Gabriel L

Re: that tsuba, this is the second time this week I've seen that gorgeous basket weave pattern on fittings. There was another sword someone posted somewhere with that pattern on the fuchi. I love it, not sure how I never saw it before! Anyone know what it's called? Thanks, —G.

EDIT: Pretty impressive job Chris, reading that sosho script. I find kanji hard enough at times... I wish we could somehow broadcast a message to the world population: "stop ruining swords by attempting to "polish" them yourself!" Post pics of the whole blade. Even though the value has been obliterated by ruining the nakago, it is still a genuine old sword and the blade could theoretically be salvaged by a professional togishi (depending on what other damage may have been done). Now, who is going to pay the $3k (and what togishi will accept the job) on a ruined sword... not for me to say. But let's at least see what there is to see first. Cheers, —G.

I agree Steve, it is neat looking even if it isn't a "real" sword in the nihonto craft/art sense. I would be happy to own that particular sword... it's a unique corner of gunto history, and someone obviously liked it enough to have shirasaya made for it. Maybe that's a little quirky, but it does seem pretty well made and attractive for a "metal tsunagi." It also scratches that collector's itch to have a representation of every textbook example! Congrats, —G.

Isidro: My apologies for saying so, but your English is slightly difficult to understand. I believe you are asking how it is possible that a mumei gunto blade can have a traditional water-quench hamon – correct? There is no reason it cannot. Gunto can have a number of different kinds of blades: Traditionally-made antique swords, remounted for gunto fittings. Traditionally-made art-grade contemporary swords, for example those by the Yasukuni smiths. Semi-traditionally made swords without as much artistic merit, for example certain mass-produced (but still handmade) swords from Seki. Real swords handmade via non-traditional methods or using non-traditional materials; for example, swords made with rail steel, oil-quenched swords, etc. Consider Koa Isshin Mantetsu, for example. Machine-made swords, heat treated or not, sometimes with cosmetic hamon (e.g. etched on). Stainless steel decorative blades, for example used in some naval mounts. Pure junk (seen in the very late war). That's just some categories. Gunto is a complex subject with many variations and exceptions. For that particular sword that you linked, it does look relatively decent. It's hard to say much more without knowing more about the context. Do you have photos of the koshirae (mounts)? Did it come in shirasaya (if so, probably not gunto)? What's the story about how it was acquired? Measurements? Overall photos? There's not much else to go on besides the fact that it looks like it was probably traditionally made.

Looks pretty good Vaughan. Of course one challenge in this case is not just fitting it to the polished tanto, but also the pre-existing saya. I think Kapp / Yoshihara might laugh if they knew someone was taking their chapter on habaki as "instructions" – I doubt that was their intent. Still, good that it helped.

Interesting, not many records for Yoshimasa in Hizen province. Hawley's lists one in 1681 and says it's the same as Yoshinaga (maybe he means 3rd gen Hizen Yoshinaga?). Not sure how far to trust that. Nothing in Sesko's index or anywhere else I can find. Subjectively the patina on the nakago looks old enough, but what do I know (not a lot). EDIT: oh, you could have mentioned Matt already answered this. Anyway, wish I could find nihonto languishing in an antique shop or yard sale somewhere. This one's out of polish but it looks fine otherwise. Congrats. Planning on getting it polished?

Better. Not ideal, but better. I don't want you to do extra work on my account though, I am not in the market at the moment. I was just giving my reaction in my previous post, not putting in a request. Still, you are more likely to get serious bids this way, so I guess it's to your benefit regardless.

The tsuka, saya, fittings are all absolutely 100% fake. Together with the bad nakago, poor geometry details / poorly cut groove, and hints of typical fake hada, it doesn't make sense to consider the blade as being Japanese. Which makes more sense: that an extremely bad and atypical Japanese blade with elements strongly resembling typical fakes somehow got remounted in fake mounts? Or that the whole thing is a fake, made at the same time? I do admit that the overall sugata and basic form of the kissaki are much better than on typical fakes. But the detailed shot of the kissaki is still obviously a case of bad atypical shaping, not good shaping that has been poorly restored. It's a fake with a somewhat unusually correct gross overall shape. Nothing more.

I'm actually away from my collection for at least a month or so (recently moved back to DC from NY, but haven't finished clearing the old apartment out), and for some reason I've never gotten around to taking really good photos of this blade. But here is the original photo Chris took, as well as one really old detail shot I took. Next opportunity I have I will get some better images.

Indeed. I was surprised and saddened to hear about his passing; I definitely treasure this piece. Thanks Brian, glad you appreciate it.

Right. Looks like the end of the tail of a dragon in some depictions:

I realize this is sort of actual nihonto discussion but it felt too trivial to put in the main section. Somehow despite owning this tanto for years now I only just noticed that the forked end in the "tail" of the 竜 Tatsu kanji is, presumably, an allusion to its literal meaning of Dragon. Anyway, I thought it was a cool little artistic touch. EDIT: anyone else have nice examples of interesting details in mei style?

Argh, I was about to post Yoshimune! You are too fast for me Morita-san. This is not a good night for me... that's my cue to sleep, I think. —G.

Haha sorry I actually edited out that post but you saw it... I have gotten way too used to posting on sites that let you delete messages. I realized after the fact I had made a mistake, I skipped a kanji in my mind. I am researching now. Sorry! Not my finest moment.

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Second time you've helped with this: http://nihontomessageboard.com/nmb/view ... &view=next Looks identical... actually, looking closely... yeah, this is the same sword. Look at the red rust spots. Perfect match.

Ah, I didn't recognize / find that version of tomo 伴. You guys might be probably are right. Move along, nothing to see here... Out of curiosity John, when you say you find none that match, I presume you mean no matching oshigata? Because there is a line of Koto Mino smiths signing with 兼伴.

I've seen sloppier shoshin mei (EDIT: speaking in generalities, not this specific smith) and this is on a yari nakago (pretty narrow). Mei should be judged against the known examples, of course.

I'm not convinced by kanetomo. I think 兼行 kaneyuki is a possibility. But I am not certain.

I agree, although after squinting way too hard at the tiny NBTHK Hozon paper image I can say it reads "mumei (Sakakura Seki)." 坂倉関 See here for more. Still nowhere near enough to bid by, would have to see both sides, nakago, details, ideally description of activity not evident from photos, etc.

John Tirado, Samuel Rediske, Randy Black, Bob Benson, Moses Becerra, Ted Tenold, Keith Larman, heck even Fred Lohman... lots of choices for shirasaya, some more stringently traditional than others but all of them should be fine to store your blade.

Noshu Seki is a pretty good reading I think (especially given the togari gunome hamon). What a sloppy mei... Thanks! PS – This smith does not appear in Hawley's / Sesko's, and there is only one google result for the full mei (which is a long-gone auction reference), so if anyone has information on this smith please let me know. Thanks, —G.

Hi everyone, Reddit user posted a surrendered katana with a few blurry closeups of the mei (gallery here). I admit I'm having a bit of trouble reading the province, and I'm not 100% confident on the smith either. So far I have: 駿 (first char. Suruga)? 河 (second char. Suruga)? 圀 Kuni (alt. 國)? 住 Ju 藤 Fuji 原 Wara 義 Yoshi 正 Masa The thing is... I don't really think it's Suruga kuni. In fact I'm not sure the third character necessarily has to be kuni at all in this case. And when I look up Yoshimasa smiths in Hawley's / Sesko's indices, and do various candidate excerpt searches online, I'm not getting much in the way of positive matches either. What are your opinions? I realize the photos are blurry; the owner is going to take some more photos later. But I'm interested in your take. I figured either I'm misreading something, it's an unknown mei, or maybe it's even gimei. The mei quality is pretty bad after all. But why gimei to an unknown Yoshimasa? The first two possibilities seem more sensible.

Thanks Eric. Another point in support of this sword. We can only hope that the owner one day receives my message and gets us good photos / sends it to shinsa. In the meantime I feel like a politician with how much flip-flopping I am going through. Chris's advice seems the best, assume gimei on principle and then shoshin is a pleasant surprise.

"His work..." technically all we can see is the nakago, horimono, and some obscured shots of the blade. That's a lot, but it isn't everything, and it crucially does not include the actual workmanship re: hada, hamon, hataraki, etc. There is an outline of the hamon which looks like a more flamboyant/wild form of choji than I have seen on other Sadakazu works (but he did work in many styles). The horimono is good but the reference works are objectively better (look at the details in the dragon's "face," and the handle of the ken looks a little crooked). The nakago is similar but has weaker yasurime and a number of distinctive issues especially in light of the gimei breakdown in the Nihon To Koza. His work did vary in quality but this is a famous smith with many gimei. My own opinion after all this discussion is that it has potential and should go to shinsa, but I would bet on a negative result. Even if it is gimei however it looks like it might be a skillfully-made sword.