historical data

[John A Stuart]

Hello All, I am having trouble finding much information on the Jumyo Ha during the Shinto period. It seems to be rather sketchy. If any know some more about it please let me know. What I have been able to collate so far is here: http://www.johnstuart.biz/new_page_15.htm I would like to know where additional info may be obtained. Thanks, John

[Curran]

John,

 

I do not think I could add anything.

 

What more sort of information where you seeking? I assume you have been through Nagayama, Malcom Cox's book and through the Mino Taikan.

[John A Stuart]

Hi Curran, Yes, I have those books, but, the Minoto Taikan I have is all Japanese and reference to info there will take me awhile. What really interests me (and I want to include on my site) is during the diaspora of Mino smiths who remained in Mino and who ended up in Owari. The Owari connection is as I have stated but it seems the times were rather hectic and records sketchy. I hope to have more as I translate the pertinent section in the Minoto Taikan but was hoping someone had studied this line or knew an English reference other than those you mentioned. Thanks, John

[Guest Simon Rowson]

Hi, I'm a little late in adding to this discussion but I have only just joined this forum.

I own a katana signed "Fujiwara Jumyo" which was given a Kanteisho level origami by the NTHK 3 years ago and attributed to a Jumyo working in Owari in the Kyowa period. According to your research, this would make him the Godai of the Owari line (although, interestingly, you mention that his blades were not signed).

Ironically, since moving to Japan in July, I have shown this blade on two occasions to sword dealers who, immediately upon seeing the deep, unfussy, takanoha yasurime, declared it to be a gendaito (one said it was probably by Kato Jumyo the WII smith)!

Now, I do not claim to be better than Japanese sword dealers at evaluating a blade but certain facts lead me to think that they are not always as accurate as they like to think they are.

1. The patination of the nakago's rust and it's 2 mekugi ana are far more in line with a shin-shinto piece.

2. I have compared oshigata and photos of Kato Jumyo's signature with my blade and they do not match at all.

3. Finally, (and most importantly) I have a high grade Kanteisho document from the NTHK who are notoriously fussy about passing blades. (And, as I submitted the sword to the shinsa myself, I know there is no chance of substitution or forgery).

Therefore, it would appear the Godai Owari Jumyo DID sign his blades and I would be happy to send you more details if this would assist you in your research.

 

Regards

Simon

 

PS/ This blade is currently in the NBTHK shinsa and so it will be interesting to see what they make of it ....especially as Iida sensei of the NBTHK's sword museum in Yoyogi examined the sword some weeks prior to the shinsa and declared it to be around Bakumatsu jidai rather than gendai.

[kusunokimasahige]

keep us posted please! and if you have photots of the sword, do post them please!

 

 

KM

[John A Stuart]

Hi Simon, That is an interesting story. Yes, please send the pertinent info and pictures. I would like to research this further and if anybody else has more info re: this, please tell us. I would rather trust the NTHK than the dealers at this point. Thanks, John

[Guest Simon Rowson]

Hi John and KM,

Sorry I haven't replied earlier but my first Christmas in Japan has been pretty hectic so far!

As I mentioned, my Jumyo is currently with the NBTHK and so I won't be able to get you photos of the actual blade until it returns from the shinsa in January.

In the mean time I have attempted to attach 3 jpegs showing the NBTK origami my sword received in 2003 and an oshigata of my sword (on the left) alongside another, from the files of Richard Fuller (a gentleman with whom I 've corresponded on many occasions and like to think of as a friend), which possibly seems to be the same man signing in a sosho script. Certainly, the deep takonoha yasurime and last character of "MYU" seem virtually identical.

 

The NBTK origami interior reads (10 columns, from right to left):

1/ Number:15501

2/ Meibun: "Fujiwara Jumyo"

3/ Kitae: Ko-itame mixed with masame

4/ Hamon: Gunome midare

5/ Boshi: Ko-maru

6/ Horimono: (blank)

7/ Nakago: Mekugi ana; two. Yasurime; Takonoha

8/ Additional remarks: "Owari no kuni, Kyowa goro" ("Made in Owari during the Kyowa period")

9/ Shinsa Team: (the five personal inkan of the team)

10/ Oshigata of nakago with NTHK inkan

 

I have never tried to add attachments to these mails before so forgive me if it fails miserably and I have to try again!

 

Happy Christmas and New Year to everyone.

 

Simon

[Guest Simon Rowson]

Nope, that didn't work and as I've just spent the best part of an hour mucking around on ImageShack I'll have to give up for now and re-think how to send you the images.

[John A Stuart]

Hi Simon, Yes given that information I would suspect they are refering to the godai Owari Jumyo smith. My info shows him signing nijimei. Why not other signatures? After all this ha produced many swords and my info is a guideline of the likliest mei. Also, Fujiwara was in many Jumyo mei. Can't wait to see pics. John

 

Send them via johnstuart@johnstuart.biz or the e-mail link below and I will post them,if you wish. John

[Guest Simon Rowson]

John,

Thank you so much! I have sent you the pictures in an e-mail and I hope you can resize them for this forum.

 

I was about to give up, having pulled out most of my hair trying to downsize the bloody things!

 

PS/ Even Richard Fuller originally suspected his "sosho" oshigata might be Kato Jumyo trying a different script until I sent him my man's signature and confirmed the later NTHK shinsa result. The coarse file marks are what seem to confuse everybody but, when you look at other shin-shinto pieces, some certainly have yasurime that are just as deep and unfussy.

[John A Stuart]

Hi Simon, Here are the Jumyo pics, altered only slightly. John

[Guest Simon Rowson]

Thanks again for that John!

 

I need to master the pictures soon as there are various things I want to post on the forum but your help here was invaluable.

 

Incidentally, I owe you an apology..... I originally quoted you as saying that the godai Owari Jumyo didn't sign his blades when in fact you quite clearly stated that he signed nijimei!

Sorry about that, I'll put my glasses on next time!

 

Very best wishes

Simon