, in use and subjected to not only damage but also to being fouled by the blood and body fluids of the sword's victim's, they obviously needed on occasion to be cleaned. This would have been most easily achieved by washing and wiping the tsuba when it had been removed from the blade. That cleaning itself would have facilitated rusting had the tsuba not then have been treated with wax or oil in order to protect it.

In the later historical periods, as the mounts and specifically the tsuba became more decorative and therefore more expensive, then the question of care and maintenance would have been of more importance. At the very last in the decadence of the Edo period, tsuba were produced as art items and presentation pieces, many of them never to be mounted on a sword. This I think is where the practices of maintenance and restoration/preservation that we use today sprang from.

 

None of this is to say that there were no efforts made in the early days to preserve a specially favored tsuba. Merely that those efforts were not commonplace as they are among collectors of today. Todays practices may however have their roots in the practices of the past. I allude here to the practice of waxing a tsuba., which in earlier times may simply have been a precaution against rusting when the sword was in use during adverse weather.

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Hi Steve,

 

I think Sasano was, generally speaking, pretty accurate regarding the issue of rust and it's treatment. I can't say if he did over clean or not, the examples in his books all look pretty good to me. But if, after eliminating anhydrous red rust you have a more bare metal one could surmise that the original patina was already gone. It's absence was merely concealed by surface rust.

 

He doesn't appear to address kinko work though. Much of this type of guard does, despite the work kin-ko's meaning (ie; gold worker/soft metal worker) use iron as a base. Typically, these kinko works, often with soft metal inlay etc, have a very different patina. This type of patina may be described as being a russet finish. This is more obviously a brown rust finish. They are reasonably well neutralised but under certain conditions this rust can easily reactivate and cause significant surface damage.

 

With regard to how tsuba were treated in the past we can only speculate but I think it fair to suggest that guards in daily use would almost certainly required constant maintenance. To not deal with any rust would have meant, at the very least, getting unsightly rust stains on one's clothing :D For most of the more utilitarian guards on the uchigatana carried by ashigaru the finish seems to have been a fairly standard black urushi. This effectively dealt with the issue of rusting while on campaign I imagine. More elevated warriors would perhaps have had the luxury of retainers to care for their equipment and thus could perhaps indulge their penchant for fine iron patina.

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Keith, Steve, Ford, In the Shinto Shrine at Chuzenji there are several O-dachi donated at various periods that retain their original koshirae. These are of iron coated with black lacquer. None show any trace at decoration being very simply made from sheet metal. Apart from the fact that the Shrine carved the date of the donations on the blades, would you believe, these appear in original condition.

Ian Bottomley

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Hi Keith,

 

You make some very good points here about the way we approach these guards now versus how they were seen/used hundreds of years ago. Yet, I would think that the signed iron pieces produced by the men who are now regarded as "the greats" in the iron tsuba world would have been seen, even at the time they were made, as worth of special attention and care (the fact that they were signed works at a time when tsuba weren't signed suggests this, I think). Since we're talking about tsuba made of iron, and which are some 400 years old and then some, these guards must have received some pretty effective care in their time (and subsequently) simply to have made it into our world today.

 

Given Sasano's words on oil (and wax, I believe), I can't help but wonder if the Japanese way back when similarly would have eschewed oil on these important iron tsuba, in favor of something else. I can't recall ever seeing any remnants of black lacquer on Nobuiye, Kaneie, Yamakichibei, Hoan, or Myoju pieces, however, so the black lacquer that may first come to mind as the protectant used in earlier times doesn't appear to have been the case in such tsuba. Sasano speaks emphatically on the wisdom of removing all red rust in allowing the protective "black rust" to take hold and develop. This black rust, he says, will protect the guard from the development of red rust. He indicates fairly strongly that, with such a protective "shield" in place, oils and waxes are to be avoided, as they may work to foster red rust development. A good black-rust patina, then, combined with the occasional gentle rubbing/"polishing" with a soft cotton cloth, would be all that is needed to care for tsuba, he suggests, once all of the red rust has been removed. So I suppose the question I would have, then, is whether this really would be enough to keep red rust at bay. If it is enough, why all the history of waxes and oils in the "protection" of tsuba? There is definitely a strong divergence of viewpoints here...

 

Ian, thanks for that fascinating bit about the pieces in the Shinto Shrine at Chuzenji. Do you have any sense of what might account for the state of preservation of these pieces?

 

Thanks, guys, for all your thoughtful consideration on this topic... ;o)

 

Cheers,

 

Steve

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Steve, I should have said that the items date, if memory serves, from the Nambokucho and Muromachi periods. At leat two are NTs and there is in the shrine what I understood to be the biggest blade in Japan. Why they have been preserved so intact I do not know - after all the Shrine is on the edge of the lake and presumably the air is rather damp. Perhaps that is why they were kept in their saya.

Ian

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Pete,

 

Yes, thank you for this illustration... :o) See, for me, this raises question about how reliable Sasano's opinions on tsuba care and maintenance are. I realize the example you provide for us here is a rather extreme one, but nevertheless, it does beg the question: if not this degree of "cleaning," what degree is ideal or "proper." Of course, with this example, we see (I think) Sasano going well beyond his own advice in his earlier book on sukashi tsuba: this piece is evidence of much more than removing red rust and then simply wiping the guard down from time to time to allow the black rust to take hold and develop. Was Sasano just over-zealous, then?

 

Thanks again Pete for the photos... :o)

 

Cheers,

 

Steve

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Steve,

 

Not pro or con on the Sasano advice. Please don't forget Peter's perfect example in the context that it was questioned who cared for his tsuba later- before the second book was produced.

 

Peter,

 

Interesting example. The Sasano Hirata I passed on purchasing had this same sort of micro dotting that can be seen on the c.1994 tsuba you posted. Not on the earlier one. Strange and wonder what did this.

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How Tsuba were preserved in remote times , is of course very frustrating when we have no references. Whilst we have been having this discussion I have been attempting to find something/anything that may give us a clue. To date no success I am afraid. I fear only Japanese sources would furnish such an indication.

I recall some time ago having access to a book of sword related illustrations of the 16th century. Among those illustrations which were an assemblage from a number of sources, there was one of a male figure seated, surrounded by the dissassembled parts of a sword. In the man's hand was a circular object which he was apparently rubbing with a small bag similar to an uchiko. I did not keep a copy of this illustration unfortunately, because it was not at the time pertinent to the information I was seeking from the illustrations. Perhaps, and this can only be conjecture, this depicted the application of wax to the tsuba? This is not evidence of course and I do not offer it as such, but merely as something of interest in this present discussion.

The signed tsuba to which Steve alludes, I venture were possibly those made for the more affluent samurai. Such masters work was expensive even during the days of the masters activity. That alone would put them beyond the pockets of most samurai. It is of interest however, that these tsuba were left in a natural state rather than being black lacquered as were most prior to the end of the Momoyama period. It suggests that there was a level of appreciation of such things and that they were considered worthy of preservation, even from being 'new'.

This is now become a circular argument in which I have arrived at the original question of how that preservation was effected.

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