Question on Type 19 Seppa

[Bridges]

I have noticed of late that Kyu-Gunto Type 19 parade Saber Seppa in my collection are either rough or non-existent. Did Japan use crappy materials during the war for these Seppa? As many of you know, these blades were typically peened which makes the Seppa, as well as everything else on the handle, irreplaceable. I have a few Type 19s where the end caps are missing or tang unpeened which makes me wonder if this was done to replace the Seppa but was just never accomplished. I will attach a picture, the top two blades have Seppa while the bottom two do not. The blades on top have a leather and iron Seppa. The iron Seppa is in rough condition and the leather Seppa is quite aged. I figured Japan would use brass as they had for all the other blades but did this change with the Type 19 parade saber? Just a topic that had me thinking! Let me know what y’all think

[vajo]

False forum

Noah you spam around in every topic.

This is the Tosogu Forum.

Nihonto Tsuba, Fuchi/Kashira ect. not for militaria stuff.

 

[Bridges]

@vajo This forum is labeled Japanese fittings which I will link a picture of. Furthermore, I’m not spamming as I’m asking a question about Seppa which is a fitting. Also, if you would actually read my topic their is a second question regarding the change in Seppa from Kyu-gunto to Shin-gunto. This is not a militaria question. It is Seppa related.

[Bruce Pennington]

You can often tell by looking at the mark on the face of the handguard.  If there originally was a seppa there will be a silhouette of the outline.  I believe I see the outline on yours.  

 

Many of these came with a leather seppa that deteriorated over time and went missing.  There have been a couple of NMB members lately that have made replacement leather seppa for their 19s.

[Bridges]

Hey @Bruce Pennington, can you let me know which members are doing this? I’d like to ask them how they are going about this

[ROKUJURO]

Noah,

we have a military section for this kind of material where you will find the experts for it. As Chris pointed out, TOSOGU refers in this forum to the traditionally made items for genuine NIHONTO.

[Bridges]

Hey Jean, the forum does not explicitly state that, and the majority of resources refer to tosogu to define Japanese fittings/mountings in general or varieties, not strictly for traditional blades. If an admin wants to clear this up, that would be fine but tosogu are not strictly for blades made in the traditional style. Furthermore, you can have traditionally made blades in gunto fittings. I’m not sure why this even matters as we are discussing seppa which are used for both traditional blades and guntos. Seppas are made for all nihonto, not exclusively traditional. As I stated before, this is a discussion over genuine seppa, not guntos and not traditional blades. 

[Bruce Pennington]

Noah,

My lack of search-engine skills is legendary!  I made an effort to find the guy or 2 who mentioned that they made their own leather seppa, with no luck.  I'm posting a photo of one in place, if you care to have a go at it.  The hole in the seppa would have to be smaller than the size of the habaki to create the snug fit you want.  I have no idea how the other guys did that and got it into place without removing the handle.  Maybe soaking the seppa and installing it while wet, then letting it shrink into shape?

[Bridges]

Thanks Bruce! I’m going to try my hand at it in a few weeks. You’re right, with the handle being cold peened would make for an arduous task. Even if the end cap was removed, typically the nut over the square screw is very tightly torqued onto the tang making it extremely difficult to go in behind the handle. I also have a type 19 that has had the tang threads flared, forever sealing the nut and square onto the tang. I’m also concerned that the wet leather seppa may result in trace amounts of water sliding down the hilt and into the tang…that’s a remarkable thought though! The type 19 parade sword do not have a habaki so I won’t have any issues there. Very intuitive, I’ll let you know the final results!!