Charlie C

Menuki in the Edo era were rarely made from 24k gold, or even from 20k or higher (from my personal observation). From 14k to 18k seems to be a more reasonable range, and verdigris could develop depending on the storage conditions/specific composition of these materials.

I am glad to see that you have regained some of your professionalism. I have to point out that, again, the tsuba shown in the video was neither made in Ryukyu nor in the so-called 'Ryukyu style'. The tsuba was at most 'Somada style'. Not every MOP on lacquer is called 'Ryukyu style', and 七宝 (the geometric design) was not a Ryukyu design. The comparison you showed in the picture was not solid evidence to support the claim that this is a Ryukyu tsuba, in whichever definition. Let's end this what you called 'a stupid discussion', as you and I are both average bears. Average bear should not make statements about things bear doesn't know.

Come on, man, I don't want to be accused of anything more evil, and you don't have to be ALWAYS right. I give up. Hats off to you, Matsunoki. Still, This tsuba is almost identical to the one in the video, and it is not Ryukyu. It is Not every lacquer with small MOP inlay is 'Ryukyu lacquer'. The whole point I have been saying is that I have never seen a Ryukyu-style tsuba, and I would very appreciate it if you could enlighten me if you have any solid evidence. You just don't. You fed me with many Ryukyu-style other things and showed hostility against me for using a non-English language. I am sorry that the discussion made you quite emotional. I could be wrong too. Let's rest the case and continue one day when either of us has some solid evidence that there was a tosogu industry in Ryukyu applying MOP on tsuba.

Just for the information of this discussion, the links here refer to a 'Ryukyu style lacquer'. As good Rohan pointed out, there is a style of 'Ryukyu lacquer', which doesnot match the tsuba shown in the original video. My whole point was that the original tsuba was not Ryukyu-style lacquer, even though Matsunoki referred to it as such. I thought this forum cares about truth and details of techniques being applied to togosus, so I pointed out in the original reply that I would humbly ask Matsunoki to show us his rationale for identifying the tsuba as Ryukyu style. Instead of answering my questions, he only accused me of 'trying to look smarter'. Hard to imagine that the words are from a man who claimed that tosogu collection is about understanding. Anyway, I drop my case and apologise to anyone who feels hurt in the discussion. I have no intention of accusing anyone of being stupid, and I have never used such a dirty word in the discussion above. I sincerely recommend that dear Matsunoki handle the whole discussion with more dignity and professionalism, but maybe it's too late. Wish everyone a merry Christmas.

It seems that agent companies like Tenso still auto-collect the tariff (as I last checked last month), but sending packages directly through FedEx and UPS often bypasses it. I just received an update that my package cleared customs without me being asked for anything. A merry Christmas!

Maybe this technique is referred to as 'Ryukyu' in some villages in the UK, but not in the US or Japan. The technique shall be referred to as 螺鈿 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raden). The word 'Ryukyu' itself doesn't make any sense as a lacquer technique, at least in the lacquer world. If someone wants to maintain their linguistic purity on this Japanese-art-discussing forum, I am all for it. Ciao ciao, mon chéri!

Colin, I take full credibility of your experience and knowledge, but I stick to the opinion that this specific piece was more likely not 琉球漆器 as I failed to identify its hallmarks in the video. Attached is a similar tsuba made by the 杣田 school I mentioned.

You mean that your pieces were papered to be 琉球漆? I wonder if you mind sharing the kantei results as this is quite educational. I am still a newbie learning tosogu history and I just have not heard that there was a school applying this technique in 琉球. Many thanks.

Brian, I agree - I wasn't questioning that it was not lacquer, but it was not 琉球 lacquer. It was a common technique to use MOP on lacquer, but the only school I know that used it on tsuba is the 杣田 school, which wasn't based in 琉球. Sorry for not being clear in my original reply. 琉球漆, or what Colin referred to as Ryukyu lacquer, specifically refers to the lacquerware made in the 琉球 area, the place today known as Okinawa. I have some personal interests in lacquer and failed to find the hallmarks to connect the tsuba shown in the video with 琉球漆, so I wonder if Colin would share his deduction.

Not sure from what you deduced that this is 琉球 lacquer. The school famous for applying 螺鈿(https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raden) on tsuba shall be the 杣田 school, which was employed by the 富山藩 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toyama_Domain). I am actually not aware of any tosogu industry in 琉球 in the edo era, and it would be great if you could let me know your rationale. Thanks. Just to add a wikipedia https://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/七宝紋

High or low quality, you should definitely do it if you find them interesting. Even a lowest-quality shattered tsuba can be very educational if someone identifies its style, era, etc. Most importantly, they are your collection and your heirs would supposedly at least want to know what you collected.

Hi Mike, It looks like a 花押(https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Huaya) to me, not a name written in Chinese characters. The back clearly indicates that it was used as a buckle, but also could be made as a very large menuki first then transformed into a buckle. Still, this type of large menuki was only made from the end of the Edo era onward. C. C.

My guess too, probably tourist type 鏡蓋 to be paired with tourist type 根付.

Probably 鏡蓋, a part of 根付. See this searching https://www.google.com/search?q=鏡蓋+根付&sca_esv=d499cf97fcbe8b52&rlz=1C5CHFA_enUS677US677&udm=2&biw=1512&bih=827&sxsrf=AE3TifOnDG4Y9NZjGGlopdkdF0mDvSYd8g%3A1765727590764&ei=Zt0-aaGzLqbgp84P7fqQ8A4&ved=0ahUKEwih_sTut72RAxUm8MkDHW09BO4Q4dUDCBI&uact=5&oq=鏡蓋+根付&gs_lp=Egtnd3Mtd2l6LWltZyIN6Y-h6JOLIOagueS7mEiYIlDzA1jZHnABeACQAQCYAWGgAaUJqgECMTW4AQPIAQD4AQGYAgWgAqQDwgIHECMYJxjJAsICBBAAGB7CAgUQABiABJgDAIgGAZIHAzQuMaAHvg-yBwM0LjG4B6QDwgcFMC4zLjLIBw2ACAA&sclient=gws-wiz-img

What is 'museum grade' is really arbitrary, but I do agree that joy can be found in tosogu with heavy wear or in mint state. If the former one, I would imagine the warriors fighting with them on the battlefield (especially for those made before the Edo era); if the latter one, I would imagine they were made and cared for with extra attention and may have been appreciated during tea sessions or holiday parties