An papered Hisamichi WakazashiI bought recently.

[bmoore1322]

Okay, I bought this one also, and it is papered, and in my opinion in great condition, it is an unsigned sword with an NTHK attribution to Hisamichi.

 

Hisamichi was a member of the Mishina School and there were several generations using this name.

It is in reasonable polish there are some scuff marks on it but the details of the hamon and hada are clearly visible

and all the detail can be seen. The fittings are fairly plain and in keeping with what is a quite austere and powerful blade

(typically mishina in my experience).

 

Shinto Era smith, and worked from around 1650 to 1800.

 

 

Brian

[nagamaki - Franco]

worked from around 1650 to 1800

 

For 150 years, huh. http://www.nihontocraft.com/Mishina.html

[Kai-Gunto]

Looks like the Kaeshizuno (hook on saya) is turned the wrong way.

[NihontoEurope]

Hello,

 

As a collector of Mishina it would be VERY interesting to see the attribution.

 

/Martin

[paulb]

Dear Martin,

As the seller of this sword (on behalf of someone else) I currently have the papers and I will, with Brians permission, forward a scan of them to you. I am not sure whetehr your capital "VERY" was because you were keen to see them or for some reason you doubted thier authenticity/accurracy but I can confirm the following

1. The sword was papered by the NTHK (Yoshikawa) at the last shinsa held in the UK

2. I assisted at this event and actually saw this sword go through the process.

 

As I said Brian is the new owner of the sword if he is happy for me to send them I will gladly forward a scan if you let me have your email address.

Regards

paul

[nagamaki - Franco]

Hi, if, and as long as people are digging out papers, a request to see the working paper as well if available? Please and thanks.

[paulb]

Sorry Franco

I only have the official Oshigata not the working paper.

regards

Paul

[bmoore1322]

@ Paul

 

I just put the scans of the papers on here, I'm not worried , as this is a very nice sword, with papers.

 

 

More pics also.

 

 

Brian

[Jacques]

Hi,

 

Hisamichi with kesho yasuri ?

[paulb]

Hi Jacques

Kanzan's book of Shinto Oshigata no. 456. Not the clearest but certainly looks like Kesho.

[Kai-Gunto]

The kogai looks homemade and the Sekigane too.

[NihontoEurope]

Dear Martin,

I am not sure whetehr your capital "VERY" was because you were keen to see them or for some reason you doubted thier authenticity/accurracy but I can confirm the following

Regards

paul

 

Paul,

 

VERY, as in very very interested. Not doubtful. It seems to lack the Mishina boshi and the hamon to close to the Ha as opposed to the Shinogi (not being Sugu ba). If it is attributed to the Mishina and Hisamichi, it is an attribution. Nothing more to say.

 

I need to read more!

 

/Martin

[NihontoEurope]

Hi,

 

Hisamichi with kesho yasuri ?

 

Jacques D.,

 

I think all generations H/M had Kesho. I did not see any Kesho before the Appraisals was submitted.

 

EDIT: A polisher would save that feature. I can see it faintly now when I look and it doesn't look preserved.

 

/Martin

[paulb]

Hi Martin,

as you can see Brian has posted the papers. I confess I am not a great fan of Mishina work although I can understand why you and so many others do like it. One of the most comprehensive collections I know of was held by Deryck Ingham who greatly enjoyed Mishina swords. These are now all in the Royal Armouries collection.

It is interesting but I think we all, especially in the west, tend to compartmentalise work. So we always expect Mishina swords to have a mishna boshi and sudare-ba hamon. Of course many of them do but as with all other schools there are some that differ in one or more respect and show these features to a varying degree. Certainly that was the case in Derycks collection.

Regarding this sword part of the problem is my terrible photography. The hamon certainly is fairly narrow and suguha based but the nie running along and above it looks to have something in common with sudareba. It has some features that also remind me of a Daido blade which I know very well. So I think in hand the links to the school are much clearer.

I think t is a good solid piece of work (I wish it had been signed) and dont have any difficulty with understanding the NTHK attribution (which is not always the case)

[Jacques]

Hi,

 

Paulb

 

Seen, it is a work of the nidai.

[paulb]

Hi Jacques

thank you. Maybe I missunderstood your brief original post but the implication was that you didnt think Hisamichi didnt use Kesho

I dont think either on the paper or in the decription the generation is mentioned (unless the title is specifc to one generation. You may know this better than me) As Martin says I think (opinion not fact) that several generations used Kesho it just happens that the one I pointed out to you is the Nidai.

regards

Paul

[Jacques]

Hi,

Maybe I missunderstood your brief original post but the implication was that you didnt think Hisamichi didnt use Kesho

 

No, you understood correctly, i checked my books and the sword you quoted is the only one i found with kesho. I'm pretty sure (but i can be wrong) that Shodai Hisamichi never used kesho yasuri.

[Brian]

The sword is papered. P - A - P - E - R - E - D.

Do we really need to haggle over the attribution? A shinsa panel has done that already for us..and they know more than us. All of us.

 

Brian

[drbvac]

OH - good to know - thanks for stating this B

[NihontoEurope]

Definitely worth sending to polish.

 

/Martin

[NihontoEurope]

Another thing!

 

I just saw it. I knew something was "wrong". I has been shortened.

 

Brian, you should see some newer file marks on the Mune about an Inch+ thick.

 

/Martin

[paulb]

the polish is actually a lot better when seen in hand Martin. the nie is very bright and the hada clearly visible.

I am sure a good polish would improve it but I think there is a lot to enjoy as is

Regards

Paul

[NihontoEurope]

Paul,

 

More of a retro statement/feedback, as Brian was/is considering sending swords to polish that I personally wouldn't bother having polished (and others). It is NihontoNoBrian and he makes the calls. Just recommendations...

 

I'm sure it looks better on-line than online, but the Boshi needs a massage.

 

/Martin

[cabowen]

The sword is papered. P - A - P - E - R - E - D.

Do we really need to haggle over the attribution? A shinsa panel has done that already for us..and they know more than us. All of us.

 

Brian

 

Yes, but we know shinsa teams make mistakes and it can be an informative exercise to understand why an attribution was made....

[bmoore1322]

The last time I checked the ones that paper these swords are the foremost experts on them, if they see something in it, then so be it, I know some members have a problem with this group of people that this was papered by, and yet we still see the petty crap.

 

Last time I checked, if it is papered, then that should end all discussion on the authenticity, and history of the sword, as the papers say it all, if you have a problem with the group, then it would probably be best to keep your mouth shut, and not bring your politics into this discussion as I have nothing to do with the problems you might have, and neither should the sword in question be trash talked because of this..

 

I hate to say this, as I don't like acting like a child, or being rude about it, but the last time i checked we all are adults in here.

 

 

This is what we all agree to when we sign up to use this room, so why is that certain people feel as if these rules do not apply to them;

 

 

Welcome to the Nihonto Message Board. We welcome anyone that has an interest in the Art of the Japanese Sword. This forum was created for the discussion of Genuine Japanese swords. This includes traditionallly made Japanese swords, fittings, books, related items and the history of the Samurai and ancient Japan.

 

Registration is not required to read posts, but it is highly recommended to be able to post, and participate fully in the forums. There are a few rules here and they are very simple: No flaming, abuse or general bad behavior. Please keep posts on-topic. This forum is fully moderated and spam or bad behaviour will lead to removal of the poster, and possibly a ban. You may use any display name you wish when registering, but we require that you either sign your messages with an initial and surname, or a first name and the initial of your surname. You can add this in your signature box in your profile if you wish. Totally anonymous posts WILL be deleted.

 

That's it, pretty simple really, so please enjoy yourself here and I am sure you will find this board a helpful and friendly place to visit. If you have any questions or need any help regarding this site, please contact me, Brian Robinson or one of the other Moderators of this board and we will help you as best as we can.

 

 

Thank you

Brian

[Jiro49]

IMHO anything that sparks a discussion is great. Everybody has their own way of communicating and you can't take it personal!

 

One man's junk is another man's Juyo!

 

I'm sure most have heard stories about a mumei getting 3 different attributions when sent 3 separate times. I have...?

 

Politics always have a role in any organization...

[bmoore1322]

Yes that is true, but like Brian said, it is papered, and that should end majority of the people trying to tear it down, and yet they still do, and some of them have not got a clue.

 

It is papered, and as far as I'm concerned, nothing else needs to be said about it, as they are the experts not me.

 

From what i have read, and heard it takes a lot to get a sword papered, they just dont give them out.

 

 

Brian

[Brian Ayres]

Brian,

 

Nobody is attacking your sword. Anytime a mumei blade is shown with papers and shared here it's likely to get discussion going. I believe that was said pretty clearly.

 

I realize I'm new the the board, but I for one am pleased to see you bought a papered, good polish sword to study from a reputable dealer.

 

Part of the beauty of Nihonto and Tosogu is that they are art pieces and especially when unsigned add to the discussion, the wondering of who made it, not just the why they chose a particular form....

 

Congrats on the sword. I personally only own one out of polish , mumei Wakizashi and envy you and your new purchase.

 

Best Regards

 

Brian Ayres

[paulb]

Dear Brian (Ayres not Moore or Robinson! this is beginning to feel like a famous monty python sketch for those old enough to remember!)

Just for the record I am very far from a dealer but thank you for thinking me reputable. I have sold a lot odf pieces recently but they have been either from my own collection or on behalf of a friend. Both of us are trying to rationalise what we have.

I have to admit doing this has increased my respect for those who do try and do this for a living it is not something I intend to do with any regularity in the future.

[cabowen]

I don't see anyone tearing the sword down, just some people questioning the attribution. If you keep an open mind and listen to what they are saying, it might be educational.

 

If you read the posts on this site, you will find several threads on questionable attributions. All shinsa teams are composed of people, and people make mistakes. If you look at papers as a starting point, not the end, and do your homework, you too may come to question an attribution in the future.

 

There isn't anything political here that I can see....or anything against the rules.