watsonmil

I was going to try and list everyone's name, .... but then I'd either misspell someone's name, or inadvertantly leave someone out. Let it be PREFERENCE , .......... all around please ! ... Ron Watson

Dear Brian, Now try to imagine that in Hadori, .............. My stomach turns just thinking about how a " conductor " would interpret that piece of symphony ! Woops I forgot but thanks ... Ron Watson

Dear Chuck, At least two of the tsuba pictured could fool me, .... but I am NO expert on Tsuba or other fittings to be quite honest. It is VERY difficult when looking at photographs. It is much simpler, but not fool-proof when you have an example in hand. The forgeries are very very good. There are other members on this forum who can offer you much better advice in this field than I. YES, ... I have heard of forged Shinsa papers ( hearsay ), .... but I have not in person seen examples. More often a Japanese sword registration paper is shown with a sword to give the unlearned the impression that the sword is papered. That I have seen many times. Actual forged Shinsa papers I have not seen, ... but I would be surprised if they do not exist. Everything I am telling you seems so negative. Please do not think there is nothing but fakes. There are plenty of genuine items available, ... it is a matter ( unfortunately ) of having to get learned opinions until you aquire the necessary confidence. In some areas such as fittings I personally have to rely in many cases upon other people assisting me. Nothing to be ashamed of ... at least I hope not ! ... Ron Watson

Dear Chuck, Please go back and re-read what I wrote on page 4. READ it carefully ! You see a dealer by having one or more fakes can completely ruin his reputation. Even if he/she should offer a genuine piece, .... trust has been lost. The benefit of eBay to these dealers is that there is always another sucker. They can plead ignorance, oh,.. so sorry a mistake. Please accept this as a gift ( some gift ), .... and I even return your money. Boy I nice guy right ! DEAL with a reputable dealer. Buy at a sword show, ... buy off the NMB ( mostly safe ). Stay the hell away from eBay UNLESS you know the dealer, ... and he has a return policy. Believing somehow the Japanese are more honest than any other when dealing with their own cultural artifacts is like believing the Queen of England never farts ! I've met AT LEAST AS MANY shady Japanese dealers as any other race. Race has nothing to do with honesty. Good luck with your collecting, .... just be very careful. This can and often is a high stakes game. It can and usually does bring out the worst in people, .... greed ! ........ Regards, .... Ron Watson

Dear Chris et al. Eric H writes ( quoting G. Schiller ): " I dare to say that in 9 out of 10 swords Hadori will help to appreciate the finer details of the sword. This is also the point where the Togishi changes from a mere craftsman to an artist who "interprets" a certain sword, much like a conductor of classical music. Why, then, prefer some collectors, especially non-Japanese, Sashikomi? " Probably because when I look at a sword, .... I consider the Swordsmith to have been the ARTIST . If I like the music, ... I do not need nor want a CONDUCTOR re-aranging the composition to his liking be he Japanese or otherwise ! Eric H writes regarding the swords sent from Australia to Japan for polish : " All the swords on display in the Art Gallery of New South Wales are in Sashikomi Polish. The polisher is Mukansa level and the very best quality polish available. He has been asked not to do Hadori. This is our preference. See the swords at... viewtopic.php?f=9&t=4666 written by Chishiki " It would seem that outside Japan, .... many of us prefer Sashikomi over Hadori. I guess our Autralian cousins are simply not advanced enough in the field to appreciate the finer qualities of Hadori. George wrote : " Who says what is best...and what IS best?...who decides who is "right"? " According to Chris, .... Obviously only the Japanese have the correct and best way of appreciating a sword in polish. They obviously have different eyes ... when it comes to sword viewing. Chris writes : " After seeing many first rate examples and being taught how to look at the blades correctly, I came to agree that hadori is preferable in most cases.... " I never had any problem seeing the hamon, the grain, the hataraki in a properly polished Sashikomi, .... but all of a sudden because the Japanese polisher has suddenly become an " artist/conductor " instead of a craftsman, .... I'm to look at his interpretation of what I should see. Hmm .... interesting transition there, .... perhaps this justifies his charging $ 150.00 or more an inch or centemeter for his interpretation ( I forget which ). Why don't you guys who suddenly prefer Hadori over Sashikomo own up to the fact that the main reason is that the Japanese told you, and that you accept whatever the NBTHK and the current Japanese fashion dictates. If I suddenly need Hadori eyeglasses to see what was obvious with Sahikomi, .... then I would suggest that Hadori is a retrostep in this field and most certainly not an advancement. With respect to all I will no further argue my point, .... but feel a great weight off my chest by putting forth my perspective on this never to end debate. ....... Ron Watson

Dear Piers, They remind me of Temple Protectors ( as in head ) for a lower class armoured foot soldier. The rivets look to be an old repair. Just a quess ..... Ron Watson

Dear Chris, You say .... " I think this thread has now officially gone off road.... " ... Perhaps you would like to start a new thread ?? You say .... " What is traditional? As someone has mentioned, the polishing art has evolved through time. Sashikomi as it is known now is but one stage in the continuum, and a later one at that. It certainly evolved as a way to show the beauty within the blade and had little practical benefit. In 100 years people will probably be calling hadori traditional... " ... Perhaps you would like to enlighten us with the approximate date that Sashikomi polish was introduced ?? ... We all know the time frame for the introduction of Hadori ! It is well documented that the appreciation of fine swords goes back many hundreds of years, ... I quote one example ... " Hideyoshi presented Ieyasu in return with the Tea-jar Shirakumo ( White Cloud ), a short sword by Masamune, and a long one by Miyoshi Go " .... this in 1586 .... I doubt this was just a " ground sharp " polish. You say .... " Blade making itself evolved...When something is in a constant state of evolution, where exactly do you demarcate traditional? Why not call the 13th century polish traditional " ... Just because you do not agree with the fact that some of us do not like the Hadori polish is no reason to belittle. ... Perhaps I am reading you wrong, .... but I do not think so. But then again I am not a sword dealer or polisher, .... so what should I know ! ....... Ron Watson

Brian, It appears well thought out, and presented in a way that is easy to follow. I like it. ... Ron Watson

Dear Franco, You have hit the proverbial nail on the head. Hadori polish is wonderful for hiding flaws, .... Sashikomi brings out all detail INCLUDING flaws ( if any ). Most swords were built as weapons NOT as art objects. It becomes a synonom for turning a sows ear into a silk purse. Everyone wants a Juyo blade, .... even if the sword is tired, contains hagiri, is o-surage. The only way to give them ( the collector ) their dream is to paint the bloody thing. If a woman needs make up to the point that you cannot sleep with her unless she is plastered in makeup, .... well then .. either don't marry her, .... or find some other atribute she may possess that offsets the wrinkles. You are right there are VERY FEW swords that are good enough to stand on their own if we view the Samurai Sword as STRICKLY an ART OBJECT. Most were never intended to be ART, ... they were designed as weapons. Art Object is a bloody sales pitch of a cleverly designed Japanese sales gimic to over value what is nothing more than albeit a perfected killing machine. I consider most all beautiful whether flawed or not. I want to see exactly what the smith produced, ... not what someone else thinks they wanted the smith to produce. If by some chance one has a very fine flawless blade, .... then by God make sure you see all that the smith intended you to see. If you do not own a flawless blade then don't mask it, ... but enjoy it for what it is. Even the worst blades have study potential if you can at least see the workings. Perhaps my writing does not convey my love for the Japanese Sword in a way that I would like it understood, ... but it is never the less sincere. Hadori is new, Sashikomi is old style, .... may I remind everyone reading this that little that is new is better than the old, ... it takes only a moment to look around our screwed up world to see where NEW has gotten us. My motto has always been .... if it ain't broke don't fix it ! .... Ron Watson

Dear Joe, I could not agree more with George. I have posted this under another thread, ... but it is just as appropriate here. My definition ( after having examined many hundreds of blades ) of the Hadori verses Sashikomi polish question is this : Tradition was Sashikomi, .... Politics was Hadori. Modern connisseurs seem to prefer hadori, .... the Samurai prefered the more subtle sashikomi ( Oh I already know it was not until the end of the samurai era that hadori appeared, ... but show me a case of the Samurai wanting to be flashy rather than reserved and I'll grant you a point ). Like some men prefer painted hookers, ... some prefer natural beauty. It is all a matter of personal taste. Some men revel in Politics, ... personally I find Politicians obscene. Some men prefer to be politically correct and be followers, ... I prefer freedom of expression over what's currently in style. I guess I've made it clear where my preferences lay, .... it is simply personal taste, ... and an adherence to tradition with me. ........ Ron Watson

Dear ALL, My definition ( after having examined many hundreds of blades ) of the Hadori verses Sashikomi polish question is this : Tradition was Sashikomi, .... Politics was Hadori. Modern connisseurs seem to prefer hadori, .... the Samurai prefered the more subtle sashikomi ( Oh I already know it was not until the end of the samurai era that hadori appeared, ... but show me a case of the Samurai wanting to be flashy rather than reserved and I'll grant you a point ). Like some men prefer painted hookers, ... some prefer natural beauty. It is all a matter of personal taste. Some men revel in Politics, ... personally I find Politicians obscene. Some men prefer to be politically correct and be followers, ... I prefer freedom of expression over what's currently in style. I guess I've made it clear where my preferences lay, .... it is simply personal taste, ... and an adherence to tradition with me. ........ Ron Watson

Dear Jason, I cannot make out the boshi. Is it present ? One thing about a Hadori Polish, ... if one does not exist, ... the polisher can always paint one in ! ..... Ron Watson

Dear Eric, ............ ONE GREAT photo, .... thanks for posting . ... Ron Watson

I have been following this thread with some interest. It is fine and good to say not all of any particular dealer's inventory is fake and/or reproduction. Being a former dealer in antiques with antique weaponry as a specialty, ... I think I would like to enter this discussion at this point. It is possible to have a spurious example of almost any antique ( Nihonto related or otherwise ). The forgers are getting better all the time. With the advent of the Internet, ... one has access to a great deal of technical information as well as the many nuances that distinquish genuine from fake. There have always been forgers, ... but the technical knowledge was not always so readily available. Having said that, ... the dealer who is in possession of more than one example of ANYTHING that is a known fake/copy is in my opinion at least either very unknowledable, or more likely dishonest PERIOD. To patronize such dealers is to encourage the continued flagrant dissemination of these objects among collectors. They should be not only ostracized but reported to law enforcement even though law enforcement in most countries is as impotent as it is incompetent. If allowed to continue at the rate I am seeing with eBay sales as well as so called Antique websites, .... the market and MORE importantly the interest of the connoisseur as well as the neophite collector/student will eventually cease. I have personally seen where up and coming collectors have quit their hobby in disgust after being ripped off by unscrupulous collegues who think it great fun and profitable to handle such merchandise or worse having created it themselves. I might add that where MODERN COPIES or MODERN ORIGINALS are being produced often by very artistically talented individuals, .... these should also be either AVOIDED or at least well marked with a date of manufacture. There is little doubt that I may well receive some flak over that last comment, ... but never-the-less it is my view that sooner or later these will be erroneously accepted as being genuine art or artifacts of the Samurai when in deed they are nothing of the sort. If one needs a set of fittings for their sword, ... what is wrong with buying ORIGINALS. They are available, ... and at the very least if even quite modest they will insure the intergrity of the sword as a whole. I have in my possession a very nice GIMEI sword signed Kanesada, .... bearing a long and probably genuine presentation inscription by a village to a member of the Matsudaira family. The fact it is GIMEI does NOT bother me in the least, ... but the SOB dealer ( a member and lurker on this site ) who sold me supposedly antique silver fittings which I used because I was trusting bothers me to this day. I was new at this game, .... and it very nearly led me to throw in the towel and quit. I'm glad I didn't, ... but I have never dealt with this individual again. Anyway, .... I hope at least one or two of you will heed my advice. It is written with no malice against an honest error, .... but honest errors in this field are few and far between. ... Ron Watson

Dear Damien, 1. Please sign your posts with your name as per the NMB rules. 2. The first rule of collecting Nihonto and related artifacts is to keep in mind the Japanese ( artisans/craftsmen at least ) change their names more often than most people change their underware. ... Ron Watson

Dear Jamie, The smiths didn't often bother with putting a hamon on Yanone. I think they simply found it too time consuming for something that may well not be recovered once used. More often I think they gave them an overall temper. Again only a few are signed, .... just too time consuming to try cutting those tiny kanji ... Ron Watson

Dear John, Thank you, .... I was hoping you and fellow collectors would follow up on this issue. It really is important to keep Government and the bureaucracy it entails working for us and not against us. Please keep us at the NMB posted. Regards, ... Ron

Dear John, I am happy to hear you have tracked down your sword. I do not however agree that your story has a happy ending. If as in most countries the Swedish PO is a Crown Corporation, or a Govenment controlled agency, .... then whomever decided to take it upon themselves to decide what the PO will and will not handle, .... unless authorized to do do so by the Governing body needs to have their bureacratic ass kicked. I suspect this is some pencil pushing moron who took it upon himself/herself to impliment rules without authorization. Perhaps I am wrong, ... but were it me ( as has happened in the past ), ... I would be on their case like s**t sticks to a blanket. You should be taking this up with the highest authorities possible, .... your member of Parliment. All may end well for you, ... but what about the next person ??? Do what I do and try to eat at least one bureacrat a week, ... it makes for better roughage for the digestion than oat bran ! .... Ron Watson

Dear Gabriel, Nice of you to share with us your latest acquisition. It looks to be a twin to one I own. Mine is signed Kiyotsugu saku. Enjoy ..... it looks very beautiful. ... Ron Watson

This is truly too funny to even post a comment, ......... Ninjas ... right ... Ron Watson

Dear John, Excuse me John, ... but why would you look for a different shipper if it is lawful to have a sword shipped to you via the postal system ?? It would make more sense to what I used to call " Roast a Bureaucrat ". I've personally roasted a few in my life, ... even gave one a heart attack once. Bastard never worked again in his life as though he ever did. You go to your Member of Parliment and raise proper hell. If that doesn't work then go to the media, ... that always gets a Politician's attention. It's time Bureaucrat's become responsible for their actions, ... in this case the loss of your sword. Small debts court is a strong incentative to smarten up a Government department that steps out of line. I once sued the Minister of Agriculture for the Province of Manitoba. After a phone call from his office protesting my actions as being unheard of, .... I was promptly issued a cheque for the monies owed me. I did the same with the Explosives Branch on a FEDERAL level, ... and had a cheque in my hands within a couple of days ... SPECIAL DELIVERY no less. It's high time people realize that these are public servants, ... full of wind and generally stupid people. If they get put in their place occassionally they soon climb down off their bamboo supported ivory towers. I was trained and found it useful information if practiced without exception, .... the very best defence is to go right for your opponents throat ........ Ron Watson

Gardehuser, I think in the case of this eBay seller the replys have been too kind. .... Ron Watson

Dear James, It is very nice to meet you, ... and I must say being a retired/semi-retired dealer in fine antiques, .... your site was most refreshing. It has a vast selection of items for the connoisseur of fine antiques instruments. A pleasure to welcome you into the field of Nihonto and related Art/Artifacts. .....Ron Watson

Dear Piers, An excellent article, ... and photo of the " Rain/Wind cover. As to the round bisen, ... that too makes a great deal of sense ( re: proper alignment. As you probably know most European Muzzle Loading guns have a Tang attached to the breach plug ( bisen ). I can now see a good reason why Europeans as well as the Japanese were hesitant on removing the breach plug ( bisen ) each time the gun needed cleaning, .... eventually the breach plug is not going to align to its original position. With the round breach plug, ... no problem, ... with a square or tang, ... sooner or later a big problem ! .... Ron Watson

Piers, I join Brian in asking about the Pan " RAIN " Covers, .... It is certainly an area we have seen little discussed little alone pictured. It would be my assumption that most being made of paper few if any survived. Should you or anyone have a museum photo, or perhaps an accurate reconstruction, ... by all means please post. The closest I have seen them were illustrated was on a woodblock print. ... Ron Watson