Cuirassier

Hi all I saw this one at auction. The auction has just finished but I would be really interested if anyone could ID the stamps for me (they are surely stamps, not signature / signed characters). Never seen these before. Regards Mark

Hello Matt I think that you are bang on, thank you. I now have another photo from the guy and there is a post 1926 pre 1941 showa stamp just visible through the pitting, which basically is the final nail in the coffin regarding any interest from me. The only "interesting" thing about this sword (apart from it being a composite made up of various army and navy bits) is the first character "Sa" is missing. It is not as well done as other Kanesumi mei's. Again, thanks Mark

Hello Jean Thank you. I can not provide what you ask as I do not have the sword; it is being offered to me. I have it down as a late war gunto, without an arsenal / acceptance mark, and with a badly done signature. I can only turn the images up on their ends. 1st, 2nd and 3rd characters 2nd, 3rd and 4th characters Regards Mark

Hi all Someone has offered me what looks, in some regards to be a gendaito gunto. But it has been messed around with. Also, whenever I have come across 4 character signatures, these have tended to be late war model Showato, oddly / sometimes without any acceptance / arsenal stamp. Anyway, the mei; I believe this is a badly written / inscribed (unknown) Kane Nobu saku (not the famous Kanenobu), but I can not fathom the first character. For me the 3rd character is so badly done, it could be "Sa", but after much reflection I think not. Can anyone help with this terrible "hand writting"? Mark

Thanks guys, yes. Shame it is not Hishu Ju Tadayoshi !!

Hi Guys This one has got me. Normally I get these, but not this one. Hishu Ari?(I thought tada) Yoshi(gone) Or could it be a Hishu Tadayoshi blade? Go on, shoot me down and put me out of my misery on this one Mark

The bits most like a Seki stamp are not stamped in, but stand out. That is a fact. I do not know what mark it is, but it is not a Seki stamp; I have seen plenty enough to know.

Nope, it is not a Seki stamp. I have looked and looked and looked at it. It is more like a kokuin (OK, it is not a kokuin).

Sure, maybe, I can not find anything else anywhere else. Just a weird mark, more raised like a kokuin, then struck like a normal arsenal stamp. Didn't expect it to be gold, just some lesser known marking.

I did, thanks Stephen, but they do not look the same to me, at all.

I am certain not Seki. Gifu?

Hello Stephen, Joe I do not believe it is a misstrike. It looks nothing like any of those in Fuller's and Gregory's book. It is very weird, so say the least.

It is in the right place for an arsenal stamp, but I have never seen one like it. I have been through all my reference books and can not find it anywhere

Thanks;

Thanks Steve Any ideas on the stamp / kokuin? Mark

Hi guys I am struggling on this one. Zanekani Kaneyoshi? It has a kokuin. It a well (not good well) polished blade in early civilian / gunto mounts. Any ideas? Mark

Thanks Koichi. I hate myself. It was staring me in the face all the time and I missed it. It is in Hawleys and John Scott Slough's books. Excuse me. Thanks again, now I must punish myself.

Hi Guys So, I like Guntos, sorry. I have one, clearly Gendaito (so a shinshinto blade) with the smallest and most stylized mei I have ever seen. It is not so much struck, but signed, flowing, and tiny. I believe it is Masahira, but I can find no match to it anywhere. Has anyone ever seen the like before / am I right on my translation / any details on this maker? Regards Mark

:-) Thanks Ron

???? Your purile insults show your stupidity / low IQ and lack of manners (hence I now reciprocate). Repro NCO guntos, their sarute loops normally extend past the pommel cap, duh! I am beginning to hear the yap, yap, yap of little doggies gavering in packs, barking at their own noises. I came here with good intention to point out facts, not simply conjecture and without insulting others. I said "show me one Chinese / Indian seller that has one of these" and not not one has been produced. Since pointing out facts, not inklings, and in order for the pack to be right, all I have received in thanks is baloney and insults. So screw you all; I am gone, out of here. It is very simple, it is easy enough to show I do not know what I am talking about / that I am wrong. Show me ONE Chinese or Indian sub-continent made / sold NCO shin gunto where; 1) The sarute loop correctly rests on the ridge of the pommel cap (does not extend past it) 2) The bohi groove starts close to the habaki (repros start further away) 3) Arsenal markings that conform to those shown in Military Swords of Japan 1868-1945 (note, especially that the blade arsenal marking on repros is often the wrong way up). As the cited eBay NCO gunto conforms to these. So, if it is a repro, you will surely be able to point me / everyone to other examples sold by Indian / Chinese sellers. Until you can, stop the insults, stop the conjecture, and get some lives you amateurs. Sure, I know I am banned, but the fact is the baying pack is wrong. Facts speak louder than BS, and the later is all you have. Screw you. Good riddance. This site may be good for nihonto translation help (and I do appreciate the help I received there), but c**p for everything else. The cited eBay NCO shin gunto is an authentic aluminium hilted Imperial WW2 Japanese item that has varnish or other paint over the hilt, FACT. Anyone that says differently, is a morron; prove me wrong by putting up the URL's to prove your dumb BS. BYE!

True enough, but I like military issued swords Brian

All you have said is your own conjecture in an attempt to prove that you are not wrong. It is your own self-fallacy. What you have said in effect, is that the Chinese reproducers have mastered the aspect of the sarute loop size, the stamping shapes / sizes / types, and where the bohi starts in relation to the habaki, without providing one URL leading to an example of this. And you say the way now to judge fake vs authentic is how straight / smooth the bohi is and some miraculous way steel was somehow stamped without distorting the metal arround it by the Japanese - sorry, but when you strike steel and push it away (as you do with a stamp, it has to go somewhere!). In fact, the original Japanese bohi were cut with human powered cutting tools, and thus are prone to distortion. While the Chinese repros are cut with powered tools and are more likely to be very smooth. You are, with respect, clutching at straws to sustain your own untenable position. I have a lot of experience with these swords. I like issued swords that were used. Not just Japanese; in fact, my favorite swords are French and English Napoleonic swrds. But I do like NCO shin guntos, and also, to a lesser degree, pre-1944 officer guntos. In 15 years I suspect I have handled several repros (which I knew to be repros), perhaps fifty or more authentic NCO guntos, and have owned two early copper hilt examples. Andf whether you like it or not, you are wrong! The cited eBay NCO gunto is authentic, just not an early copper hilted example. Again, it is easy enough to show I do not know what I am talking about, show me ONE Chinese or Indian sub-continent made / sold NCO shin gunto where; 1) The sarute loop correctly rests on the ridge of the pommel cap (does not extend past it) 2) The bohi groove starts close to the habaki (repros start further away) 3) Arsenal markings that conform to those shown in Military Swords of Japan 1868-1945 (note, especially that the blade arsenal marking on repros is often the wrong way up). As the cited eBay NCO gunto conforms to these. So, if it is a repro, you will surely be able to point me / everyone to other examples sold by Indian / Chinese sellers. Until you can, you are trying to teach me how to suck eggs.

1) It is not brass and does not claim to be. It is not the same colour as the cited ebay NCO gunto. 2) It is just the tsuka / handle, not the whole sword. And the fuchi looks like an officer's; nothing like the fuchi on the NCO gunto. It has absolutely no connection proof / argument wise with the NCO gunto. !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Take the steel (not iron) fittings and coat them with varnish and you get what? As I pointed out before, the menuki bolt head is clearly of steel which has been varnished / painted over. It is too light to be brass; you can see it is varnished / painted steel. It is an authentic aluminium (with some steel fittings such as the menuki bolt) hilted NCO gunto that has veen varnished / painted over to try and make it look like an earlier copper hilted gunto. As for the paint on the saya; I did not examine it because paint is superficial and proves nothing, so he may have painted the saya (after all, he varnished / painted the tuska). Again, everyone is so keen to be right. Post the URL of any Chinese / Indian sub-continent seller item that conforms to the three tests I set out. Go on, I bet you can't

Someone with some knowledge. But look how to some the serial numbers are wrong, but to others the serial number are right! You say it may be a mix / composite of authentic and repro parts (not very likely....). So, it is either authentic or repro. OK, I am always ready to be corrected. You say these made an appearance on eBay some time ago. Show me one URL that takes me to one of these repros please.