Francis Wick Posted February 14 Report Share Posted February 14 Hallo and thanks if anyone has a minute please help translate this Mei and date thank you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Posted February 14 Report Share Posted February 14 Francis, Have a go? It is fairly clear and you should be able to at least get half of it, I am sure we will fill in the rest. main NMB page has a decent list of the kanji required. Having a try is the best way to learn how to at least do partial translations. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugyotsuji Posted February 14 Report Share Posted February 14 Hi Francis, Just crossing with Brian's reply, so I have hidden the hint. Spoiler Check this out. (Bunkyu 3) 日本刀 日本刀 刀 武蔵国住人天龍子橘久一(尾崎助隆門人) 明治三年吉日 於江州彦根作之1310-1096｜日本刀 刀剣販売のイー・ソード[e-sword] 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Francis Wick Posted February 14 Author Report Share Posted February 14 Tenryushi Hisakazu ? 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Francis Wick Posted February 14 Author Report Share Posted February 14 22 minutes ago, Bugyotsuji said: Hi Francis, Just crossing with Brian's reply, so I have hidden the hint. Reveal hidden contents Check this out. (Bunkyu 3) 日本刀 日本刀 刀 武蔵国住人天龍子橘久一(尾崎助隆門人) 明治三年吉日 於江州彦根作之1310-1096｜日本刀 刀剣販売のイー・ソード[e-sword] Thank you the hint was awesome ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Francis Wick Posted February 14 Author Report Share Posted February 14 26 minutes ago, Brian said: Francis, Have a go? It is fairly clear and you should be able to at least get half of it, I am sure we will fill in the rest. main NMB page has a decent list of the kanji required. Having a try is the best way to learn how to at least do partial translations. Thank you for making me do it was not that hard with the kanji examples thanks Brian 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruce Pennington Posted February 15 Report Share Posted February 15 Thanks for the exercise! I finally got one right, ha! HISAKAZU (久一), Keiō (慶応, 1865-1868), Ise – “Tenryūshi Tachibana Hisakazu” (天龍子立花久一), “Kiso ni oite Tenryūshi Tachibana Hisakazu” (於木曾天龍子橘久一), “Seishū ni oite Tenryūshi Tachibana Hisakazu” (於勢州天龍子橘久一), real name Tachibana Heizaemon (立花平左衛門), he signed his family name also with the characer (橘), gō Tenryūshi (天龍子), he came originally from Katakai (片貝) in Echigo province but moved eventually to Yamada (山田) in Ise province, he studied under Ozaki Suketaka (助隆) and also worked in Kiso (木曾), Sakai (堺), and in Ōmi, we know blades from the Keiō to the Meiji era (明治, 1868-1912), chūjō-saku But I still can't get the dates if they use something other than standard numbers. I see Bunkyu (1861) 3 ? year August month a Day. What's that kanji after the 3? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugyotsuji Posted February 15 Report Share Posted February 15 Bruce, you need a sexagenary chart to read them off. Bunkyu 3 is 'Mizunotoi', and the alternative reading of 癸亥 (the two kanji), is 'Kigai'. This is shortened on the blade above to the second kanji 'gai' only, a kind of extra date key. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruce Pennington Posted February 15 Report Share Posted February 15 21 minutes ago, Bugyotsuji said: you need a sexagenary chart to read them off. Is that male or female!? Ha! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugyotsuji Posted February 15 Report Share Posted February 15 AC DC? Depends on your leaning, Bruce. I could put the chart up here but then no one could find it later. Make a sticky? (Unless there's a link on the site already somewhere...) Here is Bunkyū 3, see attachment. (All you need now is the key to reading them. By the way, a famous war is also listed by ‘Eto’ there!) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruce Pennington Posted February 15 Report Share Posted February 15 2 hours ago, Bugyotsuji said: Bunkyū 3, So, Bunkyu 3 = 1863, right? So, help me understand the purpose of "亥" after the 3? But the date is August 1863, right? Also, I filed that chart you posted and found I had already saved a large version of that chart! Dang. I just need to see enough of these blades to begin recognizing the date style for what it is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugyotsuji Posted February 16 Report Share Posted February 16 Bruce, there is a sixty year cycle of years, and each year is allotted one character from a 10-character ‘wheel’ and one character from a 12-character wheel. (Like two interlocking cogs turning and giving you a double-character designation for each year.) Don’t ask me to justify their usage of old Chinese fortune characters, but that is what they did, perhaps giving a different reference of certainty in a constantly changing world. They are more like symbols, rather than having individual meanings. The two photos above are just parts of pages from my swords diary year reference. They tell the ‘Eto’ characters for a given year. How to pronounce the Eto however, takes a different kind of chart, which I have not yet posted in this poor Francis’s thread. If I post the chart (assuming it has not yet been posted here on the NMB before) I want it to be somewhere easy for people to find. Your question about the purpose of 亥after 3, I tried to answer earlier, but it is a piece of the official 2-character year designation. Swords and armour often have these revolving characters within the year notation, written slightly smaller and offset slightly, and sometimes only the right one as a kind of shorthand. 1863 was more properly written 文久三癸亥年 but in the sword above: 文久三亥年 …and yes, as you say, an auspicious day in August. Hoping this helps! 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugyotsuji Posted February 16 Report Share Posted February 16 And the answer to the quiz, for anyone who struggled with it, is to look at 1868 on my diary page above. A short war broke out in that year, and they called it the ‘Boshin War’, after the Eto symbols 戊辰 Boshin. Short /o/ sound in Boshin. Another famous example was the great gun registration of 1872, Meiji 5, putting a 壬申 ‘Jinshin’ mark and number on each gun. And the cherry on the cake is 2024, the year of the dragon, (which is 辰 tatsu, another character for dragon'), more properly in the 60-year cycle 甲辰 Koshin/Kinoe-tatsu, or 'armored dragon'. See 2024, the yellow one in the pink chart here: 干支-年齢早見表 (nenrei-hayami.net) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruce Pennington Posted February 16 Report Share Posted February 16 12 hours ago, Bugyotsuji said: Hoping this helps! Thanks PIers! While I've seen this discussed briefly in various threads, over time, I've never had the time to sit and get a real understanding of the practice. I'm gaining a gradual comprehension of the language and concept of it all, slowly, so your explanation helps and is appreciated. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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