For the Yamashiro fans: Enju, Awataguchi, neither?

[Sukaira]

Hello all - making my first post here after lurking and learning from the forum for a while. Recently started a collection and thought this would make a nice first entry for Yamashiro fans to pick apart. Nashiji-hada, Enju-hada, none of the above? I am early in my learning and would like hear from seasoned researchers on what they think of this and how to identify what exactly the different important aspects of this are. The 2.93mb limit took a bit of resolution away unfortunately. Thanks

[ROKUJURO]

....and the white background reduces the contrast! Better use a dark, non-reflective one. Otherwise, nice blade! 

[Sukaira]

Good idea, will try that next time

[Ray Singer]

The blade is in a new polish but it is not papered? What did the seller tell you? There's a limit to what we can say from a single detail photo like this, however honestly my guess would have been a Shinto Hizen-to. It may be helpful if you could tell us what you know about the sword and how was procured.

[Rivkin]

Not the top but average Hizen or imitation. Yokoyama Bizen actually made good Hizen looking swords.

[Ray Singer]

As an example of Yamashiro-den, this is one of the Shintogo Kunimitsu I own. Although he was called the founder of Soshu-den, Shintogo was said to have roots in the Awataguchi.

[Sukaira]

That's awesome Ray. A great example! I am really looking to read the mental approaches and reasonings more seasoned researchers use when looking at a blade, not knowing its source. For example, saying "Not the top but average Hizen or imitation", I am interested in the elaboration of that conclusion, and learning what makes it seem that way in the steel. To be honest, even though I have quite a few books, I have been bit frustrated using old black and white photos or worse, hand drawn renderings of hataraki that to me at least, are mercurial in their ability to accurately convey steel. I am spoiled by technology I guess but where are the high resolution examples . This forum has been the most helpful.

That being said, this blade is mumei, O-suriage papered at Tokubetsu Hozon to a Yamashiro-den school...but I am more interested in learning how to think and identify steel workings from those more experienced than myself.

[Ray Singer]

As far as your question about Awataguchi and nashiji-hada, they are several levels tighter and more compact than the sword that you photographed above. There will be a dense layer of bright ji-nie floating on the surface, and you will see small and fine chikei woven into the jihada (which also shows in the Shintogo photos above).

[Sukaira]

The bright ji-nie I think I definitely can grasp looking at your Shintogo, the small and fine chikei woven into the jihada...would you be able to pin point in your photo where exactly I would be seeing that? This is one of those things I mentioned that is thrown around and drawn in books but I am still not sure if I know what I am looking at

[Jacques]

It's not just the hada that characterizes a smith or a school. Having said that, without having the blade in hand, I can't say anything - the photos don't show much.

[Sukaira]

So true

[Rivkin]

Boshi would reveal much. As is better picture of nioiguchi. Can be Mihara, but much more likely its Echizen Rai or someone related to it - from Rai Kunizane to Rai Kuniyasu.

[Sukaira]

Photographing Nihonto is a skill in itself isn't it ...I will try to get some more complete images, as there is a bit of mystery around this blade that I hope to try and unravel with some help from those more knowledgeable than myself.

[Ray Singer]

2 hours ago, Sukaira said:

The bright ji-nie I think I definitely can grasp looking at your Shintogo, the small and fine chikei woven into the jihada...would you be able to pin point in your photo where exactly I would be seeing that? This is one of those things I mentioned that is thrown around and drawn in books but I am still not sure if I know what I am looking at

I have to rely on the photos that I already have on my mobile device at the moment, but please see attached. You will see a number of short, dark strands of connected nie within the jihada. 

[SteveM]

3 hours ago, Sukaira said:

I have been bit frustrated using old black and white photos or worse, hand drawn renderings of hataraki

 

I think this is true for all of us. The quality of the images in the foundational texts leaves much to be desired 

[Sukaira]

@Rivkin It is very interesting you would mention both Bizen and Rai...reason being I have read that in Suiken Fukunaga's Japanese Sword Encyclopedia, there is an entry about Awataguchi Yoshimasa (student of Yoshimitsu) that basically says this (I have not translated this myself, so maybe others here can confirm this does indeed exist)

1. The boshi is very similar to the Rai. 
2. The texture is Awataguchi style
3. Utsu is similar to the Higo Enju-ha
4. The sword figure can be mistaken for Morimitsu or Yasumitsu of Oei Bizen

 

Of course I have not posted the entire length of the blade to show the shape, but the sugata is definitely Koto.

Edited June 10 by Sukaira
misspelling

[Sukaira]

@Ray Singer I think that does help a bit, would these mainly be the wave/hook looking connections in the middle to upper right side of the image?

[Ray Singer]

These are the small dark strands that appear on both sides of the glare, on the left and right. Keep in mind that this is a fairly narrow mihaba, so we were talking about a very small and fine features that measure around 2 to 3 mm each.

[Sukaira]

I seeee, ok thanks!

[Ray Singer]

2 hours ago, Sukaira said:

I have not posted the entire length of the blade to show the shape, but the sugata is definitely Koto.

This would be a good time to show the papers so that we can see specifically how your sword was attributed.

[Sukaira]

Incoming

[Sukaira]

I wanted to upload these to give everyone another shot before the paper reveal  - pictures split into two posts

[Sukaira]

And second

[Sukaira]

It should be pretty obvious but the blade in question is the one on the right with the shorter nakago. It is hard to tell from the pictures, but it has much more curvature than the one on the left with the gold Koson inlay. It also seems to be O-Maru (to me) vs the Ko-Maru of the left. As you can see, the skin stands out starkly against the left as well.

[lonely panet]

Could be the angle but the boshi looks hakikkake to me

[Sukaira]

Also possible

[lonely panet]

Hakikakke  ko maru with suguha makes me think shikakke school.

 But you said its yamashiro noy yamoto.

 

So no clue

[CSM101]

Awataguchi Yoshimitsu

 

 

[Sukaira]

So clean

[Sukaira]

@Ray Singer sorry for the delay. For the reveal (and the reason I placed the other blade alongside this one):

They are both Tokubetsu Hozon: Enju

Left blade with Koson kinpun mei is Enju Kunisuke, with the Mei reading Hishu (Higo) Kunisuke. Given time by NBTHK is Shohei era.

Right blade (original topic image) is simply Enju, but this one around 1326-ish.

 

Now the mystery thickens, because Enju in question comes with a sayagaki from Suiken Fukunaga, dated 1990. The blade however was given TH by NBTHK in 1998 according to the origami. Fukunaga's sayagaki attributes this sword to Awataguchi Yoshimasa (Kagenaga 1st, student of Awataguchi Yoshimitsu), and gives a timeframe of Shoo era (around 1288).

 

It's interesting to look at the evidence here for both cases, because like I posted above, Fukunaga has a section on Yoshimasa in one of his books, showing the mixture of styles the smith used, with traits from Rai, Awataguchi and Enju coming into play.

 

Furthermore, the blade has 3 horimono (goma hashi and Fudo myo bonji on one side, and suken on the other), and in the The Connoisseur's Book of Japanese Swords, if you look under the sections for "Attributing based on Horimono" you'll see Enju is not listed in the section for Goma Hashi, but Awataguchi is. However it is easy enough to find an example of an important Enju Kunisuke tanto with goma hashi. Additionally, the suken section does not list Awatguchi, but lists not Enju as a whole but Enju Kunisuke singularly. Finally, the Bonji section lists neither Enju nor Awataguchi. That being said, these are generalizations, but its interesting to note.

 

Under the attribution by Boshi section: Awataguchi and Enju listed under both Ko-maru and O-maru, but in Hakikake (need some opinion on the Boshi of the blade posted above in the images) only Awataguchi is listed. Again, I'm sure these are generalizations.

 

All of this being said, I can say in person, I have held (and own) several Enju blades and the steel of this sword in question is both "wetter" looking and clearer in some subtle way. For reference, the only real Enju blade I can find with a similar strikingly visible skin with the same small swirls is this one by Kunitoki: https://world-seiyudo.com/product/ka-030425/

Anyway, food for thought :).