ELK Posted December 28, 2020 Report Posted December 28, 2020 Hello, I came across this forum while looking for information on Japanese swords, having recently been gifted what I understand to be a WWII-era sword. I have very little information about it beyond a few pictures (and I am not actually in posession of it yet), so I was hoping that the members here might be able to offer some help figuring out who made it. There is a signature, which I'm fairly certain says "Seki ju Fujiwara Kane-?? saku", but that one last kanji has me completely stumped. There is also a stamp just below the habaki (Showa?). A picture of the nakago is attached here, along with a couple more images of the blade that that were sent to me. I thank you for any help you can provide. Kind regards, Etienne Quote
Bruce Pennington Posted December 28, 2020 Report Posted December 28, 2020 Improved the pics a bit. Just got to my computer, and you are right about it being a Showa stamp. When you get the sword, check the other side for a date, if there is one. I'd appreciate it. Quote
Bruce Pennington Posted December 28, 2020 Report Posted December 28, 2020 I think it's "Kanenao" see this: 3 1 Quote
ELK Posted December 28, 2020 Author Report Posted December 28, 2020 Thank you for the response, Bruce, very much appreciated. I don't think there is anything written on the other side, but I can already ask to get that confirmed. I will get back to you. Just out of curiosity, would there be any particular reason to sign Fujiwara Kanenao instead of Ishihara Kanenao, or does that matter at all? Quote
SteveM Posted December 29, 2020 Report Posted December 29, 2020 Fujiwara is a name that has historical, aristrocratic connotations, and so people of importance often claim descendency from the Fujiwara clan. It is very common on swords, but even historical figures, like IeyasuTokugawa, claimed connections to the Fujiwara clan as it gave authority and legitimacy to their administration. It doesn't add or detract from the sword. In this case, its just way of signing a name. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fujiwara_clan 2 Quote
ELK Posted December 29, 2020 Author Report Posted December 29, 2020 Thank you Steve, good to know. I guess I was hoping that might say something, like roughly when the sword was made - especially since I have now confirmed that there is no additional writing on the other side of the nakago. Quote
ELK Posted January 2, 2021 Author Report Posted January 2, 2021 Hello again, If I could ask your help once more, my brother was also gifted a sword at the same time I was - would you be able to help with this one as well? It has what looks like a Seki stamp on the nakago. Thanks, Etienne Quote
ELK Posted January 3, 2021 Author Report Posted January 3, 2021 Would the signature above be "Hiromitsu"? Quote
Bruce Pennington Posted January 3, 2021 Report Posted January 3, 2021 Hopefully a someone will get this for you, but I'm leaning toward 敏光 (Toshimitsu) The mei style is different, but seems to be the same name. During the war, there were often more than one guy using the same name. 1 1 Quote
dwmc Posted January 3, 2021 Report Posted January 3, 2021 Perhaps "Noshu ju Toshmitsu Kitau kore." Dave M. 2 Quote
BANGBANGSAN Posted January 3, 2021 Report Posted January 3, 2021 4 hours ago, Bruce Pennington said: Hopefully a someone will get this for you, but I'm leaning toward 敏光 (Toshimitsu) The mei style is different, but seems to be the same name. During the war, there were often more than one guy using the same name. Bruce It's 備前國赤崎住俊光作（今泉俊光）not 敏光 Quote
Bruce Pennington Posted January 3, 2021 Report Posted January 3, 2021 15 minutes ago, BANGBANGSAN said: 備前國赤崎住俊光作 I thought about that, but the Japanese sword index.com spells it with 敏光 (Toshimitsu) So it didn’t look right. Quote
BANGBANGSAN Posted January 3, 2021 Report Posted January 3, 2021 On 12/28/2020 at 9:11 AM, Bruce Pennington said: I think it's "Kanenao" see this: Bruce His sword made by 藤原兼直(Fujiwara Kanenao) instead of 石原兼直(Ishihara Kanenao) 2 Quote
BANGBANGSAN Posted January 3, 2021 Report Posted January 3, 2021 9 minutes ago, Bruce Pennington said: I thought about that, but the Japanese sword index.com spells it with 敏光 (Toshimitsu) So it didn’t look right. Yes, it's a little confusing, Both 俊光and敏光 pronouncing Toshimitsu. Quote
BANGBANGSAN Posted January 3, 2021 Report Posted January 3, 2021 On 1/2/2021 at 8:35 AM, ELK said: Hello again, If I could ask your help once more, my brother was also gifted a sword at the same time I was - would you be able to help with this one as well? It has what looks like a Seki stamp on the nakago. Thanks, Etienne It looks like 濃州住良光鍛之 2 1 Quote
Bruce Pennington Posted January 3, 2021 Report Posted January 3, 2021 Ha ha! Do you have now gone through all three choices that I was considering too! 1 Quote
ELK Posted January 4, 2021 Author Report Posted January 4, 2021 Thank you Bruce, Dave and Trystan. I really appreciate your help. Just to be clear, though, we are still talking about a "Toshimitsu", right? Quote
Bruce Pennington Posted January 4, 2021 Report Posted January 4, 2021 No, that last option isn't "toshi". Time to bring this over to the "Translation Assistance" forum and get some more eyes on it. Quote
ELK Posted January 4, 2021 Author Report Posted January 4, 2021 OK, saw that you've done so. Thanks. Quote
Bruce Pennington Posted January 5, 2021 Report Posted January 5, 2021 19 hours ago, ELK said: OK, saw that you've done so. Thanks. Only one response, but he agrees with "yoshi" 1 Quote
ELK Posted January 5, 2021 Author Report Posted January 5, 2021 Alright, sounds good. Thanks again, Bruce. Quote
ELK Posted November 14, 2021 Author Report Posted November 14, 2021 On 12/28/2020 at 2:04 AM, Bruce Pennington said: Improved the pics a bit. Just got to my computer, and you are right about it being a Showa stamp. When you get the sword, check the other side for a date, if there is one. I'd appreciate it. Hello, With apologies for the delay updating this, I now have the Kanenao sword in hand, so I have been able to take some new pictures of it. It now looks to me like there is some very faint writing on the opposite side of the nakago, and possibly also something just below the signature itself: Quote
SteveM Posted November 14, 2021 Report Posted November 14, 2021 I don't see anything under the signature. The reverse side has painted markings on it - we usually call them assembly numbers, probably used to help match the sword with its intended furnishings. In this sword it looks like it says 白八 (white 8). Quote
Bruce Pennington Posted November 15, 2021 Report Posted November 15, 2021 Thanks for the added photos Etienne! I noticed your dating question from back in Dec of 2020, sorry no one tried to answer yet, but both blades were made during the war. As they are not dated, it's really not possible to pin them down to a specific year. The Kanenao, with a Showa stamp COULD be in the 1940 plus/minus range. Most dated blades with the Showa stamp, in my survey, are 1940/41. I'll post my chart below. The problem lies in that out of the 176 Showa-stamped blades I have on file, only 42 of them are dated! So, when were the non-dated blades made? No one can say for sure. You'll find the same issue on old Nihonto. There are far more undated blades than dated. The mostly likely year for the Yoshimitsu blade would be 1942. STAMP SURVEY Stamp 1935 1937 1938 1939 1940 1941 1942 1943 1944 1945 No Date Showa 1 1 1 4 20 13 1 1 130 Seki, large 5mm 1** 3 9 43 3 3 108 Na 3 3 43 5 1 Seki, small, 3mm 8 14 7 Gifu Total 2 15 32 2 Gifu 2 5 17 2 Se & Gi 7 9 Fuller Gifu* 5 6 See note Saka 阪 1 5 8 Kokura 4 (Kyu) KO 1 2 2 1 江(E) Kokura 1 熊Kuma Kokura 1 Nan 1 Tan 1 4 TO 4(zoheito) 1 Yama 1 ヘHE 1 Matsu# 6 9 オ 1 タ# 2 3 マ 1 1 ク 2 ? 1 イ 1 1 フ 1## 1 + ア 2 ホ 2 Toyokawa Anchor 1 21 Tenzoshan Anchor 1 1 4 4 5 Quote
ELK Posted November 16, 2021 Author Report Posted November 16, 2021 Wow, thanks, couldn't have asked for a better answer! Quote
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