Any help with tsuba school

[Mike]

Hello, this is late edo tsuba I have purchased lately. I would like to have members thought of the maker's school. I hope that the quality of the photo is enough. Thanks, Mike

[Mike]

I forgot to say that the measurements are 8.4 X 8.4 X 0.45 cm.

Mike

[Curran]

Mike- post a larger image and I will take a look. I need to see more than the current image provides. I downloaded it, but resolution wasn't such that I could blow it up and take a better look.

[Rich T]

were all getting older and our eye's don't work as well as they used to :-)

 

My first guess from that image though would be Choshu/Bushu

 

Cheers

 

Richard

[Pete Klein]

Most likely Choshu. It's Ura side up -- flip it over so the hitsu is on the left as you look at it. Any fitting indentations on the seppa-dia should be facing you denoting the omote.

BTW -- looks nice! It has a bit of the Yagyu thing going.

[Curran]

Yah ya two, Choshu was my reflex guess too. But I wasn't sure. I've not really sat down with the books to reason out what characteristics makes Choshu be Choshu. Some designs are distinctly Choshu, but others like this one pop up across several schools.

 

Still, dark iron and the wave pattern in that sort of focal point as if it were meant to be best viewed at 1 to 2 ft away.... made me think Choshu.

[Mike]

Thanks guys, couldn't agree more, though I will be sure only when it arrives. I didn't realise the photo will turn up so small, sorry about that. I will post better photo within few days.

Pete, your comment about Yagyu is interesting I had that filling too, though I don't really think it is Yagyu. Mike

[Curran]

Mike,

 

I came across a similar one for sale in Japan. See photo. Seller says it is Kyo Shoami, but the seller isn't known for being that accurate in his descriptions.

[Martin]

Hi,

 

I knew I saw that Tsuba not long ago and found the Japanese Site with slightly bigger pictures.

 

http://www.nona.dti.ne.jp/~sword/tuba/t0203hatou.htm

 

It´s described as an Edo Shoami piece.

Mike, I hope you don´t mind that I posted it :?

But I think some bigger and more detailed pictures would still be of help for the Tsuba Gurus here.

 

What exactly is the circle in the upper part supposed to represent?

 

Nice Tsuba Mike - I love the waves theme in Japanese Art.

 

cheers,

[Mike]

Yep Martin, you got me, that's the oneI bought. Of course I don't mind you post it, it was me who should have done this. Anyway somehow I don't fell it is shoami, but the tsuba is on its way, so I will be able soon to inspect it closely. Thanks. Mike

[Rich T]

On old tsuba of mine (ex) Choshu Kawaji

 

In answer to the circle question, I think it may represent a water drop. Look to the bottom right of the seppa dai, there is a solid one as well.

 

Cheers

 

Richard

[Martin]

Hi Rich,

 

I first thought that maybe it could be a star too - but a waterdrop sounds more plausible

 

That´s also a very nice Tsuba you had there.

 

cheers,

[Rich T]

yes it is a nice tsuba.

 

Interestingly, the guard Curran linked is being sold as Kyo Shoami.

 

Cheers

 

Rich

[Martin]

I think it´s interesting, that both Mikes and the one Curran posted are of nearly identical design (number of waves and wave tips and their direction), just the shape of the Hitsu-Ana seem to differ from each other.

Although I have the impression, that Currans looks a bit older - but this may only be caused by the different picture settings.

 

cheers,

[Bungo]

" yes it is a nice tsuba '..............

 

looks familiar

 

milt the ronin

[Ford Hallam]

This image is of a very similar tsuba in the Boston Museum of Fine Art, there it's described as Kyo-Shoami, 17th cent. I think this is the most pleasing composition of the 3 in any case.

 

Joe Earl told me that most of the attributions of fittings in the BMFA were made by Ogasawara. But as we all know, there will always be differences of opinion in these matters.

 

With regard to the first tsuba that was posted though, I must agree with Rich T. and others who suggest a Choshu/Bushu feeling. What I find interesting is the possibility that the Boston museum example is possibly the starting point for this designs evolution. It seems to me to be an exceptionally well designed piece, It feels as though the maker was the original artist because the design has been so well understood. The later versions don't work as well, in my opinion, precisely because the makers didnt understand the composition, balance of elements and overall feel of the original Kyo-Shoami piece.

 

This is perhaps a very good example of how popular motifs evolve, or devolve, over time in the hands of less inspired makers. The example Rick T. posted is an interesting exception, in that while it is clearly inspired by the earlier Shoami model it has a very distinct character of it's own and was clearly very well executed by it's actual designer. As such, it's an original too.

 

Food for thought, maybe?

 

 

Ford