Jake6500

You're definitely right, but I'm also sure it will go up in the last 5-10 mins so we'll see where it ends up.

Interesting, I hadn't learned about this style of tsuba yet. Definitely a lot of gold on these things, even compared to the examples in that thread but you can definitely see the stylistic similarities! Now I kind of want to buy these things, but I'm sure the price will go up a lot by the end of the auction. I still want redemption after I got burned on that other auction yesterday!

So as the title suggests, Here are some cool looking gold tsuba: https://www.jauce.com/auction/h1147963384 Figured this listing could be a learning opportunity and wanted to ask the experts on the forum. Never seen a listing quite like this one and the title says these are Meiji Period. Do you think these are legitimate Meiji pieces or modern fakes?

8x40=320 Sounds about right

For me, I currently have 8 tsuba in total. It didn't take me long to get a taste of the mid to higher price range stuff. *EDIT: Basically now that I have a bit more of a sense of quality, I have started aiming for quality. Otherwise I would have more tsuba than 8 by now. I have started to purchase more expensive items than when I started. I also collect based on design themes. For example I have a collection of Noh theatre tsuba I'm building, a collection of Hollyhock leaf, a collection of Japanese gods, etc. Planning to start a Lion tsuba set also, though my attempt to kick start this backfired last night...* I got my first tsuba only at the start of this year but my academic interest in Japanese history long pre-dates this and my interest in tsuba sort of came from there.

Hi Dirk, Thanks for your helpful response. I have done my best to read as much as I could on this topic over the past few weeks. I'll definitely read the article you sent through and some of the older threads and Ford's posts have been very helpful. With regards to the auction, no stress as I was not actually planning on bidding on this particular item. I love the Murakami style, but I am not a huge fan of insects as theme for my own personal collection (although some of the Murakami Jochiku works I have seen have ALMOST changed my mind!) The reason I made this thread is to search for help in identifying other, non-insect themed Murakami works. What I have read thus far is that the Murakami school was one of only a couple that featured embedded stones, and that inlay level with the base was a common feature of Murakami works. I read a lot about the history and the artisans of the school already also. It is actually the works of Jochiku's daughters, Jotetsu and Josui that I am more interested in (but appraised examples are a bit harder to find). Thanks again for the article, Jake

Looking further into it the anatomy of the two appears to be similar but the thickness of the inner dentine layer and general shape does some to indicate Walrus tusk. Would this presumably mean that we could expect the tsuba to come from Hokkaido or Sakhalin, based on the natural habitats of these animals?

This is bizarre. I remember reading that the Greenland Vikings were big on the narwhal tusk trade and would sell them in the Mediterranean. Apparently people believed the tusks had medicinal properties or that they were "unicorn horns". Not saying there's any connection here, just an interesting side point.

I honestly agree, I think it largely boils down to the difference between the antique dealers point of view and the historians point of view. On the one hand every object has its financial value and on the other every object has its story. I don't think it has to be that deep and unlike Alex or Dan I'm not looking to block people or start a God dam vendetta over it.

You of all people relinquished any right to be tone policing Alex, but you do you.

So Okan, were these tsuba purchased as a single lot? A couple interesting shapes in there.

Idk Alex, you seem to be more sensitive than me lol

I agree with this but I think it is applicable in both directions here.

Let's not re-litigate the entire conversation from scratch. I don't doubt your intention was to help and I also don't deny the importance of understanding financial value. I will just say that your feedback of what not to do lacked a constructive element that is clearly present in Johns post. Sometimes it's also about how you say something. Even if the advice you're giving is good, if it is framed in deficit language it's unlikely to lead to positive outcomes.

This is good advice. You have not merely criticized the person but rather you have laid out an entire well reasoned alternative approach. I am in the process of trying to do this myself having started with Kinai school tsuba and moving on now to other things. You're also right about how taste develops over time and with newly acquired knowledge. There is a difference however between "tough love" or constructive criticism like yours and straight up tactless boorishness. It is a fine line.

This is just my opinion as a young "newbie" on the forum but if your only value in collecting tsuba is the reselling price, you've probably forgotten the reason you started collecting in the first place. Enjoy collecting and learning!

I think the nakago Ana was placed deliberately off-centre. The reverse option, that the outside shape was altered seems less likely to me as the tsuba features 5 kamon which matches the 5 petalled shape.

Hey Alex. As a "newbie" to the forum who saw your last interaction that prompted Dan to make this thread, I'm not sure I'd consider your posts to be particularly "educated" or "enlightened". If you think your knowledge of prices makes you particularly cultured you should perhaps look into a mirror. I have a Meiji period bronze hand mirror I could lend you. I think it would suit you. Regards, Jake

Hi forum members, I have recently taken an interest in tsuba from the Murakami school and have had a look through some of the old threads about the Murakami school or Murakami artists to gain some insight. I am wondering if anybody on the forum might have some resources about this school or if they could share some identifying features of Murakami school works generally. I have seen a lot about Murakami Jochiku in particular (his works are all masterpieces) and noticed some similarities between some of his works and this fuchi kashira piece supposedly by Murakami Noritaka: https://www.jauce.com/auction/f1108873810 The insect themes seem to be quite common (I've seen a number of dragonfly and butterfly works) but I'd like to know how to identify Murakami works with different themes through artistic style. Thanks to any and all contributors, all information welcome!

Then if we go based on Dale's post, this might explain the Heianjo attribution. It seems like it comes down to quite the subtle difference.

So wait... Going back to this as it might be hard to tell from the original photo Zanilu, is the brass inlay elevated above the surface of the base plate? It doesn't appear to be from the photo but only the owner could tell for sure.

I must say this thread has been an enjoyable and educational read. Coming into the thread I would never have thought a tsuba like this one was authentic. The idea that an oddly shaped tsuba like this one could have been authentic and modified in such a significant way never even crossed my mind.

I found this image illustrating the old rating system for Tosogu (pictured left) alongside the new rating system for Tosogu (pictured right) to be very helpful. https://new.uniqueja...ation-paper-ranking/

Hi Paris, Personally I keep my collection in a Japanese style drawer like this: https://www.ebay.com/itm/273779180367 Worth the investment if you are intending to start a sizable collection, but probably a waste of money if you're not planning to expand.

Yikes lol