Bought a Japanese Type 94 or 98 mount & Katana- Help! I'm a newbie. Pic links in message

[waljamada]

So I purchased a Japanese WW2 Type 94 or 98 mount? sword for $800.00 and I really know nothing about these things.  I knew that I wanted one and this one seemed very authentic.  It was purchased from a War Relics Antique Store and the store owner had just acquired an entire collection from someone who had recently passed.  Basically I am looking for a few things.  1)Confirm the sword is indeed authentic 2) Learn how to address some issues/damage that is on the blade such as pitting and some rust (see photographs).  3) If it is real identify a basic range of age for the blade (is it like 85 years old...100ish?)

 

Basically, did I do good with this purchase or did I get hosed?  Also thanks in advance for any responses.

 

In terms of care for it I have already purchased a sword cleaning kit, Choji oil made by the Asian Art Institute, Renaissance Metal De-Corroder Rust Removal, Reinaissance Pre-Lim and Renaissance Wax.  Basically buying a bunch of stuff to cover all bases before decididing what to do.  Any advice would be greatly appreciated

 

Here are links to all the photos I have taken of it to help me in this quest:

 

https://ibb.co/album/fUD6BF

 

https://ibb.co/album/kkR7ka

 

https://ibb.co/album/cCpSka

 

All the Best.

[16k]

Real deal!

 

Type 98 with older blade but need better pics to say more.

 

I think you scored a deal.

 

As for taking care of the blade: DON’T DO ANYTHING !

 

Especially don’t remove the rust and leave the nakago (tang) as is!

 

About Care and Maintenance, please read this!

 

http://www.nihontomessageboard.com/faq.html

[waljamada]

Anything specific I can take photos of to help?  Amongst those three links theres probably 40 or so photos.  I tried to document every bit of the sword to get the most help.  Is it really the best idea to do nothing even with active red rust on the blade?  Seems counter intuitive to me.  I will leave the tang alone, but the tip area has active red rest.....I ask because I truly don't know.  Doing nothing seems wrong as there has to be a gentle museum approved way to address it rather than just oil to sustain current form.

 

So $800 was a fair price for the sword?  Even if not I would still love it for my lifetime.

[16k]

For the rust near the tip, if it is active wipe with oil. It should come off even though staining remains. Then put some choji oil on the blade with a soft paper but be careful not to put too much. It might be wise to wipe it slightly just after to avoid pulling.

 

The tang need to remain as is. You can wipe it to with oil to remove active rust but don’t overdo it as the condition of the tang is used to date the blade. A tang whose patina has been removed looses 50% of its value.

 

For the picture, put the blade on cushions on the floor, jump on a chair a take a picture of the whole naked blade, without perspective or Habaki (collar). The shape of the blade helps dating it too.

 

And care for your blade as you have a genuine Nihonto!

[waljamada]

have this overhead shot of the sword in the links.

 

https://ibb.co/02VHstG

[16k]

One more thing, your Tsuba (guard) is an early one. Good blades are often found with these, so you definitely scored a deal.

[16k]

have this overhead shot of the sword in the links.

 

https://ibb.co/02VHstG

Won’t do because we need to see the curvature in relation to the tang. Wild guess? Looks Kanbun Shinto (second half of the 17th century) but hard to tell for sure in those conditions.

[Grey Doffin]

Hi, name please,

Don't do anything to try to fix anything; you know just enough to get yourself in trouble.  Any rust can stay where it is until someone with experience can have a look and give advice (a bit of light machine oil on the rust at the tip won't hurt but leave the tang alone for now).  I'm in Duluth, MN; if you live close in Wisconsin you'd be welcome to stop by.

Grey

[waljamada]

Grey,

 

My names Adam.  I just googled Duluth and I'm located in SE WI (Lake Geneva) so about a 6 hour drive from you.  Whenever I find myself that way I will actually reach out to you to see if we could meet.  I want to do right by this sword but I won't be able to do the traditional $100 per inch full on style of repair.  The blade is 27".  Perhaps one day down the line.  I don't mind its appearence as it is part of it's story but again the active red rust really does just seem wrong to leave.  I will just use the Choji oil for now to keep it stabilized and wait.  

 

The guy who bought the sword collection is located in South Milwaukee by the way if anyone is interested.  Had maybe 7 or 8 more swords, mine was the cheapest one he had available.

[waljamada]

I will take the overhead full shot of the blade with the tang today to hopefully help learn more on the sword from you guys. Thanks in advance for any of the knowledge you share.

[Austus]

Good sword, nice photos, great deal.  I think you should go back and consider buying some of the other swords from that collection. Opportunities like that don't come along every day.

[Bruce Pennington]

The size and style of the seppa (spacers on either side of the tsuba) and the cat-scratch patterned habaki indicate the owner spent extra money to fit this blade out in quality fittings.

 

The guys are saying not to make an effort to remove the rust marks from the blade because the process will often damage the fancy temper pattern (many technical terms for this, but often simply refered to as "hamon"). If this turns out to be something you want to have professionally pollished, you'd regret causing harm at this stage.

[waljamada]

Bruce, thanks for the response. I will be leaving my sword as is for now. I will continue to educate myself and perhaps make some decision to act in some form further on down the road.

 

Austus, sadly the other swords were all more expensive and I dont have the money to throw at them. Plus truthfully I personally didnt aesthetically like the look of the mount/handles of the swords, tsuba and seppa on the swords. They will be there for others with the interest, passion and very importantly...bankroll.

[waljamada]

Here is a link to the naked katana top down view with no perspective. Or at least my best attempt at one. Also I included a picture of the back of the blade. Are most the backs flat or angled like a rooftop as on this sword? Hopefully the naked katana pics can help determine how old-ish it is.

 

https://ibb.co/album/gELYQa

[waljamada]

Random side note, I took the sword apart since I just got thr choji oil in the mail and noticed under the spacers on the top of the guard itself it's original owner etched their last name in Kanji along with the #3.

[Bruce Pennington]

Random side note, I took the sword apart since I just got thr choji oil in the mail and noticed under the spacers on the top of the guard itself it's original owner etched their last name in Kanji along with the #3.

Ok, you can’t get away with that! Pics please!

[waljamada]

Ha arg ok, I'll take it back apart and post the pic in a few minutes. I regretted not taking a pic after I out the handle back on.

[waljamada]

Heres the etching on the guard.

 

https://ibb.co/y09V5mb

[Bruce Pennington]

Just posting some of his pics for the future. Linked pictures ofter dissapear over time.

[Austus]

Good job, Bruce; great idea.  Is that dried oil?  What about a little pure alcohol treatment?   That sword just keeps looking better. Makes me wonder what those other ones looked like.

[waljamada]

The guy I bought it from owns a respected war relics store. He bought an entire collection from the wife of a life long collector of both military items but also Japanese swords who had passed away. So basically it was a passionate guys entire life long collection of swords. I would bet some of the swords could be something special. When I was there he had a few swords in the 1,500 to 1,800 range (one was a armory blade but worked on by a swordsmith that signed it with his mei) and then he had maybe 4 or 5 swords that he was researching the mei signatures but expected them to be in the 2,000 and ossibly way up range. The rest of the collection was the sword I bought and then a cavalry, parade and a diplomatic? sword. Hes sold the lower level stuff up to my sword and now hes left with the higher tier swords. He put one sword aside for himself. What I remember is one sword had the black naval scabbard and full mountings and the rest didnt have military mountings. They all had mei and conditions were generally much better than the blade I bought.

[Grey Doffin]

Hi Adam,

Please check your Personal Messages for one from me.

Grey

[waljamada]

Well guys, this is addictive. Bought another katana but this one from ebay so hopefully didnt mess up. I think I'll stop here for a bit and see how it goes. Still buying on the lower end and if I buy one again I'll buy a minty blade. I really do like the ones with scars though.

[Shamsy]

You should consider books as your next purchase. It'll fuel your interest and help you make wise purchase and collecting decisions.

[waljamada]

Good advice, and I will do that. I lived in Japan for 7.5 years andd have a bit of exposure to these things but never stopped to take a hard look at this world of swords. When I do make my next sword purchase it will be down the line with me being a wiser man with a larger budget. Until then I will continue learning and I have two swords to master the caring process for.