Jeremy K Posted January 26 Report Posted January 26 Sorry about the photo quality. I can send more photos, but I have a hunch you can sufficiently determine, from these, that all my “Netsuke” are not of Japanese origin. Makes me sad to know they could have been sourced unethically Quote
Matsunoki Posted January 26 Report Posted January 26 8 minutes ago, Jeremy K said: but I have a hunch Sadly your hunch is correct. It’s a very sad state of affairs which the politicians and law enforcers of the world have all failed to deal with for a variety of reasons…..mostly ignorance or monetary. Quote
Jeremy K Posted January 26 Report Posted January 26 (edited) Thank you for the news; sad and disheartening as it may be. I’ll try to think of how I can use these items in ways that honor the creatures who needlessly suffered so somebody could make a dollar. I’m open to suggestions/ideas. Thank you. Hoping for Peace Edited January 26 by Jeremy K Quote
Matsunoki Posted January 26 Report Posted January 26 1 hour ago, Jeremy K said: I’m open to suggestions/ideas. That depends on what your local ivory laws are. It’s an admirable objective but the law might get in your way☹️ If it is legal to sell them where you are you could just put them in a sale and donate proceeds to a suitable charity. Google should tell you. I join you in your hope! All the best. Quote
Bugyotsuji Posted January 26 Report Posted January 26 Unfortunately I think you are right, Jeremy. Possibly she bought them before the stringent ivory laws were introduced under Obama, but none of them look really old. Quote
Hokke Posted January 26 Report Posted January 26 they look small enough they could be made from elk teeth Quote
Bugyotsuji Posted January 27 Report Posted January 27 9 hours ago, Hokke said: they look small enough they could be made from elk teeth Good point. Although some of them are made of elephant ivory, it is not easy to say what others might be, and I've never come across elk teeth before. Quote
Jeremy K Posted January 27 Report Posted January 27 I think I’ll include them in some art projects I have planned for the near future. While I have no illusions that any artwork I can create could ever be as beautiful as anything created by nature, I believe that the spirit(s) of those beautiful creatures can live on, in a way, in a new form. Thanks to all for your thoughts/ideas/assistance and for sharing your knowledge. Quote
Hokke Posted January 27 Report Posted January 27 2 hours ago, Bugyotsuji said: Good point. Although some of them are made of elephant ivory, it is not easy to say what others might be, and I've never come across elk teeth before. As I understand it, there is no way to distinguish elk tooth ivory from elephant ivory, they are the same composition. Not all elk teeth are ivory, only two per animal, but still a more sustainable source of the material for small things like netsuke. 1 Quote
Bugyotsuji Posted January 27 Report Posted January 27 Smaller, for ojime perhaps? Do they have crisscross schreger lines internally like elephants and mammoth tusks? Learn something new every day! 1 Quote
Hokke Posted January 27 Report Posted January 27 21 minutes ago, Bugyotsuji said: Do they have crisscross schreger lines internally like elephants and mammoth tusks? Learn something new every day! Had to look that one up, great question. Its seems yes, the lines are present in all naturally occurring ivory, however, the angle of the crisscross will vary. Learning something new indeed. 2 Quote
Matsunoki Posted January 27 Report Posted January 27 2 hours ago, Hokke said: but still a more sustainable source of the material for small things like netsuke. …….unless you’re an elk☹️ 1 Quote
PietroParis Posted January 27 Report Posted January 27 I always thought that Schreger lines occur only in elephant and mammmoth ivory. A quck google search doesn’t provide any evidence of the contrary. https://cites.org/sites/default/files/eng/resources/pub/E-Ivory-guide.pdf 1 1 Quote
Hokke Posted January 27 Report Posted January 27 1 hour ago, PietroParis said: I always thought that Schreger lines occur only in elephant and mammmoth ivory. A quck google search doesn’t provide any evidence of the contrary. https://cites.org/sites/default/files/eng/resources/pub/E-Ivory-guide.pdf Ah yes, you may be correct. When I did my initial search I looked only to see if the lines were unique to elephants only, which of course they are not. However, thanks to you and making a deeper dive, looks like you are correct, elephants and mammoth only. 1 Quote
Hokke Posted January 27 Report Posted January 27 8 hours ago, Matsunoki said: …….unless you’re an elk☹️ I agree of course, I dont think ANY animal should be illegally hunted for any one thing, whether it be horn, tooth, tusk or skin. However, since elk have a much shorter lifespan with a much great population, it is far easier to find and harvest their ivory versus that of an elephant. Quote
Bundubeard Posted May 5 Report Posted May 5 (edited) Hi guys, new chap here. Looking for some advice/info please. I found these two figurines in a lot I purchased. I suspect it may be Netsuke, but not sure. No makers mark on it, and I still have to clean them up a bit. It is definately elephant ivory as I have worked with this medium before. Both are in good condition with no broken bits, the ivory does have some light cracks as it tends to pick up with age, but no deep cracks or delamination. Any idea of maker, age and value? Any replies will be hugely appreciated. Edited May 5 by Bundubeard Quote
Lewis B Posted May 5 Report Posted May 5 Definitely not netsuke. Just decorative items. If real ivory they don't appear to have much age based on the lack of patination. 2 Quote
Bundubeard Posted May 5 Report Posted May 5 2 minutes ago, Lewis B said: Definitely not netsuke. Just decorative items. If real ivory they don't appear to have much age based on the lack of patination. Thanks Lewis. 'Patination' cannot be a factor when determining age though, I have upcycled some very old ivory brought back from yellow to a bright white lustre using a buffing compound that is used for shining up paint jobs on cars. Surface layers are quick and easy to remove. Quote
Lewis B Posted May 5 Report Posted May 5 (edited) Nevertheless they are not netsuke nor Japanese in all probability. Edited May 5 by Lewis B 2 Quote
ROKUJURO Posted May 5 Report Posted May 5 37 minutes ago, Bundubeard said: ......I have upcycled some very old ivory brought back from yellow to a bright white lustre using a buffing compound that is used for shining up paint jobs on cars. Surface layers are quick and easy to remove. Jaco, if ever you should happen to pick up something Japanese, please refrain from cleaning, grinding, or polishing! The patina is often a hint to age and value, so NEVER touch it! 5 Quote
Matsunoki Posted May 5 Report Posted May 5 As said above….not netsuke, not Japanese and sad to say that elephants are still being killed to make stuff like this as souvenirs for tourists🤬 1 2 Quote
Matsunoki Posted May 5 Report Posted May 5 Forgot to answer fully…age…likely last 20 years, origin likely africa, value (artistic or monetary) zero. Sorry but these are far worse than even the modern Chinese fakes. 2 Quote
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.