Shin Gun To or No

[Ratill]

 

It has been quite a while since I last visited here. So long in fact that the forum wouldn't accept my password and I had to make a new one (it accepted my user name though, so go figure). I just bought this Japanese sword and would like to have everybody's opinion. Because of the characteristic aluminum inlay on the two piece horn hilt, I am quite certain that the sword was rehilted in the Philippines. The brass butt cap (very well done) also shows standard Philippine motifs. Covering the tang is a brass backstrap running from underneath the fuchi to underneath the butt cap. Obviously, whoever rehilted this blade, valued it highly. Since the fuchi and sheath appear to be the standard shin gun to type, the logical conclusion would then be that the blade is a shin-gunto that was captured during WWII. The tsuba however is decidedly not a shin-gunto tsuba and there is something about the distal third of the blade itself that doesn't look like a shin gunto to my (admittedly novice) eye. The blade measures 27" (68.5 cm) as measured in a straight line from the center at the tsuba to the tip. My dilemma is that, as it now stands, I have a piece of WWII history and I am unwilling to compromise it by removing the hilt to free up a shin-gunto blade but, if this is truly an old blade (possibly with a signature), then removal of the hilt must be considered.  I know that the pictures I have provided may not be sufficient. Please let me know if I can take others that will help.

Given the condition of the blade, would I do any harm if I hand rubbed it down with a 3M abrasive pad to try to clean it up a bit?

I have also posted pictures of the tsuba and the entire sword in the tsuba section.

Sincerely,

R Tillman

[ChrisW]

The tsuba is definitely not a standard WWII tsuba. It looks like it was originally an Edo period tsuba that has been cleaned and modified by its former Filipino owner. So that leads me to believe the blade is older than WWII but I'd wait to hear what someone more knowledgeable on sugata has to say.

Also, NEVER ever apply anything abrasive to a (possibly) Japanese sword! Leave any restoration work to the professionals. Some goo-gone or warm water and mild soap should be fine to clean it up, then gently oil with choji (preferred) or machine oil.

[Bruce Pennington]

Rob,

I can't offer more than you've already speculated.  Do you see a method of attachment of the tsuka?  Removing it, like you point out is the obvious next step to learning more about what you've got there.

[Ratill]

ChrisW,

I have a feeling that any tsuba cleaning was done in the US. The Filipino owner probably kept the tsuba oiled to prevent rust but after the end of the war, it probably became US serviceman's bring back and then sat in a basement gathering rust until an antiques dealer got a hold of it and cleaned it up. Who knows where it has been for the past 77 years and how many owners it has had.

Thanks for the advice in cleaning the blade. I will follow it but I must say that for practically everything else I collect, hand cleaning of red or black rust with an abrasive pad is perfectly acceptable. Of course nothing else I collect is expected to have a mirror polish.

 

Bruce Pennington,

I was afraid that it would be impossible to tell from the photographs whether or not I have a genuine samurai blade. This leaves me with a decision. Do I risk degrading the item's WWII history for the possibility a much older samurai history or do I leave things as they are. I think I will carefully poke around a bit to see if the hilt can be removed without damage. If I can get it off, perhaps the tang will tell us more.

 

Sincerely,

RTillman 

[Ratill]

Hi All,

 

After spending a good while gently prying the Philippine hilt off the nakago (with heart in mouth all the way), to my joy I discovered a mei. There are also characters on the other side (mfg date perhaps?). The problem is that the nakago is too rusty to photograph. The entire nakago is covered with red rust and some of it is flaky. There are also a few blisters of rust present. I know that cleaning the nakago is a very delicate process so l am asking for guidance. I have submitted pictures of both sides of the nakago so that the extent of the problem can be seen.

PS, I was able to get the Philippine hilt off without damage and am very happy about that.

[BANGBANGSAN]

昭和十八年十一月 1943 November
兼陸 Kaneatsu

[Bruce Pennington]

Wow, nice turn of events.

[Ratill]

Bangbangsan & Bruce Pennington,

 

I have a fair to middlin knowledge of Indonesian keris, Philippine kris, and etc but with Nihonto I'm not even on the radar so your remarks, which hold significance for you and other experts on this forum are rather cryptic to me. I assume that Bangbangsan's response means that my sword was completed in November of 1943 by Kaneatsu and Bruce Pennington's response means that this is a good thing. I did an on line search for Kaneatsu and came up empty but I did find a site called WWII Japanese Swordsmith's Ranking (copyright 1997-2010 by Dr Jinsoo Kim) which gives a lengthy list of WWII Japanese sword smiths. I couldn't fine Kaneatsu listed (admittedly, I may have missed it). So, that being the case, I have two questions about Kaneatsu: Were his swords traditionally made (masa sa tetsu/tamahagani and water quenched in a traditional manner) and, if not, what is the significance of this smith? I also have one other related question, why was a blade made in 1943 dressed with an Edo period Heianjo tsuba? I am a complete novice when it comes to the nuances of Nihonto, so I would benefit from it greatly if you could spell things out for me.

 

Sincerely,

Tillman  

[Bruce Pennington]

Rob,

The blade was made in WWII, 1943.  The saya (scabbard) and fuchi (handle end by tsuba/handguard) are army.  So It was made for the war.  The tsuka (handle) could have been changed by any number of people.  Your theory about the Philippines could explain it.  The sword could have been taken by Filipino combatants and refitted.  I have heard stories of these war blades being used by farmers after the war.  The most common reason is a refitting by collectors well after the war.  So, no way to know.

 

As to the smith, Trystan my have the exact name, or the corrosion on the writing may be obscuring small details that would give a different name.  Either way, with the condition of the blade, it will be pretty impossible to tell you whether this was a traditionally made blade or not.  Odds are, it was not, as the massive majority of blades made for the war were oil-quenched which takes them out of the "traditional" classification regardless of how the blade was crafted.  But that's just the odds, it could be either.

 

My reaction to seeing a good nakago (tang) with Japanese writing was because there were a good many blades made in occupied lands, which were lower quality work, or worse, there are many fake/imitation blades on the market with pieced-together fittings.  So, I was simply glad to see you had a legit Japanese blade in there. 

[Ratill]

Bruce Pennington,

 

Thanks for the response. That clarifies a lot. What should I do about the nakago. I was thinking that a little light machine oil and hand rubbing with my fingers might remove some of the loose rust, make the mei clearer, and serve to protect the nakago further rusting. Or, should I just leave it alone? Hopefully, if Trystan knows anything more about the smith, he will share the info with us.

 

Sincerely,

Tillman

[BANGBANGSAN]

14 hours ago, Ratill said:

Bruce Pennington,

 

Thanks for the response. That clarifies a lot. What should I do about the nakago. I was thinking that a little light machine oil and hand rubbing with my fingers might remove some of the loose rust, make the mei clearer, and serve to protect the nakago further rusting. Or, should I just leave it alone? Hopefully, if Trystan knows anything more about the smith, he will share the info with us.

 

Sincerely,

Tillman

The Kanji is rally hard to tell.It also could be 

KANETAKA (兼隆), Shōwa (昭和, 1926-1989), Gifu – “Kanetaka” (兼隆), real name Hasebe Bun ́ichi (長谷部聞一), born August 8th 1898, he worked as a guntō smith and died April 1st 1965

Better have other member to check it out. if that's our guy.