I Am A 40 Year Military Relic Collector/dealer, But Do Not Specialize In Samurai Swords.....

[mightythor101]

That being said, I picked one up recently, and would like to learn more about it, and it's value.  It has a different handle then usual, the handle is very finely braided black twine, I thought it was baleen whale hair, but if it is, it is mixed in with the braided thin/fine twine.  The blade is maker marked with only 2 characters.  It measures across the top of the blade 27 inches long.  The tsuba is iron and signed, probably dates from the early 1800's.  I am thinking the blade is older then that.  It is very thick and heavy.  Will include some pictures.  Sorry for not knowing all of the technical terms.  

[mightythor101]

I don't know how to attach more photos..... 

[mightythor101]

Thought I had picture of the signature on the first post!  Sorry about that!  

[mightythor101]

It has a very long tang

[mightythor101]

Here is one side of the tsuba

[mightythor101]

Here is the image of the tsuba

[Stephen]

N/A

[mightythor101]

Here is an image showing the shape of the spine of the blade, and the thickness of the blade

[mightythor101]

It shows wear, and damage, it is not in perfect condition, here is a picture of the tip, showing the angle and shape of the tip, and a bad rust spot.  

[John A Stuart]

It looks like Kanetoki 兼刻 One of three sue-Seki smiths. John

[mightythor101]

Very nice dragon fly fittings

[mightythor101]

Another fitting piece, showing dragon fly

[mightythor101]

It looks like Kanetoki 兼刻 One of three sue-Seki smiths. John

so this is around 1500's?  what kind of value does it have?  

thanks for the info!  i am learning about these, have not had very many of them.  

[ROKUJURO]

Ted,

concerning value, a lot depends on condition. If your sword had a genuine signature, if it was really from that period of time (ca. 1600) and if it was in very good condition, it could have a nice value (see https://www.aoijapan.net/katana-noshu-seki-no-ju-kanetoki/).

As it is now, someone may find it worth between $ 1.800.-- and $ 3.000.--. But you should consider that a polish will cost $ 2.500.-- or more plus a new HABAKI plus a new SHIRA-SAYA plus shipping and possibly papers (ORIGAMI). Without all that, it is just an old, damaged sword with a hidden potential.

[John A Stuart]

Jean the Kanetoki you link to is the 兼 辰 bunch. John

[mightythor101]

Ted,

 

concerning value, a lot depends on condition. If your sword had a genuine signature, if it was really from that period of time (ca. 1600) and if it was in very good condition, it could have a nice value (see https://www.aoijapan.net/katana-noshu-seki-no-ju-kanetoki/).

 

As it is now, someone may find it worth between $ 1.800.-- and $ 3.000.--. But you should consider that a polish will cost $ 2.500.-- or more plus a new HABAKI plus a new SHIRA-SAYA plus shipping and possibly papers (ORIGAMI). Without all that, it is just an old, damaged sword with a hidden potential.

 

 

i am showing it to someone later this week, they said they think it is kane nori.  keep in mind, i dont know anything about these, other then i can tell it is old, and genuine, whatever it turns out to be.  it is not the cheap junk coming in now from china.  i can tell the fittings are all old and genuine, i know it came back from wwii from the pacific theater, and that the family that had it had it for many years.  they were not the soldier that brought it back though.  the problem i run into is what i will try to explain.  i have one right now that i am going to sell to a friend of mine, i am a military relic dealer, so i have to turn things over, so that i can buy the next collection/estate.  i do not see these very often, but am smart enough not to get burned on the chinese junk, but kind of feel like when someone walks into a coin shop and says, "i have some old coins i want to sell............"  and for many years now, the people who do know about these, never want to share the knowledge, and no one likes to sell something too cheap.  i have another one, like i said, that to me, looks great, but has what appears to me, a straight temper line on it, and i took it to the big louisville show, and walked around with it.  i was mugged many times, by people trying to buy it for $300.......... i showed it to a couple of guys there that said, "if i polished this, this one would be an $8500 sword."  they polish them themselves.  i said i would take $1500 for it, and neither one of them bought it.  i think i came down to 1300, and still neither one jumped on it.  they said they would have an entire week in time polishing it, which would make it worth $8500,..... so, ok.... at $110 an inch, they would have an 8500 sword, but wouldnt spend 1300 to make that kind of money?  ........ i am not a surgeon, replacing kidneys or livers every week, but a $7000 dollar profit for a weeks worth of work..... i'm up for that.  i would do that lots of times, to get that kind of money.  i cant say i have had very many $7000 weeks.  i sat around eating shitty hot dogs and nacho's, to buy this sword, had i not been there, maybe it would be slicing water melons right now instead of having a shot going to some collector.  i had to sit through 5 hours of them selling crappy dishes and glass ware, before they got to the table this was on, and 2 large thunder storms on top of that.

[ROKUJURO]

John,

thank you, of course you are correct. The link should be to Markus Sesko's book on page 170 (https://books.google.de/books?id=46IYtI0nkiEC&pg=PA171&lpg=PA171&dq=SUE-SEKI+KANETOKI+swordsmith&source=bl&ots=BRDh25XSNt&sig=g35DCpGoecx1CaH0dg7tRICMLDo&hl=de&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiuuZjD1s7bAhULCcAKHegnBrYQ6AEIRzAJ#v=onepage&q=SUE-SEKI%20KANETOKI%20swordsmith&f=false).

@ Ted:

These SUE-SEKI KANETOKI smiths are a bit earlier, and my link to AOI for a sales price comparison was not correct. However, the real price is always what someone is willing to spend. 

The signature is very probably not KANENORI, I think John read it correctly.

The real market value can only be estimated when a sword is in polished condition - and not polished hobbywise by someone who is mainly a dealer, but by a traditionally in Japan educated professional polisher!  

Yes, it is a genuine Japanese sword and the KOSHIRAE (complete set of mounting parts) as well, but please be aware that age is less important than quality, condition and a true signature! In this case, the condition of the NAKAGO is astonishingly good in relation to an age of 500 years, so one should be very careful with an assessment.

Also, the edge of the blade has been slightly bent (not chipped as one would expect) near the KISSAKI (tip), so there might be something wrong with the steel. 

The whole subject of Japanese swords is quite difficult!