Henry Stewart

The Mei is far too neat and tidy for an original?? Henry

Thanks to Johnstuart in Canada; I thought it was along those lines in Sheffield and the date 1912 stuck in my mind. I think Fox's was part of one of the groups you mentioned. I think Mr.Brearly lived near to where my wife lived when she was a child. Many thanks for the link; Henry

Gentlemen; I think Steve has a good point. I regret its not my field but Ive noticed several members referring to stainless steel and commented upon the Japanese experimenting with it. I too have read they tried to produce a stain resistant steel for the Navy,but did not call this stainless. Perhaps my student days are so far back my memory is playing tricks but I thought the Samuel Fox Steel producers in Sheffield had something to do with inventing the various grades of Stainless Steel. The poorer the grade the cheaper the steel and vice versa. I seem to remember mention of something like E92 or 93A being referred to as "food grade" and very expensive indeeds,but nomenclature changes with time.It was bought for its stainless qualities not its strength. Perhaps we have got a metalurgist amongst the membership who could throw some light on this. Henry

Brian To be honest I have never heard of a heated punch; I am not saying that somewhere it does not occur,but as a once worker with metals and metal forming it is new to me. You are entering a zone of discussion which is long; there is the question of hot and cold punching and forming of steels and other alloys, the types and treatment of steels and other alloys; methods of hardening and tempering,comparisons of degrees of hardness, available forces to be applied,the use of mandrell tools ,etc,etc. Dont forget the nakago is of softer metal than the blade and therefore is more maleable and could be heated without the need to sink heat away. If you would like to take the discussion further I would be glad to oblige to the extent of my limited knowledge. Henry

Brian, The reason for punching the Mekugi-ana was that the HSS.Twist Drill simply did not exist in times gone by when these earlier swords were made thus it was the simple way of making a hole. The punch would have a cutting end tempered to light purple thus it was hard enough to keep an edge but not brittle enough to shatter when struck. Examination of the interior surface of the resultant hole would show it was free of the tell tale concentric rings which would have been made by a twist drill. This tends to infer the older age of the piece but would be taken along with other indicators. Henry.

HNY TO ONE AND ALL; Henry

Hi Kyle Just to endorse Peter Farrars recommendation of Bill Tagg of Liverpool Militaria,I started my collection some years ago now with three swords from him; also I have just bought a "special" with the help of Shan and received exactly as described. Prices in both instances could be described as fair and reasonable. Henry

Mark and Barry; Gentlemen I am indeed indebted to you for your asisstance in the matter. Henry.

Gentlemen; Still wrestling with my Manchuria question,can anyone please translate into english the following translated kanji from the nakago for me,and oblige;- sho-wa-kanoto-mi-haru (on one side) and ko-a-i-sshin-man-tetsu-saku-kore on the other. I am reasonably sure of the translation but not positive. Henry

To John from Canada and the Juyo gentleman; Many thanks for you leads chaps. Clearly like the traditional blades, some were signed and some not. Well that takes care of that avenue of enquiry; Henry

Gentlemen Does any collector know of,has seen, or posses a Kao isshin blade signed by a recorded smith?

Ted Many thanks for your opinion; I was beginning to think I was slipping in old age. Malcolm You may have a point; trouble is I know nothing of the practice of Tamashagirie or what its practitioners require of their blades,except clearly they must be sharp and last. Any help out there? Henry

Hi Barry; Yes thanks for the interjection. The sword did arrive but turned out to be Chinese; What happened was he photographed and advertised one sword but actually sent a totally different one (chinese fake) which didnt fit his description in any way. Its an old trick,draw the budding customer on showing one item which would cause interest and when you have the cash send cheap rubbish to the innocent buyer. It is in fact FRAUD; but there you are. Many board members suspected the original advertised one,and I was looking for a good faked nihonto which I thought the shown one was;I was not expecting a blatant con switch. Hi Brian, Yes thanks the sword did arrive by a circuoutus route but turned out to be a con.The sword is a load of rubbish and nnot what I asked of him but there you are; associate in any way with criminals and you will most likely get your fingers burnt,though now you can see why really good forgeries of Nihonton are so difficult to get hold of; Henry

Gentlemen Somebody took it above 96000 yen; I wonder if there was something I missed here??? Henry

Brian Many thanks for the avatar and the explanation of lug nut; Henry

Brian; Yes I take your point it is well made. I am convinced he wouldnt recommend tamashagirae if there was any question of fatal flaw actually through hamon which could lead to catastrophic failure. I do however follow the comments made by members and wont say I'm 100%. However he is the expert in this field,its unfortunate its holiday followed by weekend,though I will phone asap. Sometimes it is possible for hagire to be proclaimed through one side where there is a microscopic piece of good metal at the Ha. He does examine blades very closely indeed and the slightest mark is highlighted,I have one of his blades and he mentions a mark and after several months I'm still looking.I suppose its how the definitioin of Hagire is perceived. You could say its a crack leading from the cutting edge right through the hamon into the softer metal,where the hamon is in effect broken and it is immaterial whether it is a forging fault or as a result of the blade striking something. Its still a serious fault which could lead to the blade shattering the next time it strikes anything.I wonder if that is a universal view widley held. Henry

Gentlemen what please is a lug nut? Henry

Charles L. Sir; It may be that the bidder in question wants the blade for a particular reason,I have heard in my studies along the way that Nobefusa was credited with making a few blades for some notable Military gentlemen. It is I believe held albeit as opinion that he used a steel amalgum he produced himself using Tamahagane as a base substance. I may be remiss in nomenclature but I think its called Orishhagane or something similar and is still in some quarters also refered to as Nihonto alongside traditionally formed Tamhagane. It is also believed that this amalgum unless strictly controlled in production would be produced in less than homogenous quantities and it is thought that this fact alone would lead to serious difficulties in heating to very high temperatures and suddenly quenching in even tepid waters. The forces set up during such a procedure produces strains where dissimilar stratum of variable metals gave way leaving fissures or splits in the metal leaving you with forging faults,many of them not readily visible. I do know Kazushige Tsuruta san as a forthright and very accurate gentleman and very rarely wrong. I do agree with my untraied eye,that I cant see them either. But if he says they are there I would strongly advise you believe what is written.As for Tamishigirae--well? Henry

Gentlemen As a Post-Scriptum-- I retain hard copy of this individuals EBay ad; inluding the description and photos and packing with all labels.and as to the original question which started this thread "Fake or Real"---FAKE. Henry

Gentlemen I now have the weapon and all of the papers concerned in front of me. THIS IS NOT THE SHIRAE. THIS IS NOT THE s WORD ADVERTISED BUT A TOTALLY DIFFERENT ONE, BOTH BLADE AND KOS A POOR COPY OF A Japanese SWORD. The blade is stock bar steel,with an added hamon (not very well at that). Furniture poorly manufactured modern metal composition. The two menuki are stock on with impact adhesive despite having screw holes.They are not genuine anyway. The Tsuba cast brass or gun metal,machine traced, not older than 15 yrs. If you are new to Nihonto I can well see a novice being taken in.There is not much point in going on.Clearly the photo is a "come on" to send your cash, and you get tripe in return. I think Ive cocked the printing up. If you g near this dealer you need your bumps feeling?? Henry

Steve Me neither,however time will tell. My first observation has to be unfortunately it is not Nihonto,so I wait to see where Brian moves the thread? More to come. Henry.

Gentlemen The sword has now arrived finally ,in the hands of a private courier Ive never heard of before; Only problem is Ive never seen anything like it; There will be a pause in proceedings whilst I spend time photographing it. Henry

Gentlemen Guess what,I'm now searching both on NMB and elsewhere for one Daniel Fox,the Australian dealer gentleman who sold me the sword 3 weeks ago, accepted the cash and now seems somewhat shy about answering e-mails. Needless to say, no sword yet,no further contact and according to GPO UK no sign of anything entering the country; I continue but thought should bring the thread up to date 19/12/2008. Henry

Gentlemen Anyone know of the Australian Dealer,or done business. Mr.Daniel Fox. Has used several E-Mail addresses,including 1)Lexxxdan@gmail.com and 2)daniel.fox@uts.edu.au I am having difficulty raising the good man by email, or by anythinig else for that matter;& oblige, Henry

Gentlemen Many thanks to all who offered,I have now got the sword I have been seeking; Henry