Interesting Gold Menuki

[Deron Douglas]

Hello,

I removed this set of menuki from an old tsuka yesterday (in preparation of a new wrap) and I was somewhat surprised by it's appearance/construction. I was wondering if anyone has seen anything like this before.

 

I'm fairly certain that they are solid gold, but the gold material is very thin. Also, the detail (while in the photo is not apparent) is very fine. These are about 10-13mm square in size... so they are pretty tiny. The menuki themselves seem to be filled/backed with wood/sawdust and glue as a binder. I assume that this is due to the thinness of the material.

 

I'm thinking that due to the expense of gold "back then" the artist tried to create the "illusion" of an expensive set of menuki by fashioning them out of a thin material (less gold/less cost) then backed the "shell" with wood to prevent collapse. Similar things were done in Europe with wood and gold leaf.

 

I've never seen anything like this before and was wondering if anyone has experience with this type. Perhaps someone would venture to guess the school and age as well... any info would be much appreciated.

 

Cheers, and Happy Thanksgiving to our American cousins.

 

[Brian]

Deron,

 

I edited and re-uploaded the pic to bring it down from massive to huge :D

If anyone wants to see the original pic..it is here: http://registrar.cmcc.ca/goldmenuki.jpg

Just wanted ot prevent the page oversize scrolling, and reduce the download time.

 

Brian

[Deron Douglas]

Deron,

 

I edited and re-uploaded the pic to bring it down from massive to huge :D

If anyone wants to see the original pic..it is here: http://registrar.cmcc.ca/goldmenuki.jpg

Just wanted ot prevent the page oversize scrolling, and reduce the download time.

 

Brian

 

Thanks Brian, I was wondering why it was doing that :-) Ever see anything like this menuki before?

 

Cheers,

Deron

[Curran]

Pitch is often added to the back of the menuki to fill them out, be they soft and thin or thick and solid. I've seen it on the thinnest gold menuki, and I've seen it on iron menuki over which you could drive a truck with no damage.

 

A similar set of menuki was just published in the 2nd Annual KTK Convention Catalog, as part of Ron Hartman's collection. Ron's are exceptionally nice, and signed.

 

I would say that every time I have seen this pitch and removed it hoping to find a signature- I never have found a signature. In one case, I damaged the back of the menuki... so I don't recommend removal of the pitch. The pitch is sometimes as hard as a diamond. Leave the menuki as they are.

 

Curran

[Deron Douglas]

Pitch is often added to the back of the menuki to fill them out, be they soft and thin or thick and solid. I've seen it on the thinnest gold menuki, and I've seen it on iron menuki over which you could drive a truck with no damage.

 

A similar set of menuki was just published in the 2nd Annual KTK Convention Catalog, as part of Ron Hartman's collection. Ron's are exceptionally nice, and signed.

 

I would say that every time I have seen this pitch and removed it hoping to find a signature- I never have found a signature. In one case, I damaged the back of the menuki... so I don't recommend removal of the pitch. The pitch is sometimes as hard as a diamond. Leave the menuki as they are.

 

Curran

 

Hi Curran,

so this is pretty common? Yes, the metal looks pretty thin. I don't want to chance damaging it, so I won't go near it. Do you recall who made Ron's?

 

Cheers

[Pete Klein]

Very nice pair of menuki. The gold seems to have some evidence of kinsabi -- the orangey areas (aka=gold rust), which usually denotes some age. The walls are too thin to be from the Goto schools and there is no mei so I would chance a guess at Edo / Kyo - Kinko as an attribution. The colour of the kisune -- pine pitch -- is light so I have a hunch it's not extrmemly old. It would be a bit unusual to find a mei on the inside ura of the menuki as if signed you will find them either as 'tanzaku mei' which are thin metal strips affixed to the back of the menuki running from side to side (derived from 'tanzaku' which are long strips of calligraphy paper) or kake komu kibata which is a flatened area on the side of the menuki (usually bottom) where the mei is carved. If not present the area is referred to as 'kake komu kibata wo haishi'.

 

PS: the menuki in the catalog are by Kikuchi Tsunetomo of the Shibuya family of Sendai. The theme is Suigyu -- water buffalo/ox.

[Deron Douglas]

Hi Pete, Thanks for this info. The "pitch" that everyone is talking about... it looks more like wood chips to me. Does this mean the artist added pitch to the wood chips... saw dust really since it's so small.

 

They are kind of nice, thank you. I was born during the year of the ox so I thought they would work nicely for a wak I want to eventually finish off.

 

Mine are pretty close in design to the ones you pictured... but then a "duck is a duck" as they say.

 

Cheers,

Deron

[Pete Klein]

I WROTE THAT?  LOL!!!  I can't remember any of it.  I was so much smarter when I was young(er)... ROFLMAO!!!

[jason_mazzy]

Pitch is often added to the back of the menuki to fill them out, be they soft and thin or thick and solid. I've seen it on the thinnest gold menuki, and I've seen it on iron menuki over which you could drive a truck with no damage.

 

A similar set of menuki was just published in the 2nd Annual KTK Convention Catalog, as part of Ron Hartman's collection. Ron's are exceptionally nice, and signed.

 

I would say that every time I have seen this pitch and removed it hoping to find a signature- I never have found a signature. In one case, I damaged the back of the menuki... so I don't recommend removal of the pitch. The pitch is sometimes as hard as a diamond. Leave the menuki as they are.

 

Curran

 

You would think that Ford may have a solvent technique that works? I found a very nice set that seemed nice enough to be signed (thick shakudo so no chance of tearing) but being filled with pitch I have no way to look. They are too nice for me to try and experiment with.