Gabriel L

EDIT: ninja'd by Mariusz who gave the advice to try it yourself, I agree, it is a very good exercise. So I will add "spoiler" tags to my reply, just in case you want to attempt it. Olegs, "Katana" means sword, so no need to be redundant, just call it a katana. It does not seem like a very likely smith to gimei (fake signature), he is not famous, so odds are this is that smith. But please post photos of the entire blade, both sides, and ideally get some photos of the workmanship (hamon, hada, etc.). I cannot help with further attribution but we can at least assess condition etc. Regards, —G.

Hello everyone, This might be the most striking and unusual naginata I have ever seen. Katakiri-ba with some very atypical horimono. I am curious about that horimono, actually. Is it some kind of bonji? The stroke design looks astonishingly similar to modern typefaces. On that note, does anyone have a good list of bonji? I can recognize some of the absolute most common examples, but it would be nice to study the topic a little more carefully. EDIT: or know a good reference book on bonji, doesn't have to be online...

One of the very many "Last Samurai" swords on the market (and this is one of the lowest quality ones). See here for more info on the inscription. The funny thing is, this is how it appeared in the movie, when Katsumoto says it means "I belong to the warrior in whom the old ways have joined with the new." But that's not what's actually written on it at all; it says something more like "since ancient times, god has favored the patriot." So they didn't even get their own movie's internal logic right, let alone history... EDIT: even worse, the one in the movie has a full stop character at the end, which is hilariously modern-looking. Like finding an "antique" western longsword with an emoticon on it or something. Sorry Abe.

Richard K George has written some very good advice on this subject: http://www.rkgphotos.com/articles/ktk_p ... t_2012.pdf I have adopted similar setups to produce images. It requires a bit of setup and a lot of experimentation, but you can get good results. Some real essentials include shooting only in RAW images (for much better editing), white balancing using a grey card, using a tripod, switching to manual exposure, checking depth of field (either with the optical preview button or in the LCD), etc. Using a bit of white posterboard to make the mune pop is good, but sometimes you need to edit a bit in post anyway. Make sure all your light sources are of a single type, so there is only one color temperature to the scene (easy to fix in post). Manual focus using magnified live preview is a good technique, prevents "hunting" AF due to reflections. I would not recommend using automated stitching unless you are very practiced with the technique. The software will distort and skew images to shoehorn them together, and the final sugata will no longer be correct. Plus the lighting will usually be uneven as a result. Don't convert to B&W unless you have a good reason to do so, e.g. file size for very large images that are going to be printed B&W anyway. Color is information, and digital images store a lot more information (and monitors display much finer detail) with multiple colors than with pure luminance values; each subpixel in a typical 8-bit display can only portray 256 levels of grey, but using three different subpixels you up that to 16.7 million colors. Your brain can use color cues to differentiate fine details that would be lost in greyscale. Besides which, if you standardize your white balance etc., the colors of different steels are actually representable; why wouldn't you want that in your photo? Just as an example, I can tell you to "ignore the blue streaks" in the photo below because they are just some leftovers from an alcohol wipe. If that photo was grayscale, it would just look like scratches.

I've heard (now that I started looking into it) that this was sometimes done, and FWIW I agree it is a possibility for this piece if you look at the placement of some of the shippo – they get very close to what would be the seppa dai (if it had a more distinct seppa dai), to the diagonal groove, etc. It is a composition which looks okay as it is, but might look a little "tight" mounted and gives an impression of being unplanned. Also, you can see the color of the patina is slightly different surrounding each piece, which to my uneducated eye suggests they might have been added later. But that is a total guess on my part. Nice sandai tsuba! Thanks for sharing. The rabbit is definitely out of the ordinary and very striking. Appreciate it, Ford. If nothing else I am learning quite a bit more about this technique than I likely would have any time soon. Regards, —G.

Fake. Rough acid-etched swirly coarse hada, wrong color alloys and patina, pseudo-Japanese koshirae that doesn't match normal motifs or designs, nontraditional tsukamaki method (notice the twists all go the same direction), etc. Marginally more accurate fake than some, but still a low-grade copy.

Thanks Guido! Nice topical eBook, I'll enjoy reading it.

Thanks very much for the honest opinion Guido. I did find the workmanship clearly distinct from the more masterful shippo seen on many known Hirata school fittings. It raised the question in my mind as to whether it could be a later-period Hirata-influenced piece (once the cloisonné technique was "out of the bag") rather than Hirata school proper. While that would be mildly disappointing if true, on the other hand I recognized that it was not a high-end example when I bought it, and I paid what I thought it was worth simply for being an attractive tsuba with shippo. Part of the reason I posted it here was to hopefully spur discussion especially about the specific appraisal (why "Hirata II?") but I didn't want to poison the well so I'm glad someone else raised the question. Although I am not an expert in blades or fittings, I might say I am even less an expert in fittings than in blades so I do not have a good basis on which to make such a determination. This is another reason I am now interested in learning more about the school and representative / copied examples (even if it is not genuine Hirata, that makes it a good comparison example in my humble opinion). Perhaps if someone has Skip Holbrook's contact info I can get his thoughts / notes on the piece... provided he remembers it well enough. Not to be challenging , just to see if he has any knowledge to offer. In the meantime, thanks to everyone for contributing to the thread. More opinions & ideas are welcome!

I know there is a touch of humor to this suggestion, but I for one agree... it is some kind of dish. Not a dish I think I'd enjoy, but someone apparently did! :lol:

I think it's only thickening in the sense that the person who inscribed this mei was thick... When I said I "don't know what to think," I meant it as "it's odd that they couldn't even get that detail right." Chris has put it a bit more directly than I have, which in some cases (like this one) might be a better way to communicate. I've stated my opinion diplomatically a few times now, but to be more explicit, on the available information there is no rational conclusion except gimei by a completely unrelated smith. The workmanship and style just aren't there, and the prevalence of fakes cannot be ignored. Like I said, I'm glad you're happy with it – really. But please enjoy it for what it is, and do not hang your hopes on what (by all appearances) it is not. Sincerely, —G.

Very odd. Not sure what to think.

Actually, if you're saying the hamachi is ground down to almost nothing, that's more like a sign it's been overpolished in that section. Assuming this is what you mean. But that's a conditional issue, not an intrinsic quality issue. Thanks for the pics. Ideally some closeups would be good. You can post up to 1200 pixel images, I think up to 1MB. Ultimately though it's academic, I think this is one where someone would have to see it in person to know for sure. Still, like I said, almost certainly a good deal for $700.

Thanks! Grey actually said the same thing, he was surprised they kept it for so long. Seems likely!

SECOND POST OF TWO (to circumvent URL limit) --- Honestly there were tons of other blades and fittings from many friendly people, too many of whom I forgot to take a card. I met Patrick Hastings and he had some interesting steel fittings in various stages of patination / non-patination. I bought a copy of Slough's "Modern Oshigata" book from Chuck Cillo at a good discount. Someone had a PERFECT jumonji yari in fresh polish from Moses B, with tiger stripe shirasaya to boot... one of those things I've always wanted. One last craziness I spotted on my way out was an 1866 nagamaki, which in addition to the normal naginata-esque change in tsukurikomi partway down the blade, had a SECOND geometry change in the tip section to become moro-ha! Never seen that before; thanks to Mark Jones for showing it to me. There was so much more that I simply didn't have time for, but it was a good event. I was discouraged to see so few attendees, but it is a Friday and a new location, so hopefully the weekend will bring more people. If I failed to mention someone I met, especially if (like most people) you graciously let me handle your collection, I apologize. It was a lot to take in in a day. Everyone who can do so, go visit! —GLL

EDIT: there are only 15 URLs allowed per post, so this is going to be split up a bit. Hello everyone. I had a great time at the show today. I got to meet a lot of people for the first time, and people were very generous with sharing their items and answering questions. I have to give a special word of thanks to Grey Doffin & Mark Jones, who sold me something I've always wanted, a cloisonné Hirata school tsuba (ex Skip Holbrook, labeled Hirata II with pine bark mon & sea life shippo). I have posted the photos of that to the tosogu section, but below is a small preview to entice you. Lighting conditions on the floor were good enough for viewing, but terrible for photography – not enough light, bad mix of color temperatures, etc. I did the best I could, but I only have a selection of decent examples. Rather than post them all here, I have created an Imgur album which I'll reference sequentially. --- David Stiles had a lot of good tsuba and other fittings. He had an interesting highly intricate sukashi tsuba which he thinks may have had a hidden Christian cross, or cross-influenced design, incorporated into it. One thing that caught my eye was a very nice kogai with a high relief vajra in gold on copper. This photo doesn't do it justice at all. Had a great conversation with Matthew Brice and he shared some nice blades, koshirae, and even surprisingly good production swords. He also introduced me to the quirky world of WWII theater knives; some had grips with aluminum, window glass, and other makeshift materials. Took some photos but they weren't worth uploading as I hadn't dialed in my settings by that point. Jon O. Healy of onihonto.com had a Reisen Sadamori that caught my eye, formerly featured on Darcy Brockbank's site. It had a beautiful sedate jihada and hoso suguba hamon. Bob Benson's table was great as you might expect. Some amazing saya lacquer, and a Hizen Tadahiro daisho. The workmanship on both blades was exceptionally refined. It made for a striking contrast between the flamboyant and gorgeous soshu-den hitatsura katana right next to it (I think Mr. Benson said it was Tsunahiro, but to be honest I don't remember). Andy Quirt deserves special mention for letting me inspect literally every blade at his table, and a number of very high-end fittings as well. He was inviting and it was a privilege to view works like a Ko Senjuen tachi from early Kamakura, fantastic shobu-zukuri Yamashiro Nobukuni formerly owned by the Mori Daimyo, and many other interesting works which maybe did not command such high prices but had very interesting details. An Edo Hojoji katana had a gunome hamon but it looked suguba because of the nie between peaks, and there was another blade (I forget by whom) which was positively peppery with nie. I was so wrapped up in the exercise of viewing swords that I didn't even try to take a photo. But I did capture some of the fittings. Mr. Quirt told me a heartbreaking story of how the owner of the sho tsuba to this dai tsuba withdrew it from auction, and then wouldn't entertain offers. One thing I've noticed and now experienced with high-quality migaki (mirror) finish shakudo plate is that it looks extraordinary in person, but fails utterly to communicate that beauty in photos. I forget whose table had this sumptuous koshirae, but it was worth a few snaps – likewise this tachi with mother-of-pearl inlays on shakudo.

Most of the cloisonné details. The gold inlay is extremely thin! I always enjoy sea themes. I'm not entirely sure what that last image is supposed to represent – a tadpole? Beautiful in any case. Likewise this very small detail, no idea what this represents. --- Anyway, this is now incentive for me to do a lot more research on the school, figure out more details about nidai Hirata and determine how Mr. Holbrook attributed it specifically to that maker. Hirata school didn't sign their work often, I have read because one was not supposed to sign work intended for the Shogunate family (and Hirata was directly commissioned by the Tokugawa). Thanks for checking it out, —Gabriel

I didn't expect to buy anything except perhaps a book at the Baltimore show, but I've always had a special weakness for Hirata school work, and Grey Doffin and Mark Jones were a pleasure to deal with. So I jumped on this small tsuba formerly of Skip Holbrook's collection. Skip's tag reads "Hirata II pine bark mon sukashi, sea life, shippo" and Grey had its measurements as 5.7 x 6.3 x .35 cm (it's travel-size, haha). Anyway, I'm really taken with it, and as I said Grey and Mark were terrific to do business with. Many thanks! In-hand, so you can get a sense of just how small is "small:" And now for the macro photos: Detail pics in the next post (otherwise I hit the photo limit).

Hello Kurt, The detail about being less sharp near the motohaba is not so strict a kantei point that you could use it to date the sword, or at least I do not think so. That is, after all, more a function of the current polish than the original sword. Unless you are saying there is a flat edge at the motohaba? That would be a little unusual. EDIT: not that I'm disagreeing, it could well be shinshinto. There is no "ichijo," but that is also in my opinion evidence that this is gimei. There is little reason to think it is some other Kunihiro who signed with "Rakuyo." Rakuyo is an extremely uncommon inscription, it is an archaic name for the region that became Kyoto. (Ichijo is a notable family, btw). There are very few smiths who signed with Rakuyo ju, and only one Kunihiro I can find. What's more, that one smith – THE Kunihiro – is well known and gimei certainly exist of his work. Plus, although I said the handwriting looked wrong, it still looks like they were maybe roughly imitating the genuine mei. Put it all together and the odds are much, much higher that this is a gimei of THE kunihiro, instead of an obscure mei from another Kunihiro that also signed Rakuyo ju. And as to nakirishi mei or daimei etc., no, I don't think so... students sometimes made blades and signed for their teacher, but usually those cases are noted and identified as such in the literature. And as I said this doesn't look like the right style for Kunihiro's school, subjectively speaking. And nakirishi mei was something done in Showa period as gunto production ramped up, it isn't something you see in historical nihonto. Naturally if I am correct this means it is at least Shinto, but more than that I cannot say from the photos. As to quality, that is another can of worms. In one strict sense, gimei does not by definition mean the sword is bad. There are decently-made gimei. On the other hand, the practical reality is that gimei are USUALLY not excellent. This is a real old Japanese sword and as such has a certain base value and quality level; unless there is a fatal flaw on it somewhere, I'd say $700 is a steal. On the other hand, it is not likely to be especially valuable, unless the workmanship was unusually good for gimei, in which case you'd still want the gimei removed. But this is getting ahead of ourselves, it has to be appraised by an experienced person in-hand first. And, you'd ideally get the opinion of a togishi on whether it can be polished. In a more specific sense, the photo looks like it has some relatively rough shaping (doesn't the shinogi look a little wavy? Or is that purely an artifact of complex distortion in your lens?). I've seen togari-gunome hamon like this on some fairly low-end nihonto, but of course then there are smiths like the Kanemoto line who are highly valued. It all depends on the finer details of the workmanship, which do not show up in these photos. Anyway as I said before you can't argue at that price. Whether you want to pay for a polish should probably be a personal decision based on your desire to see it cleaned up, NOT because you think it will be financially worth it. That is my subjective opinion. I hope others will chime in with their views, it is always good to get a discussion going. Most importantly though this is all based on just a couple of photos, none of which I would call really good (sorry for insulting your photography skills, if you took them!). Better photos would allow more confident answers, and even better would be to take it to a sword group / club / event in your area for them to inspect. Congrats on your find, I know I seem a little negative on it but to be honest I am just happy it's in the hands of someone who likes it and wants it properly looked after. Regards, —GLL

Good try. You got the "-ju Kunihiro" correct. 洛陽住國廣 Rakuyo ju Kunihiro. Probably gimei of KUN232? He's a super-famous smith, and fame breeds gimei. This doesn't match his mei "handwriting" well. Blade has a Mino style pointed gunome hamon... not the same as Kunihiro workmanship from the first few oshigata / photos I can find. My vote is gimei Horikawa Kunihiro. However, this is just an opinion based on available information, not an appraisal... others are welcome to chime in.

"Linguistic minefield" is a good way to put it. For what it's worth, I did make a very feeble attempt to do Burger as BA-GA-RU: 馬賀流 But that would probably be read more like Umagaryu, or maybe Mayoshiharu, which is just... bizarre. Actually it pretty much just doesn't work. Like I said, a feeble attempt. And it doesn't make sense in terms of its meaning, either – "horse congratulations style?" I'll try Tiaan next for kicks... nah I give up.

Trying to convert a western name into an acceptable kanji mei has many pitfalls. There is a reason katakana was developed to portray foreign names and words. Brian is right that you would ideally find kanji that somewhat match your name phonetically – you wouldn't translate the meaning of your name. However, you simultaneously cannot ignore the meaning of the kanji, either; you want to pick kanji that have auspicious or positive meanings, not weird or negative ones. But each kanji can be read multiple ways, so you ALSO have to be aware of the multiple ways (in both sound and meaning) a Japanese person would likely interpret the kanji without context. Plus, some kanji make sense in names, and others just sound or look weird – this requires familiarity with Japanese naming. Finally, to convert Tiaan Burger into Japanese phonemes, you would probably have to use at least 5 syllables: TI-ÂN BA-GA-RU (there may be alternate ways of doing this, especially depending on how exactly your name is natively pronounced). That would likely map to up to 5 kanji. But most smith art names are two characters, or four if you include lineage names. Oh, and did I mention that Japanese doesn't favor names that begin with voiced plosives like B? Sometimes it works and you can come up with some kanji that look like a name, can be pronounced in a way that matches a western name, AND doesn't make people look at you funny. Most times this is a fruitless goal... I've heard that westerners living permanently in Japan sometimes adopt traditional Japanese names with normal kanji just because it's much easier. And I've seen at least one or two cases where someone needing a mei adopted a traditional nijimei with no attempt at making it relate to their own western name. Honestly in your case I would probably do this. I know katakana looks weird as a "mei" and isn't traditional, but it's another more practical option. Anyway, sorry to be a "negative Nancy" about it. I've tried to do this for myself, as a hypothetical exercise, and I discovered just how linguistically thorny it is to attempt. I actually do hope someone here can come up with something clever for you! So good luck; but do be aware of all the requirements and wrinkles, and make sure to vet the results against native speakers who do not necessarily know what you are trying to do, to make sure there are no odd interpretations. Regards, —G.

It is Nelson 5021. I don't speak or study Japanese except in an extremely limited sense as it pertains to nihonto, so I wasn't commenting on how related the kanji are or their semantic meanings or readings – purely on the strict form of the kanji, which in this case is definitely 5021 and not 5004. But if you tell me that 5004 is just another form of 5021 then I will gladly trust you on that.

Printed kanji are easy to find by radical: http://jisho.org/kanji/radicals/ Spoiler for the lazy Now... not entirely sure of the reading in this context TBH... "Masasui" sounds/looks wrong. Aha, found the correct reading here. Close but no cigar Peter... look close. Not the same kanji.

The next logical question would be "were there gunto tsuka with a second mekugi then?" Otherwise, why bother with the second mekugi-ana...

To be specific, Meiji nengo begins in 1868 (Meiji 1) so Meiji 3 is 1870. Changes in the Japanese sword over history is a long, multifaceted, and rich topic – hard to give an answer to this question that is not grossly incomplete. I encourage you to check out Dr. Stein's webpage, including articles like blade shape changes, read one or more of the introductory books, etc. In the Meiji period the wearing of swords in public was outlawed. This crushed the sword industry and very few smiths continued to make a living during this time. So the few people still making traditional swords are noteworthy for that reason at the least. They were still making swords using traditional methods and materials; by this late era, however, a VERY general trend is that a lot of buyers were wealthy collectors (e.g. merchants) and decoration, ornamentation, artistry etc. was in vogue. Whereas in the early Edo period you might see more restraint, following proscriptions about sword length etc.... again, extremely general trends. Every sword has to be judged for its own qualities. Quality ultimately depends more on who made it (and how well, some smiths varied) than on the era in which it was made – although again, there are general trends (everyone wants a Kamakura period masterpiece, everyone treats a mumei Muromachi period blade with initial skepticism, etc.). That's fairly large. Usually longer swords are made to make a statement... either special ordered, or as an artistic choice (edit: speaking contextually, here; obviously during certain time periods, e.g. Nambokucho, some Kamakura, etc. long nagasa was the norm). But it always depends on the smith. Though I can see this smith listed in the usual indexes I don't have any more info than that (my resources are not the most comprehensive by any means though). Hard to judge value when it's in this condition, too many variables. Can't see the workmanship to judge the quality; don't know what flaws may lurk under the rust; need a professional togishi's opinion on if it can be restored at all; etc. etc. It is a genuine old Japanese sword, so once it is restored it would normally have a certain base value (several thousand at least, and it goes up from there based on the smith and the quality)... but again, because of the sanded down nakago, it will have taken a hit on whatever price this smith will normally command. Sorry I don't feel comfortable throwing out random numbers. But on a purely financial basis it would not make sense to restore it. Restoration therefore is something that would be done because as someone who likes Japanese swords, you want to see it fixed. Then if it turns out to be valuable, it's a bonus. But that's a very hard sell when restoration is so expensive! You're welcome, though my only real contribution to this thread (this post) is a very humble one. Chris can definitely help you with getting it into and out of Japan for restoration, but I might also mention that there are a very few qualified people in North America as well. I don't have a strong opinion on what the best approach would be in this case, just throwing that possibility out there. Regards, —G.